Organ Donation Week 2017 - should families have the final say on donation?

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Poll: Who should have the final say even if the patient is a registered donor?
Patient - go along with their wishes (14)
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Family - they should always have the last say (0)
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Rum Ham
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Hey guys it's Organ Donation Week 2017 and the purpose of this week is to raise awareness on the subject, debunk myths and also generate discussion.

Today's topic is, do you think families should have the final and ultimate say on whether their loved ones organs are donated or should the donors wishes be upheld no matter what the family say?

In my opinion, if the patient didn't ever make their wishes about organ donation clear before death then yes, the decision lies solely with the family but if the patient signed the register and made their feelings known then the family shouldn't be able to overrule that. I thought the patient had the ultimate choice if they had signed the register in life. It wasn't until my own loved one had two transplant offers fall through because family wouldn't consent that I found out out this could happen.

What are your thoughts?
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999tigger
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Patients body and their wishes. If they didnt ahve any wishes then its a case of whether we would have an opt out system.

Rum Ham Is the kitty eating yet?
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Rum Ham
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(Original post by 999tigger)
Patients body and their wishes. If they didnt ahve any wishes then its a case of whether we would have an opt out system.

Rum Ham Is the kitty eating yet?
Happy to report she's back to her normal hungry hippo self

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Tiger Rag
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I think if the patient hasn't made their wishes clear, the family should have the final say. If the patient has made their wishes clear, it should be their choice.
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Rum Ham
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(Original post by Tiger Rag)
I think if the patient hasn't made their wishes clear, the family should have the final say. If the patient has made their wishes clear, it should be their choice.
100% agree with you :yep:

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shadowdweller
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I think as long as the person has made their decision clear either way, the family shouldn't have a say in what happens.

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claireestelle
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Family shouldn't get to override a patient's decision, wales has an opt out system so it's really clear if you don't want to do it
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Dheorl
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I haven't registered on any organ donor list and I'd be incredibly upset if I found out my family had given them away anyway. So you can guess which way I voted.

Equally of course I think it should go the other way too, if the person said yes I don't see what right the family has to say no. They have no lawful ownership of said body or the organs contained within.
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USRaphael
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(Original post by Dheorl)
I haven't registered on any organ donor list and I'd be incredibly upset if I found out my family had given them away anyway.
Well yeah, because you would obviously need them so badly.
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Dheorl
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(Original post by USRaphael)
Well yeah, because you would obviously need them so badly.
I just don't want my organs in someone else's body. Equally I wouldn't accept an organ donation, so don't really see a problem with it.
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Picnic1
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(Original post by Dheorl)
I just don't want my organs in someone else's body. Equally I wouldn't accept an organ donation, so don't really see a problem with it.

'I'd be incredibly upset if I found out my family had given them away anyway'

You do realise this is only about after death donations from people who signed a organ donation form?

No-one's suggesting it'd be OK for your family to give your organs away if you
hadn't signed an organ donor form. (Since we have an organ donor form system in place, rather than an organ donation opt out form),

No matter which way you vote on the pool, you wouldn't be incredibly upset and you wouldn't 'find out' for the simple fact that you wouldn't be alive to be upset.

Unless you're looking from heaven of course.

Or are you speculating that someone might whip a kidney from you whilst you
weren't looking?
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Dheorl
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(Original post by Picnic1)
'I'd be incredibly upset if I found out my family had given them away anyway'

You do realise this is only about after death donations from people who signed a organ donation form?

No-one's suggesting it'd be OK for your family to give your organs away if you
hadn't signed an organ donor form. (Since we have an organ donor form system in place, rather than an organ donation opt out form),

No matter which way you vote on the pool, you wouldn't be incredibly upset and you wouldn't 'find out' for the simple fact that you wouldn't be alive to be upset.

Unless you're looking from heaven of course.

Or are you speculating that someone might whip a kidney from you whilst you
weren't looking?
I was merely stating that I wouldn't like it to happen to me with the option I've selected, so I could see why people would equally not like the opposite to happen. I'm sorry this made you feel the need to go on such a rant.
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Picnic1
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(Original post by Dheorl)
I was merely stating that I wouldn't like it to happen to me with the option I've selected, so I could see why people would equally not like the opposite to happen. I'm sorry this made you feel the need to go on such a rant.
Yes,ok. It was a bit of a rant.

I think the question itself could be read two different ways and you've chosen one and I've chosen another.

I assumed that when the question said 'should families have the final say on donation?' it was only meaning should the family be continue to be allowed, as is the current legal position, to decline to donate the deceased's organs even if the deceased had filled in an organ donor card.

(Chances are, this legal position is allowed because it would seem undignifified, and attract bad publicity, and take up time and cause upset, if families accused the government of being body snatchers and if families routinely claimed that someone wasn't necessarily in 100% mental health to consent to give organs. Also, there must be no
possibility in the slightest that a patient's life is even a fraction of a percentage less likely to be saved if they are due to be a guaranteed donor to the NHS. A 'silver lining' of donation is not a silver lining at all in terms of the NHS's duty of care to that patient),

Whereas you've thought that the question was partly asking, in effect, if there was a change in
the law where a family might be legally allowed to donate a deceased person's
organs without their consent, would that be OK?

Perhaps the question setter could clarify what they meant.
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Dheorl
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(Original post by Picnic1)
Yes,ok. It was a bit of a rant.

I think the question itself could be read two different ways and you've chosen one and I've chosen another.

I assumed that when the question said 'should families have the final say on donation?' it was only meaning should the family be continue to be allowed, as is the current legal position, to decline to donate the deceased's organs even if the deceased had filled in an organ donor card.

(Chances are, this legal position is allowed because it would seem undignifified, and attract bad publicity, and take up time and cause upset, if families accused the government of being body snatchers and if families routinely claimed that someone wasn't necessarily in 100% mental health to consent to give organs. Also, there must be no
possibility in the slightest that a patient's life is even a fraction of a percentage less likely to be saved if they are due to be a guaranteed donor to the NHS. A 'silver lining' of donation is not a silver lining at all in terms of the NHS's duty of care to that patient),

Whereas you've thought that the question was partly asking, in effect, if there was a change in
the law where a family might be legally allowed to donate a deceased person's
organs without their consent, would that be OK?

Perhaps the question setter could clarify what they meant.
No, I assumed the question meant what you did. As, however, I don't want my organs donated I can't give an exact answer as to what my response would be. I can however, give what my response would be for the equivalent but opposite situation, and therefore feel empathy with the category mentioned in the OP.
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Picnic1
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(Original post by Dheorl)
No, I assumed the question meant what you did. As, however, I don't want my organs donated I can't give an exact answer as to what my response would be. I can however, give what my response would be for the equivalent but opposite situation, and therefore feel empathy with the category mentioned in the OP.
I justwish you'd admit that saying
"I'd be incredibly upset if I found out my family had given them away anyway" was wrong.

a) You couldn't be 'upset' or find out as you'd be dead. If you'd put 'If I knew now that my family were going to give away my organs without my consent I'd be upset'.
b) Your family couldn't give them aaway without your consent anyway so why are you implying that it would be possible for your family to do so based on the options in the questions?
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Dheorl
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(Original post by Picnic1)
I justwish you'd admit that saying
"I'd be incredibly upset if I found out my family had given them away anyway" was wrong.

a) You couldn't be 'upset' or find out as you'd be dead. If you'd put 'If I knew now that my family were going to give away my organs without my consent I'd be upset'.
b) Your family couldn't give them aaway without your consent anyway so why are you implying that it would be possible for your family to do so based on the options in the questions?
I really don't get why you're taking such issue with what I wrote, but hey ho, your problem, not mine.

I stand by what I wrote for a variety of reasons. I don't consider any of it wrong or out of context for the thread.
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TheSpicyTriangle
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(Original post by Dheorl)
I just don't want my organs in someone else's body. Equally I wouldn't accept an organ donation, so don't really see a problem with it.
You wouldn’t accept a donation even if you were going to die?
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