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Does wearing a poppy glorify war? watch

  • View Poll Results: Will you wear a poppy for remembrance day?
    Definitely, it shows respect
    733
    43.94%
    Yes, it's expected of me
    150
    8.99%
    No, I remember in other ways
    503
    30.16%
    No, it glorifies war
    282
    16.91%

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    Anyone protesting poppies or wearing the dreadfully offensive “white poppies” should remember that if we didn’t fight the Second World War, they’d probably be in a concentration camp for holding their socialist/pacifist/anarchist views.
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    (Original post by EllieCeeJay)
    I would rather we didn't have an army at all. I know it's not possible, but it's my personal belief. I take advantage of the freedoms I have as a result of the previous world wars and I try to consider ALL sacrifices made, not just ones that came as a result of our armed forces. There were many people that died on our soil helping our cause too - where's their two minutes silence? Where's the two minutes silence for holocaust victims, and victims of the Russian regime in the 1900's?

    If armies were abolished, across the globe (wishful thinking, I know), the scenario wouldn't happen again. But for every second we have nuclear weapons, and an army, and an air force, and a navy, we are both protecting and dooming our country. I will never condone the armed forces, and I will never consider them to be something we need.

    Everyone is entitled to their own opinion on this matter. Just because I live in this society that we have and I don't wear a poppy doesn't mean that I don't acknowledge sacrifices that people have made. It just means that I have a certain belief system that means that I don't wear a poppy
    Sometimes, you read a post - or several, from someone so stupid, you can't quite believe they're being serious.
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    Can we please bring out a law that states all libtards and religious extremists need to board a ship departing in a month's time to, I don't know, Russia? There's enough room. They can spend their days going on, and on about how terribly evil Britain was, and how they'd really rather Hitler have won and going on bouts of periodic outrage each time something new crossed their exploding minds - until of course, they came begging to come back with poppies raining out of their arses saying how sorry they were and we'd say

    Sorry, no, but enjoy Russia.

    Can you imagine what a glorious day that would be?

    Sigh.
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    (Original post by emilyjc17)
    Sometimes, you read a post - or several, from someone so stupid, you can't quite believe they're being serious.
    It just seems like you're talking to yourself. Just seems a bit weird you're debating with someone called Ellie Cee Jay as Emily JC.



    On topic - This is an annual event, isn't it? As surely as we have Remembrance Sunday and Armistice Day, we will have the annual TSR poppy baiting.
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    (Original post by Trinculo)
    It just seems like you're talking to yourself. Just seems a bit weird you're debating with someone called Ellie Cee Jay as Emily JC.



    On topic - This is an annual event, isn't it? As surely as we have Remembrance Sunday and Armistice Day, we will have the annual TSR poppy baiting.

    It is weird - never the less I am a real, distinct person who huuuuugely disagrees with Ellie to the point where I can't quite begin to debate.
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    So, Hitler should have won then?

    We should have let them kill more Jewish men, women, and children?

    We should not have fought back?

    You'd rather be under a fascist regime right now?

    Are you really - I mean are you truly so insanely, blind-sightedly, libtard to not see that without all those many thousands of fallen soldiers, the country we live in today would be so vastly, painfully, nightmarishly ruined?

    And many others?

    Don't you get it? Nobody glorifies war. Nobody says BRILLIANT LETS HAVE A WAR. The reality is, we are not living in a Disney film.

    We live on planet earth.

    People fight. Animals fight. You think us resolving not to fight back means nobody else will?

    Wrong.

    People will take over, destroy, and corrupt

    Unless someone fights back.

    We fought back against evil - we had to - that was the only thing we COULD HAVE DONE.

    The level of disgust I feel for people of this mindset, I can't even begin.
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    (Original post by emilyjc17)
    So, Hitler should have won then?

    We should have let them kill more Jewish men, women, and children?

    We should not have fought back?

    You'd rather be under a fascist regime right now?

    Are you really - I mean are you truly so insanely, blind-sightedly, libtard to not see that without all those many thousands of fallen soldiers, the country we live in today would be so vastly, painfully, nightmarishly ruined?

    And many others?

    Don't you get it? Nobody glorifies war. Nobody says BRILLIANT LETS HAVE A WAR. The reality is, we are not living in a Disney film.

    We live on planet earth.

    People fight. Animals fight. You think us resolving not to fight back means nobody else will?

    Wrong.

    People will take over, destroy, and corrupt

    Unless someone fights back.

    We fought back against evil - we had to - that was the only thing we COULD HAVE DONE.

