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Bath suffers 'very significant' drop in student applications watch

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    (Original post by Doonesbury)
    How do EU student take places from UK students?

    EU students have to repay their loan, same as home students. The default rate for EU students is no higher than UK students.
    Im not talking about default rates.

    There is funding available for x amount of students, if a place goes to a EU student, that means a UK student looses out.

    Unlike Health care, EU nationals home country doesnt pay for it.

    Also alot of students will never earn enough to pay the loan back, which is fine if your a UK student as youve lived here your entire life. Your parents paid tax, you will pay income tax, VAT

    But seems unfair to give the same deal to someone who will only be in the UK for 3 years.
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    (Original post by hannah00)
    Im not talking about default rates.

    There is funding available for x amount of students, if a place goes to a EU student, that means a UK student looses out.

    Unlike Health care, EU nationals home country doesnt pay for it.

    Also alot of students will never earn enough to pay the loan back, which is fine if your a UK student as youve lived here your entire life. Your parents paid tax, you will pay income tax, VAT

    But seems unfair to give the same deal to someone who will only be in the UK for 3 years.
    > There is funding available for x amount of students,

    Therefore I assume you could link an article about student (x + n) who didn't get financing because the government ran out of money?
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    (Original post by LandoNorrisWDC)
    > There is funding available for x amount of students,

    Therefore I assume you could link an article about student (x + n) who didn't get financing because the government ran out of money?
    sure https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/sho....php?t=2448959

    EU students are in direct competition for places with Home Students. Unlike International Students who have a separate quota.
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    (Original post by hannah00)
    sure https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/sho....php?t=2448959

    EU students are in direct competition for places with Home Students. Unlike International Students who have a separate quota.
    Would appreciate it if you could expound on how a TSR adding game has a bearing on student financing?
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    (Original post by LandoNorrisWDC)
    > better

    By what metric?

    > more established

    By what metric?

    I'll concede that I'm not immune to my own biases (I hold an offer from Bath) but nonetheless, I would be interested to hear why you have reached this verdict.
    Well I cant speak for everyone. But I am considering a career in investment banking and unis like bristol and nottingham have larger alumnis and better numbers from what I can see.

    And Bath has fairly high grade requirements, and these other unis simply have a more recognisable name which is, to a lot of ppl, a big factor when applying to prestigious unis.

    There's no metrics apart from personal observation. It's not necessarily that bath has shortfalls itself, rather other unis seem better.
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    (Original post by hannah00)
    There is funding available for x amount of students, if a place goes to a EU student, that means a UK student looses out.
    No there's no funding cap, except for medicine (and that's an NHS cap not SFE).

    And how many EU students actually come to the UK for their first degree? As a proportion of the total student body? Answer, less than 10%. Also, compared to home students EU borrowers are much more likely to repay in full.
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    I think the reason is that not many want to get a degree from a place called bath....
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    (Original post by nashh606)
    Well I cant speak for everyone. But I am considering a career in investment banking and unis like bristol and nottingham have larger alumnis and better numbers from what I can see.

    And Bath has fairly high grade requirements, and these other unis simply have a more recognisable name which is, to a lot of ppl, a big factor when applying to prestigious unis.

    There's no metrics apart from personal observation. It's not necessarily that bath has shortfalls itself, rather other unis seem better.
    Fair enough - seems like you've made a reasoned decision. I'm not particuarly familiar with the banking sector so I can only assume you are correctly informed.
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    (Original post by verier)
    I think the reason is that not many want to get a degree from a place called bath....
    Did they change their name this year?
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    (Original post by LandoNorrisWDC)
    Would appreciate it if you could expound on how a TSR adding game has a bearing on student financing?
    it not a adding game, frankly i dont feel like educating you on public policy

    (Original post by Doonesbury)
    No there's no funding cap, except for medicine (and that's an NHS cap not SFE).

    And how many EU students actually come to the UK for their first degree? As a proportion of the total student body? Answer, less than 10%. Also, compared to home students EU borrowers are much more likely to repay in full.
    Who pays for the funding ? the UK tax payer.
    10% is still alot, more likely sure, but still not certain. Once you include VAT and Income Tax paid by someone who spends his adult life working in the UK, the difference is immense.
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    (Original post by PQ)
    Don't forget that Bath is comparing itself with universities that have med schools - so will have early applications from thousands of wannabe medics alongside their oxbridge applicants.

    tbh I'd be dubious of any admissions head reporting at this level of detail at this point in the cycle - it smacks of not understanding how admissions stats work and getting in a panic over UCASs crappy freebee reports.
    What an obnoxious and arrogant thing for you to say. Pretty sure that people who work in university admissions have a cause for concern and will have insider knowledge on trends of the industry and the university itself.

    All of the excuses used above to try and explain why Bath has suffered a drop in applications are not plausible.

    • Bath is comparing its applications to how they were at the same time one year ago, all this nonsense about Oxbridge/Medic deadline is irrelevant.
    • Bath has not moved its world ranking position compared to the previous year. It remains in the same 251-300 bracket in THE rankings. For 2016 and 2017, it was ranked 159th, it's dropped one place to 160 in the 2018 QS rankings.
    • Bath specialises in STEM subjects and these subjects are seeing an increase in demand over the past few years.

