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    This generation is getting softer and more spoilt. TBH most people are confusing disciplining with actual child abuse. There's a difference between the two.
    (Original post by King Leonidas)
    Snowflake generation never fails to disappoint.
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    (Original post by Salt Queen)
    Anyway I don't agree with child abuse. Why is this an argument. How can you look yourself in the mirror after hurting a child? Do you not know how to raise your voice or explain and be stern?? Or ignore a bratty child? You continue disgusting ancient "culture" arbitrarily when it clearly doesn't even work?? Humanity has issues.
    How do you know it "clearly doesn't work" in my opinion it does work in some cases but you can't just say it clearly doesn't work without doing the proper research. It worked for me. You're confusing actual child abuse with disciplining when a child actually does something wrong. Ignoring a bratty child (I'm talking about if you're the parent and your child is the bratty one - if they're not your child and you don't know them then I don't agree with it) wouldn't be such a good thing, i surely wouldn't want my child to be bratty and spoilt.
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    (Original post by AngelStarfire)
    How do you know it "clearly doesn't work" in my opinion it does work in some cases but you can't just say it clearly doesn't work without doing the proper research. It worked for me. You're confusing actual child abuse with disciplining when a child actually does something wrong. Ignoring a bratty child (I'm talking about if you're the parent and your child is the bratty one - if they're not your child and you don't know them then I don't agree with it) wouldn't be such a good thing, i surely wouldn't want my child to be bratty and spoilt.
    And I surely wouldn't want my child to be bruised, scared, hurt and sad and still unclear on what they did wrong because they got spanked instead of talked to by a decent person. And it doesn't work. Who here including you has been smacked once and fixed up as a perfect child and never got smacked again???? It doesn't work and people need to stop damaging their kids teaching them violence when they get a little annoyed. :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Guru Jason)
    That's like saying boxing and martial arts are abusive. It isn't if you have a valid reason.
    Hmmm, bit different. Still abuse in my eyes.
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    (Original post by itsfantanoo)
    That's not the outcome that comes out of smacking. It teaches the child that the reason they got the smack is because they did something wrong, therefore they fear doing something wrong.
    No, it teaches them to fear doing the outcome of doing something wrong. Any parent even close to be worth their salt will make the child understand WHY what they did was wrong.

    (Original post by Trapz99)
    I disagree with it, parents should be able to discipline their children using reasonable physical force such as slapping. It's a time-tested traditional way of enforcing control over the child.
    I'm fairly sure whacking kids in classrooms with rulers was one considered time-tested. Wanna bring that back?
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    (Original post by AngelStarfire)
    This generation is getting softer and more spoilt. TBH most people are confusing disciplining with actual child abuse. There's a difference between the two.
    So not wanting children to get hit by their parents is us being spoilt? Smacking a child is abuse, I really could not give a damn how justified you feel or how much discipline you think it's imposing. Learn to discipline without raising your grown adult hands to a child.
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    Smacking children is frankly a terrible way to discipline them. It doesn't teach them why what they did was wrong, or help them to develop a sense of accountability for their behaviour. All it does is tell them that upsetting someone in a position of power over them will result in pain, which isn't a healthy mindset for anyone to have, let alone a child. While I wonder how the Scottish government/police force actually plan to enforce this law, I hope it causes parents to scrutinise their own actions and to think of more constructive ways to discipline their kids.
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      (Original post by Ninja Squirrel)
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...itics-41678797


      Smacking children is to be banned in Scotland, the Scottish government has confirmed. The move would make the country the first part of the UK to outlaw the physical punishment of children.

      Ministers had previously said they did not support parents using physical chastisement, but had "no plans" to bring forward legislation of their own. But the government has now confirmed it will ensure a bill lodged by Green MSP John Finnie will become law. And it is understood that ministers will work with Mr Finnie to implement the bill in practice.

      His proposals, which were out for consultation over the summer, would give children the same legal protection as adults. At present, parents in Scotland can claim a defence of "justifiable assault" when punishing their child - although the use of an "implement" in any punishment is banned, as is shaking or striking a child on the head.




      I've never agreed with smacking your child so this is great news and I hope the rest of the UK follows.
      I'm replying to your thread having not read any of the replies.