    The level of disgust I feel for people of this mindset, I can't even begin.
    I get the feeling you quoted the wrong person
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    I get the feeling you quoted the wrong person
    Just edited.
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    (Original post by emilyjc17)
    Just edited.
    By the way, hows your application for the Armed Forces going?
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    By the way, hows your application for the Armed Forces going?
    By the way, why are you speaking English not German?
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    (Original post by emilyjc17)
    By the way, why are you speaking English not German?
    English. But that's because I am English and like all other English people, I've cultivated a strong talent for not learning foreign languages.



    Your unnecessary need to pick a fight with everyone rather undermines your message and, if anything, gives more arguments to the very people you're trying to shout down.

    You're a spectacularly bad spokesperson for the point of view you allege to represent.

    You also make every person who has served in the armed forces deeply ashamed.
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    English. But that's because I am English and like all other English people, I've cultivated a strong talent for not learning foreign languages.



    Your unnecessary need to pick a fight with everyone rather undermines your message and, if anything, gives more arguments to the very people you're trying to shout down.

    You're a spectacularly bad spokesperson for the point of view you allege to represent.

    You also make every person who has served in the armed forces deeply ashamed.
    Pick a fight with everyone? Not quite. I agree with many, many posters on this thread.

    I don't care for the people who want to shut down those who wear poppies - and there are many, many of them around these days.

    I care for soldiers who died for the freedoms we have now - and the way people are so ready to forget.

    If you feel that way - it's up to you, but I have my views and I'm entitled to them.
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    (Original post by emilyjc17)
    ^ To every single libtard on this thread.

    So, Hitler should have won then?

    We should have let them kill more Jewish men, women, and children?

    We should not have fought back?

    You'd rather be under a fascist regime right now?

    Are you really - I mean are you truly so insanely, blind-sightedly, libtard to not see that without all those many thousands of fallen soldiers, the country we live in today would be so vastly, painfully, nightmarishly ruined?

    And many others?

    Don't you get it? Nobody glorifies war. Nobody says BRILLIANT LETS HAVE A WAR. The reality is, we are not living in a Disney film.

    We live on planet earth.

    People fight. Animals fight. You think us resolving not to fight back means nobody else will?

    Wrong.

    People will take over, destroy, and corrupt

    Unless someone fights back.

    We fought back against evil - we had to - that was the only thing we COULD HAVE DONE.

    The level of disgust I feel for people of this mindset, I can't even begin.
    It's different opinions. I'm not saying that I wanted the fascist side to win the war. I've also said that I know the army has a significant, needed place in this society. But I am a pacifist, and I don't want to directly support our armed forces. What I want for the world - complete peace - is probably never going to happen. And I understand that. However, I will not give money to our army. I did donate to the British Legion appeal, but I will not be wearing my poppy, because of my political views.

    I don't agree with everyone on this thread, but that doesn't mean I don't respect and try to understand their views. I understand why you may feel what you do, but I don't think that gives you the right to call anyone a name that is diminutive from an incredibly offensive word used to abuse mentally disabled people. If you would like to clarify your views a little bit more, so I can understand more from them, that would be very much appreciated.

    The level of disgust I feel for people that don't bother to read everything you say and just assume you're a Nazi supporter because you're against the actions of the armed forces, I can't even begin either

    (Also yeah - thankfully we're not the same person. Fortunately, though, I can see past the end of my nose long enough to be able to enter into a debate - however one-sided it may be.)
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    (Original post by EllieCeeJay)
    It's different opinions. I'm not saying that I wanted the fascist side to win the war. I've also said that I know the army has a significant, needed place in this society. But I am a pacifist, and I don't want to directly support our armed forces. What I want for the world - complete peace - is probably never going to happen. And I understand that. However, I will not give money to our army. I did donate to the British Legion appeal, but I will not be wearing my poppy, because of my political views.

    I don't agree with everyone on this thread, but that doesn't mean I don't respect and try to understand their views. I understand why you may feel what you do, but I don't think that gives you the right to call anyone a name that is diminutive from an incredibly offensive word used to abuse mentally disabled people. If you would like to clarify your views a little bit more, so I can understand more from them, that would be very much appreciated.

    The level of disgust I feel for people that don't bother to read everything you say and just assume you're a Nazi supporter because you're against the actions of the armed forces, I can't even begin either

    (Also yeah - thankfully we're not the same person. Fortunately, though, I can see past the end of my nose long enough to be able to enter into a debate - however one-sided it may be.)

    But what you're saying makes zero sense.
    You agree the army has a significant place in society - and that you're glad the Nazis did not take over - but you don't want to wear a poppy, because - because, war is bad?

    But you're glad we won that war...

    So you're in some way, grateful, no?

    Grateful to the many that died, for the lives we live, - now...

    Grateful they fought back, no?

    That's the pure and honest meaning of the poppy.

    Complete peace will never, ever happen. To wish for it is to bury your head in the sand. Look at the history of humankind. Have a look at our core characteristics. There will never not be war - it's an impossibility on a global scale. You'd have to lobotomise the entire population at large. The only alternatives are to be submissive, and let others take over. If that's the path you choose to take, the bury-your-head-in-sand-and-cower technique, so be it.
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    I actually feel so sorry for kids growing up nowadays. Must be like having a political choke-hold around your neck. You go to speak and only rhetoric comes out. Like robots. Filled up with shite before they're old enough to know what it means.

    You know what it reminds me of?

    Religion.
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    (Original post by emilyjc17)
    But what you're saying makes zero sense.
    You agree the army has a significant place in society - and that you're glad the Nazis did not take over - but you don't want to wear a poppy, because - because, war is bad?

    But you're glad we won that war...

    So you're in some way, grateful, no?

    Grateful to the many that died, for the lives we live, - now...

    Grateful they fought back, no?

    That's the pure and honest meaning of the poppy.

    Complete peace will never, ever happen. To wish for it is to bury your head in the sand. Look at the history of humankind. Have a look at our core characteristics. There will never not be war - it's an impossibility on a global scale. You'd have to lobotomise the entire population at large. The only alternatives are to be submissive, and let others take over. If that's the path you choose to take, the bury-your-head-in-sand-and-cower technique, so be it.

    Also, the offended brigade are back on parole over the word libtard.
    Ah the outrage cycle. Must be truly exhausting.
    My cousin has Downs Syndrome - so, yes, I am offended, and I have right to be. I would rather you didn't use that word, not because of PC, but because it's offensive to him and to others who actually suffer from mental disability.

    I can wish for what I want, I never said it was feasible. I used to wish I was a flying unicorn, but that never came true. At least I'm working towards what I believe in, you're just screaming words at a webpage.

    I'm a history student, I study history, I'm interested in war. I think that a large part of war is just not learning from history's mistakes, which is why I actively support the idea of Remembrance Day. Note I say 'idea'. To me, a lot of people forget what it is about, they call our current military 'heroes' when really they aren't. It's a statement forced on us by peer pressure, not through choice. The red poppy used to be a sign of peace, but I feel like nowadays it's only really political, and we're shamed into wearing it for the fear of not seeming respectful. Honestly, it's a piece of paper. I donated money. Even if I don't necessarily like where it may go, I'm happy to give money towards the cause.

    I am grateful. I will not wear a poppy. It goes against my personal beliefs. I am allowed to be grateful for sacrifices made, but I'm allowed to also not want to support our military, or want to glorify war in any way. Even if you personally don't see how a poppy can glorify war, I ask you to watch the news tomorrow, and see how many people refer to our current armed forces, or war veterans from wars that weren't conscripted, as 'heroes'. To me, they are not 'heroes'. They made a choice. A choice to murder people, innocent or not.

    I'll also mention a previous point I made - why do we only remember soldiers? Why not people that died back here, on the Home Front? Why don't we remember every schoolchild blown up in Aleppo? The German soldiers who were forced to fight by a police state, and are now forever branded as 'fascists'.? The red poppy is too much of a British symbol for me. When I remember, I will remember everyone who has ever died as a result of war. Every soldier, every woman, every child, every animal.

    (Also, I'm an atheist, ex-Christian and against organised religion, sooooooooooooo)
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    (Original post by BlinkyBill)
    Ahead of Remembrance Day on 11 November, there have been reports that a third of young people will refuse to wear a poppy as 'it glorifies war'.

    Do you agree? Will you be wearing a poppy?
    Absolutely ridiculous, people shouldn’t be forced to wear one but it definitely doesn’t glorify war.

    If anything it remind people how horrific war was and the level of sacrifice millions of people have made with their life.
    Posted on the TSR App. Download from Apple or Google Play
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    (Original post by EllieCeeJay)
    My cousin has Downs Syndrome - so, yes, I am offended, and I have right to be. I would rather you didn't use that word, not because of PC, but because it's offensive to him and to others who actually suffer from mental disability.

