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    (Original post by Drummond)
    Excuse me while i correct this, but...

    God split the water at the Red sea and then again at the Jordan.

    Jesus resurrected Himself and Lazarus was resurrected.

    Moses was resurrected.

    Enoch and Elijah were both translated, so they never even experienced death.
    Those things are as real as unicorns.

    And when have they been reproduced?
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    Those things are as real as unicorns.

    And when have they been reproduced?
    A horse with horn on its head is unreal? But then someone who believes in diplodocus's and tyrannosauras rex's stomping around the world is of a sane mine?

    I'm not accusing you of believing in dinosaurs mate but there are people out there who actually really do believe in this stuff. What difference is there with a man who believes in dinosaurs to a child who believes in santa claus? Are not dinosaurs the santa claus for some adults?
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    (Original post by Drummond)
    A horse with horn on its head is unreal? But then someone who believes in diplodocus's and tyrannosauras rex's stomping around the world is of a sane mine?

    I'm not accusing you of believing in dinosaurs mate but there are people out there who actually really do believe in this stuff. What difference is there with a man who believes in dinosaurs to a child who believes in santa claus? Are not dinosaurs the santa claus for some adults?
    You believe in magic.

    But don't accept skeletal remains as evidence and equate dinosaurs to santa?

    I take it you full well chose the santa example because you know religious people often get compared to still believing in santa.

    It's a poor trolling attempt.
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    Those things are as real as unicorns.

    And when have they been reproduced?
    And when have they been reproduced?

    I've just shown you the reproductions, read what i wrote again.

    Unless of course witness testimony is now worthless and everyone is innocent?

    Just because you and i were not there, doesn't mean it didn't happen.
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    You believe in magic.

    But don't accept skeletal remains as evidence and equate dinosaurs to santa?

    I take it you full well chose the santa example because you know religious people often get compared to still believing in santa.

    It's a poor trolling attempt.
    Praise God i'm not religious then, wouldn't want to be compared to people who still believe in Santa. But compared to a child? I'll take that, we're all children in God's eyes, that is, with Him as our Father.
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    (Original post by Drummond)
    And when have they been reproduced?

    I've just shown you the reproductions, read what i wrote again.

    Unless of course witness testimony is now worthless and everyone is innocent?

    Just because you and i were not there, doesn't mean it didn't happen.
    No, you've shown me the stories. There haven't been any reproductions of anything magical in the Bible.

    And generally in court you need witnesses, yes, but alive ones. Stop trying to waste my time by writing nonsense meant for distraction.

    Just because it's written in a book doesn't mean it did happen.

    So yes, the person believing in things that defy the laws of nature and have never been witnessed, only written, is insane. Almost by definition. Your only saving grace is that it is a socially accepted insnsity.
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    (Original post by Drummond)
    Praise God i'm not religious then, wouldn't want to be compared to people who still believe in Santa. But compared to a child? I'll take that, we're all children in God's eyes, that is, with Him as our Father.
    So you're just a troll?
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    No, you've shown me the stories. There haven't been any reproductions of anything magical in the Bible.

    And generally in court you need witnesses, yes, but alive ones. Stop trying to waste my time by writing nonsense meant for distraction.

    Just because it's written in a book doesn't mean it did happen.

    So yes, the person believing in things that defy the laws of nature and have never been witnessed, only written, is insane. Almost by definition. Your only saving grace is that it is a socially accepted insnsity.
    And here you come out from behind your wall.....

    ''Your only saving grace is that it is a socially accepted insnsity''

    Are you aware of a time when it shall not be socially accepted insanity? Seems you understand a little about bible prophesy too, saving grace means i do not die for saying what i do, right?
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    (Original post by Drummond)
    And here you come out from behind your wall.....

    ''Your only saving grace is that it is a socially accepted insnsity''

    Are you aware of a time when it shall not be socially accepted insanity? Seems you understand a little about bible prophesy too, saving grace means i do not die for saying what i do, right?
    I've said that in an earlier post quite some time ago. Keep up.
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    I thought her final word was "Oops."
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    I've said that in an earlier post quite some time ago. Keep up.
    Look, i can't take the veil from before your eyes, only God can do that. I can only try and show you by planting the seed, its God that gives the increase. I am guessing you are not in 'the final word of God' thread to mock right? So i am assuming you are curious to know if there is a God and the promise of eternal life right?

    Have you ever considered getting down on your knees before the living God and asking Him if He is there? It would take twenty seconds of your life and nobody would need to see. It would be between God and you. Why not ask for him to reveal Himself to you in some way? Twenty seconds of your life mate.