    (Original post by hannah00)
    Im not talking about default rates.

    There is funding available for x amount of students, if a place goes to a EU student, that means a UK student looses out.

    Unlike Health care, EU nationals home country doesnt pay for it.

    Also alot of students will never earn enough to pay the loan back, which is fine if your a UK student as youve lived here your entire life. Your parents paid tax, you will pay income tax, VAT

    But seems unfair to give the same deal to someone who will only be in the UK for 3 years.
    Please do not spread lies. There is no cap.

    The cap exists for EU students applying to Scottish universities but not for English and Welsh courses (with the exception of Medicine).
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    (Original post by LandoNorrisWDC)
    Fair enough - seems like you've made a reasoned decision. I'm not particuarly familiar with the banking sector so I can only assume you are correctly informed.
    Bath still attracts a lot of banks on par with Notts and bristol so it would be wrong to say that it's worse than the other two.
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    (Original post by LandoNorrisWDC)
    Fair enough - seems like you've made a reasoned decision. I'm not particuarly familiar with the banking sector so I can only assume you are correctly informed.
    The biggest issue is that we only have 5 options; 1/2 ambitious, 2/3 realistic and 1/2 safe and for many I suspected Bath is kinda the 6th option
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    I’d actually be inclined to study at Bath but I feel like it has higher entry requirements for mid ranked courses and considering I wish to study something academic I feel Bath isn’t on par with Nottingham, my first choice for the degree I wish to undertake. It’s also quite far out against other universities and people wanting a social experience would rather apply to Cardiff or Bristol. Bath has some merits like their mathematics department and engineering but everything else doesn’t do so well.
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    (Original post by hannah00)
    Who pays for the funding ? the UK tax payer.
    10% is still alot, more likely sure, but still not certain. Once you include VAT and Income Tax paid by someone who spends his adult life working in the UK, the difference is immense.
    Remind me about your funding cap/quota. Where's your source for that? Your link is faulty, unless you think this is a game...

    And actually I was wrong about the 10%. Sorry.

    There's 1.4 million students doing a full-time first degree in the UK of which 77,195 are from the EU.
    That's 5%.
    https://www.hesa.ac.uk/news/12-01-20...qualifications

    Also EU students can't get a SFE maintenance loan so their living & accommodation costs are a direct benefit to the economy. That's approx £1 billion straight into the economy right there. Every year.
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    At this stage in the Admissions cycle that means nothing. All they can go off is the Oxbridge deadline numbers and that wont give them any indication of overall application numbers.

    And btw - quantity has nothing to do with quality, ie. less applications could simply be that those without the right grades are not applying.
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    (Original post by C_Richards99)
    Pretty sure that people who work in university admissions
    Like PQ.
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    (Original post by nashh606)
    As someone applying to unis this year, I was considering Bath. However there were simply better, more established unis out there that required the same grades.
    Bath was established as an independent university at roughly the same time as Warwick and its history goes back almost a hundred years before that. Do you challenge Warwick as not being established long enough?

    I'd have thought Bath was to be applauded for ensuring its students are at a decent minimum standard (which must be better for its students), rather than joining in the current dive to the bottom.
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    (Original post by C_Richards99)
    What an obnoxious and arrogant thing for you to say. Pretty sure that people who work in university admissions have a cause for concern and will have insider knowledge on trends of the industry and the university itself.

    All of the excuses used above to try and explain why Bath has suffered a drop in applications are not plausible.

    • Bath is comparing its applications to how they were at the same time one year ago, all this nonsense about Oxbridge/Medic deadline is irrelevant.
    • Bath has not moved its world ranking position compared to the previous year. It remains in the same 251-300 bracket in THE rankings. For 2016 and 2017, it was ranked 159th, it's dropped one place to 160 in the 2018 QS rankings.
    • Bath specialises in STEM subjects and these subjects are seeing an increase in demand over the past few years.
    I'll look forward to seeing PQ's response to you from her perspective inside university admissions, but I'll make a point on each of your bullets:

    1. It is relevant. If the medical applications are level and Bath is not exposed to them (as is the case) it might explain why Bath's applications might be down at the same stage (with a disproportionate exposure to non-medical subjects).

    2. What does historical world ranking have to do with current year applications?

    3. If the figures are to be believed, not at Bath. Hence the discussion.
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    (Original post by Doonesbury)
    Like PQ.
    (Original post by Good bloke)
    I'll look forward to seeing PQ's response to you from her perspective inside university admissions, but I'll make a point on each of your bullets:

    1. It is relevant. If the medical applications are level and Bath is not exposed to them (as is the case) it might explain why Bath's applications might be down at the same stage (with a disproportionate exposure to non-medical subjects).

    2. What does historical world ranking have to do with current year applications?

    3. If the figures are to be believed, not at Bath. Hence the discussion.
    Yes, but do they work for Bath University's admission department? Every university is not the same.

    I am countering the excuses previous posters have used to explain why Bath is seeing a fall in applications.

    1. so what's changed since last year? all non-medical subjects seeing a decline in applications?
    2. it's the excuse used by people to explain the 15-20% drop in International applications. My point is that there has been no change in Bath's world ranking so this has not been a factor causing international applications to not apply.
    3. 'if the figures are to be believed', yes an internal admissions email which was leaked has reason to be false.
 
 
 
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