    I can wish for what I want, I never said it was feasible. I used to wish I was a flying unicorn, but that never came true. At least I'm working towards what I believe in, you're just screaming words at a webpage.

    I'm a history student, I study history, I'm interested in war. I think that a large part of war is just not learning from history's mistakes, which is why I actively support the idea of Remembrance Day. Note I say 'idea'. To me, a lot of people forget what it is about, they call our current military 'heroes' when really they aren't. It's a statement forced on us by peer pressure, not through choice. The red poppy used to be a sign of peace, but I feel like nowadays it's only really political, and we're shamed into wearing it for the fear of not seeming respectful. Honestly, it's a piece of paper. I donated money. Even if I don't necessarily like where it may go, I'm happy to give money towards the cause.

    I am grateful. I will not wear a poppy. It goes against my personal beliefs. I am allowed to be grateful for sacrifices made, but I'm allowed to also not want to support our military, or want to glorify war in any way. Even if you personally don't see how a poppy can glorify war, I ask you to watch the news tomorrow, and see how many people refer to our current armed forces, or war veterans from wars that weren't conscripted, as 'heroes'. To me, they are not 'heroes'. They made a choice. A choice to murder people, innocent or not.

    I'll also mention a previous point I made - why do we only remember soldiers? Why not people that died back here, on the Home Front? Why don't we remember every schoolchild blown up in Aleppo? The German soldiers who were forced to fight by a police state, and are now forever branded as 'fascists'.? The red poppy is too much of a British symbol for me. When I remember, I will remember everyone who has ever died as a result of war. Every soldier, every woman, every child, every animal.

    (Also, I'm an atheist, ex-Christian and against organised religion, sooooooooooooo)
    You're coming from a dreamy place, but not a real one. There's no use in that - no realism. It's hard to debate/argue with fantasy. Which is what this is. You're calling people murderers for protecting their country - something you are grateful for. It's hypocritical.

    If war was on your doorstep, your family, your future, your life was threatened - you'd fight back.

    And for the record, anyone currently fighting ISIS - anywhere in the world, whether they be Kurdish, American or British - is a Hero.
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    (Original post by emilyjc17)
    You're coming from a dreamy place, but not a real one. There's no use in that - no realism. It's hard to debate/argue with fantasy. Which is what this is. You're calling people murderers for protecting their country - something you are grateful for. It's hypocritical.

    If war was on your doorstep, your family, your future, your life was threatened - you'd fight back.

    And for the record, anyone currently fighting ISIS - anywhere in the world, whether they be Kurdish, American or British - is a Hero.
    I don't know how you keep missing the point where I keep saying that I accept and understand that world peace is unrealistic. What I want isn't what we can get, I'm not stupid enough to think it's entirely possible, but I do want to attempt to strive towards it and encourage others to do the same.

    There are always alternatives to killing people. I would never kill another human being. Maybe it is hypocritical, but from discussing this at length with many people, I've realised that yes, I am grateful, but I don't support it. There's no way I can't be grateful for it, many of my freedoms have come out of it. But I just don't support it. I don't support war, I don't support murder. And I will call people in the army murderers because they are to me. They kill people, guilty or not. Being in a group of people that encourage that doesn't change that fact. And like I said - there are always alternatives. Even if you think you can justify the deaths of people fighting against them, you can't justify it for all the civilians that are killed in wars.

    I don't see them as heroes. They kill people. They are murderers to me, and they always will be. I'm entitled to my own opinion with that.
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    (Original post by EllieCeeJay)
    I probably won't be wearing one - I donated money to the cause (about £5 - so more than the cost of a poppy) but I don't want to wear one. For one thing, I don't think we need to wear one to show respect, and I choose to show respect in other ways, such as actually caring all year around, not just on the one day.

    I also don't agree with the concept of just remembering British soldiers, as seems to be the norm - if I'm going to participate then I choose to remember everyone who has ever died in a way, whether they be on our side or not. I feel like wearing a poppy is too much of a British thing (which makes little sense, but hear me out). When we're confronted with atrocity, I think it's more important to remember that more than our own soldiers have died. Civilians die too, in the crossfire. We have blown countless Syrian families up.

    So no, I won't be wearing a poppy, and I feel a bit dubious about giving money to the British Legion, even though I do to help the charity. That money does go to the army, in some form, and I don't want to be funding them at all. I may support those who have fallen, but I will never support our current army and the work they do. It's murder, pure and simple, whoever's on the other end of the gun.
    👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
 
 
 
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