    I don't want to strive and debate with you when we both have different spirits in us. I just ask you to reflect and consider what i am saying. Don't shoot the messenger, ask the King of kings for yourself, He's there you know.
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    (Original post by Drummond)
    Look, i can't take the veil from before your eyes, only God can do that. I can only try and show you by planting the seed, its God that gives the increase. I am guessing you are not in 'the final word of God' thread to mock right? So i am assuming you are curious to know if there is a God and the promise of eternal life right?

    Have you ever considered getting down on your knees before the living God and asking Him if He is there? It would take twenty seconds of your life and nobody would need to see. It would be between God and you. Why not ask for him to reveal Himself to you in some way? Twenty seconds of your life mate.

    I don't want to strive and debate with you when we both have different spirits in us. I just ask you to reflect and consider what i am saying. Don't shoot the messenger, ask the King of kings for yourself, He's there you know.
    You're not the messenger though. You're the message, the story writer.

    And of course I have tried that. As I said I follow the evidence. If god revealed himself I would have no trouble believing, knowing even.

    But your entire structure is laid out to avoid questioning. And everything is "you need faith and then..."
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    You're not the messenger though. You're the message, the story writer.

    And of course I have tried that. As I said I follow the evidence. If god revealed himself I would have no trouble believing, knowing even.

    But your entire structure is laid out to avoid questioning. And everything is "you need faith and then..."
    Nobody knows what are the true intentions of each of our hearts, apart from our self and God. Of course we want to see signs, but we become more blessed by believing without seeing the signs. Because we have available to us something that those which have gone before Christ did not have. We have God's very own Spirit in us which enables us to navigate and discern through this massively deceptive world.

    If the intention of your heart is to want to know the truth of this world at all costs, i believe that will put you on the path to God.

    However if the intention of your heart is to suppress the truth from others because you feel you have understanding of it, i believe that you are not with God and are on a path i can not bare to imagine.

    If you are just curious and see yourself as a decent and regular guy, then i say, just be patient there is a reason that you are considering God at this time and keep talking with him. Tell Him what you are thinking, how you are feeling, build the relationship with communication. He might surprise you by showing you one of those signs which you are seeking.
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    Honey, preach all you want. Statistics show the richer and the more educated we become, the less believe in the fairytale you are spinning. And that is good to know, humanity might have a future after all.
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    And yet I’m not badly off and exceptionally well educated.....
    (Original post by yudothis)
    Honey, preach all you want. Statistics show the richer and the more educated we become, the less believe in the fairytale you are spinning. And that is good to know, humanity might have a future after all.
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    (Original post by Racoon)
    It can seem complex can't it? All I can say is I keep my faith very simple.

    CS Lewis wrote in Mere Christianity:- “The world does not consist of 100 percent Christians and 100 percent non-Christians. There are people (a great many of them) who are slowly ceasing to be Christians but who still call themselves by that name: some of them are clergymen. There are other people who are slowly becoming Christians though they do not yet call themselves so”

    I spoke to a Hindu woman who was visiting someone in hospital and for some reason she told me about how her family had adopted a child with many disabilities from India. She said 'I believe in one god but with many faces'.

    Speaking with her, I feltshe was doing what Jesus tells us to do, to love one another, to prefer someone else's needs to our own. Perhaps she's in that "There are other people who are slowly becoming Christians though they do not yet call themselves so” bit.

    Hinduism seems to gives freedom to approach God in your own way, a multiplicity of paths, not asking for conformity to just one. I look to the word of God which says

    For God so loved the world
    That he gave His only begotten son
    That whosoever believes in Him
    May have everlasting life
    For God didn’t send his son into the world to condemn the world
    But that the world
    Through Him
    Might be saved

    Being a disciple of Christ brings us straight to the throne of God Hebrews 7:27 (ESV) 27 He has no need, like those high priests, to offer sacrifices daily, first for his own sins and then for those of the people, since he did this once for all when he offered up himself With salvation being a free gift
    Ephesians 2:8–9 (ESV) 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

    Not all roads lead to God. There are many roads and different paths in our spiritual journey, God says few take the right one, the narrow one

    Matthew 7:13-14 (ESV) 13 “Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. 14 For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few

    I'm not sure if this fully answers your question but I hope it gives you some further insight. God bless
    Thank you for your greatly detailed and insightful answer Racoon. It sure did answer my questions . Thank you
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    (Original post by Dhanny)
    Thank you for your greatly detailed and insightful answer Racoon. It sure did answer my questions . Thank you
    No probs
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    (Original post by Sammylou40)
    And yet I’m not badly off and exceptionally well educated.....

    That made me laugh
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    (Original post by Racoon)
    That made me laugh
    Me, reading her comment in your reply. This isn't maths where one counter example is enough. