Debate: Should schools have gender-neutral bathrooms for transgender students? Watch

AperfectBalance
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#121
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(Original post by Tiger Rag)
Since when did they have to? Most places have more than one toilet.
People sometimes have to line up to wait for a toilet, not always but sometimes. This is due to most places having a sufficent amount of toilets adding transgender people to the list of people that use disabled toilets will hardly mean that there are 100's of people waiting in line for the disabled toilet, I would even be suprised if people noticed any more waiting for using a disabled toilet
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Saoirse:3
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(Original post by Ljubljana)
So we need more toilets for all these freaks? Just pick one or use the disabled toilet. It's probably where they belong
"Just pick one" is hard when politicians, particularly over in the states, are trying to ban people from using the toilet they find appropriate, which is what brought attention to this whole thing in the first place and led to more gender-neutral bathrooms being suggested as an option.

(Original post by AperfectBalance)
But this is not what we are talking about, those genetic defects are abnormalities, this is not saying that someone who has XXY or some other defect does not have those chromosomes just that if you have XY you are male and XX you are female .
Ljubljana said there is no third chromosome combination, which is just plain false. There are many, many ways in which you can be biologically neither male nor female in the typical sense. It's also possible to have XY chromosomes and to naturally appear outwardly as a girl or vice-versa, to the extent that sometimes people don't realise they're intersex until they try to have kids and find out they're infertile. XY = Male and XX = Female is a huge oversimplification.
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SmileyFaces1/
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I think they should have somewhere to go that is gender neutral, but most schools are underfunded and spending money on another bathroom facility maybe isnt necessary if there is a disabled toilet which is multi-sex anyway.
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Ljubljana
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(Original post by Saoirse:3)
"Just pick one" is hard when politicians, particularly over in the states, are trying to ban people from using the toilet they find appropriate, which is what brought attention to this whole thing in the first place and led to more gender-neutral bathrooms being suggested as an option.



Ljubljana said there is no third chromosome combination, which is just plain false. There are many, many ways in which you can be biologically neither male nor female in the typical sense. It's also possible to have XY chromosomes and to naturally appear outwardly as a girl or vice-versa, to the extent that sometimes people don't realise they're intersex until they try to have kids and find out they're infertile. XY = Male and XX = Female is a huge oversimplification.
Tbh though I would find it concerning if a man walked into the women's toilets, especially if there are young girls using them. If you are a man, use the men's toilets. I think that closes this matter.
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Saoirse:3
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(Original post by Ljubljana)
Tbh though I would find it concerning if a man walked into the women's toilets, especially if there are young girls using them. If you are a man, use the men's toilets. I think that closes this matter.
It really doesn't, since a lot of men don't have XY chromosomes and a lot of people with XY chromosomes aren't men - and that's purely on 100% accepted biology before you even consider the idea of non-binary or trans people. It's pretty much impossible to find a 100% applicable definition of a 'man' or 'woman' - it's all to do with perceptions which are inherently subjective.
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AperfectBalance
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(Original post by Saoirse:3)
"Just pick one" is hard when politicians, particularly over in the states, are trying to ban people from using the toilet they find appropriate, which is what brought attention to this whole thing in the first place and led to more gender-neutral bathrooms being suggested as an option.



Ljubljana said there is no third chromosome combination, which is just plain false. There are many, many ways in which you can be biologically neither male nor female in the typical sense. It's also possible to have XY chromosomes and to naturally appear outwardly as a girl or vice-versa, to the extent that sometimes people don't realise they're intersex until they try to have kids and find out they're infertile. XY = Male and XX = Female is a huge oversimplification.
Then they are incorrect, but lots of people like to use the "Some people have abnormalities" argument to try and disprove the XY argument. Ok then those people are rather rare and should not really be thought of when we design toilets as we already have a disabled toilet that they can use if they want.

It is not a oversimplification it is a logical conclusion that an overwhelming majority of people with XX are Female and XY Male.

It would be like me trying to disprove white privilege by talking about albinoism in Africa
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username2981082
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#127
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It is sad to see that there is still so much hate towards transgender people.
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Saoirse:3
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(Original post by AperfectBalance)
Then they are incorrect, but lots of people like to use the "Some people have abnormalities" argument to try and disprove the XY argument. Ok then those people are rather rare and should not really be thought of when we design toilets as we already have a disabled toilet that they can use if they want.

It is not a oversimplification it is a logical conclusion that an overwhelming majority of people with XX are Female and XY Male.

It would be like me trying to disprove white privilege by talking about albinoism in Africa
Again, not that simple - you normally need to be registered disabled to use a disabled facility and being intersex doesn't count as a disability.

If people don't want gender neutral toilets then that's fine, but you have to accept the consequences of that - not everyone in the gendered toilets is going to match your definition of that gender. And honestly, if people had been allowed to use whatever bathroom seemed appropriate without hassle, none of this would be such an issue in the first place.
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AperfectBalance
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(Original post by Saoirse:3)
Again, not that simple - you normally need to be registered disabled to use a disabled facility and being intersex doesn't count as a disability.

If people don't want gender neutral toilets then that's fine, but you have to accept the consequences of that - not everyone in the gendered toilets is going to match your definition of that gender. And honestly, if people had been allowed to use whatever bathroom seemed appropriate without hassle, none of this would be such an issue in the first place.
Prove me wrong but I think most places with disabled toilets just let anyone go in, I remember when I was on crutches with a cast it was very handy to use them, I know a few have radar keys but I dont really see many places with this system, but prove me wrong if you have other information as I seriously dont know.

If so then add a clause or something to say that trans people are allowed to use these toilets, I seriously see no problem with this as it solves pretty much all of the problems with minimal effort
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MonoMikey
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Based on gender views... The toilets should remain 'male' and 'female' as even though some people are gender neutral... A girl would not feel comfortable in a toilet whilst another guy is doing his business in the cubicle next to hers... This is a question of privacy not people's opinions.
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AperfectBalance
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(Original post by constantine2016)
It is sad to see that there is still so much hate towards transgender people.
It is sad to see that you classify a difference of opinion as "hate". I can disagree with whatever you want to think you are and I can do this peacefully, I dont support violence or actual harrasment of these people.

I want to help these people and to stop the madness that is the current climate around gender and sex, it is becoming insanity
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username2406123
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(Original post by HelloMrMagpie)
My school has one gender neutral bathroom but the rest are normal bathrooms.
Yea right. I'm sure they didn't add a facility. I've seen gender neutral bathrooms but they've only put signs on existing female and male bathrooms saying "anyone who identifies can use this facility." I've never seen a third bathroom created...
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HelloMrMagpie
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(Original post by Salt Queen)
Yea right. I'm sure they didn't add a facility. I've seen gender neutral bathrooms but they've only put signs on existing female and male bathrooms saying "anyone who identifies can use this facility." I've never seen a third bathroom created...
They were building a new block anyway and when they built it they just put gender neutral bathrooms in instead of gender specific bathrooms.
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Magdatrix >_<
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I think the easiest way would be to relabel "disabled" toilet as "accessible" toilet - it's then there for anyone who, for whatever reason, can't use the gendered ones.
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username2406123
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(Original post by HelloMrMagpie)
They were building a new block anyway and when they built it they just put gender neutral bathrooms in instead of gender specific bathrooms.
😕 yea right. They can't do that.
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username2981082
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(Original post by AperfectBalance)
It is sad to see that you classify a difference of opinion as "hate". I can disagree with whatever you want to think you are and I can do this peacefully, I dont support violence or actual harrasment of these people.

I want to help these people and to stop the madness that is the current climate around gender and sex, it is becoming insanity
I'm directing this to the users who were calling transgender people 'freaks' and just blatantly insulting them. There is a difference between disagreeing with transgenderism and using ad-hoc attacks against them.

Also, I'm not transgender. I just believe people have a right to vocalise their identity without being attacked for it.
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AngryJellyfish
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(Original post by Salt Queen)
😕 yea right. They can't do that.
...why not?
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username2406123
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(Original post by AngryJellyfish)
...why not?
Are you saying they can? It's depriving anyone in that block of their rights, they're being forced to use a toilet with someone of a different sex whether they want to or not with no other option .
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HelloMrMagpie
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(Original post by Salt Queen)
😕 yea right. They can't do that.
Not sure what to say to that. They did. Soooo...
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AngryJellyfish
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(Original post by Salt Queen)
Are you saying they can?
:ottid:

(Original post by HelloMrMagpie)
Not sure what to say to that. They did. Soooo...
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