      Today I was pleased to hear this subject on the national news.

      Assaulting another adult is what it is and can involve the Police and potential prosecution.

      Assaulting a child?
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      (Original post by VinnicombeDmv)
      I'd bet money that everyone here agrees that discipline is beneficial to the development of all children. The disagreement comes when some people utterly fail to realise that disciplie can be taught WITHOUT violence.



      Have you ever been in a car crash? Perhaps not, but I'd bet you agree that car crashed are horrible. We don't need to have been smacked as children to understand that it's terrible parenting.



      Boxers and martial artists choose to enter the arena knowing they are likely to get hit. Entirely different scenario.



      Right, so you're NOT going to tell me when it's okay for an adult to hurt a child, gotcha. Sure, plenty of people turn out OK when they experienced certain things when they were younger, but that makes absolutely no difference as to whether that thing is justified. I know someone who was raped, but they never let it tear them down and they never call themselves a victim, but a survivor. Just because you can overcome something, doesn't mean that thing is OK.



      If you don't hit hard enough, then the pain won't be sufficient to discourage them from repeating their actions. If the pain is enough to cause the child to cry, then I consider that abuse. Children shouldn't fear their parents.



      Then appeal to their selfishness to discourage them. Don't wanna lose your favourite toy for a week? Then don't hit Timmy again.
      You sound like a barbarian; also how does a car crash equate to child beating? Asian and African parents tend to do it and it leads to their children fearing them and hiding things from them.
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      (Original post by Salt Queen)
      And I surely wouldn't want my child to be bruised, scared, hurt and sad and still unclear on what they did wrong because they got spanked instead of talked to by a decent person. And it doesn't work. Who here including you has been smacked once and fixed up as a perfect child and never got smacked again???? It doesn't work and people need to stop damaging their kids teaching them violence when they get a little annoyed. :rolleyes:
      Waiting for someone to mention what you said. First off what your describing is clearly child abuse different from what I'm talking about 😙. What I'm talking about is (not too sure with other parents but my parents and others do) when disciplining they tell you what you did wrong so in the future it'll act as a deter so the child won't do something wrong. I have to agree I didn't like being smacked but as I grew up it acted as a deter for example i now know that I shouldn't have lied and stolen something that wasn't mine, because i now know it's wrong and I'll be punished and taught that I shouldn't do it again. As I grow up I don't get smacked anymore because I know what I shouldn't do and how to speak respectfully to my parents.
      Second who said anything about a perfect child? Because I'm sure I didn't. If it worked for me and other people I'm sure it can work for at least some people. I'm not sure what you're talking about with the teaching violence because all I was taught was what was wrong to do and how to handle a situation. My parents talked to me and told me what I did wrong so I wouldn't do it again. If you do some actually research and see that there's a clear line between disciplining and child abuse then you'll be able to understand at least my views. I have friends who are brought up well and their parents don't hit them so I can kinda see where you're coming from. All I gotta say is I talked for too long, so I hope you at least understood even just a little of where I'm coming from 😄
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      (Original post by GradeA*UnderA)
      You sound like a barbarian; also how does a car crash equate to child beating? Asian and African parents tend to do it and it leads to their children fearing them and hiding things from them.
      Woah! How do I sound like a barbarian?

      Regard the car crash bit, I wasn't directly equating it to child beating. The person I quoted implied that everyone here defending the Scottish change was only doing so because we must have been beaten as children. I wanted to illustrate that people can defend something without having to have experience it, with empathy. You don't have to have been in a car crash to recognise how horrible they are, nor do you have to have been beaten as a child to understand that it's horrible.
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      (Original post by VinnicombeDmv)
      Woah! How do I sound like a barbarian?

      Regard the car crash bit, I wasn't directly equating it to child beating. The person I quoted implied that everyone here defending the Scottish change was only doing so because we must have been beaten as children. I wanted to illustrate that people can defend something without having to have experience it, with empathy. You don't have to have been in a car crash to recognise how horrible they are, nor do you have to have been beaten as a child to understand that it's horrible.
      Okay?
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      (Original post by GradeA*UnderA)
      Okay?
      You asked why, I answered. Anyway, how did I come across as a barbarian to you?
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      (Original post by VinnicombeDmv)
      You asked why, I answered. Anyway, how did I come across as a barbarian to you?
      Sorry, I misread your post as justifying child beating, because it was hurdled in with other posts :/.

      Just gonna crawl away now
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      (Original post by VinnicombeDmv)
      I don't call people abusive just for disagreeing with me; I call them abusive for thinking smacking a child is OK.

      Go on, tell me when EXACTLY is it okay to lay your adult hands on a child, rather than trying to make them understand what they did was wrong in a reasonable manner. Go on, tell me when it's OK to hurt a child as an adult.
      So you treat children as being smart enough to be able to learn from their mistakes "in a reasonable manner" and yet you think they're dumb enough to become permanently traumatised because of some light smacking.

      Seriously, your argument is based on supposed moral high ground and logical inconsistency.
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      (Original post by itsfantanoo)
      So you treat children as being smart enough to be able to learn from their mistakes "in a reasonable manner" and yet you think they're dumb enough to become permanently traumatised because of some light smacking.

      Seriously, your argument is based on supposed moral high ground and logical inconsistency.
      Even when the child is too young to understand a reasonable argument about their wrongdoing, you can still punish them without raising your hand to them. And I'm fairly certain emotional trauma isn't as simple as "You're dumb so you get emotional trauma, but that smart boy over there, he's too clever to get mentally scarred". Are you for real?
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      (Original post by VinnicombeDmv)
      Even when the child is too young to understand a reasonable argument about their wrongdoing, you can still punish them without raising your hand to them. And I'm fairly certain emotional trauma isn't as simple as "You're dumb so you get emotional trauma, but that smart boy over there, he's too clever to get mentally scarred". Are you for real?
      By that logic the punishment is futile. It won't do anything. And who are you to determine what sort of punishment will cause trauma? Putting a child alone in a room can be equally as traumatic as light slaps.

      No, i'm saying that the SAME child who can learn in a reasonable manner what they did wrong can BY YOUR LOGIC be traumatised and react irrationally to smacking. It's inconsistent.
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      (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
      Why oh why am I not aloud to smack some sense into you.
      (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
      Why oh why am I not aloud to smack some sense into you.
      Because my idea of chastisement has been used throughout human history and is proven to work.
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      (Original post by itsfantanoo)
      By that logic the punishment is futile. It won't do anything. And who are you to determine what sort of punishment will cause trauma? Putting a child alone in a room can be equally as traumatic as light slaps.

      No, i'm saying that the SAME child who can learn in a reasonable manner what they did wrong can BY YOUR LOGIC be traumatised and react irrationally to smacking. It's inconsistent.
      How is it futile? The argument for smacking seems to be to appeal to the child's fear. Try appealing to their selfishness or enjoyment or other activities instead. I'm not qualified to determine trauma, but I don't think I need a qualification to realise the difference between a child raised with love and a child raised with an open palm.

      Perhaps I'm misunderstanding you, but are you suggesting that if a child can understand reason then they shouldn't be able to be traumatised? Because I certainly am saying that the same child could be traumatised. Adults can be traumatised, far less than children, but I don't think you'd question their capacity to see reason.
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      My mum says she regretted hitting me as a child. She said that parents who hit their children do so because they have no control over their children.
      I still remember parts of my childhood being terrified of my dad and him chasing me to hit me and having a huge palm print on my thigh for hours. I even got repetitive nightmares about him, but my dad was basically beaten as a child.

      Funnily enough, I can't remember ever doing anything so bad to justify being hit and I think I was actually a very good child growing up. Sometimes saying something or a word with a funny tone or attitude would result being hit and that makes me think that they were taking their frustration out on me.

      There are ways to discipline and teach children without physical violence (Nanny 911 for example) but parents seem to find that it's too time consuming or too much hassle, when really, the time invested is worth it because you have a better relationship, the child's behaviour tends to improve and they don't grow up thinking that hitting is okay!

      I saw the news about this and it said they are trying to make children equal to adults and physical assault on an adult is illegal so it should be on children. I think it makes sense and it may make parents consider alternatives to hitting.
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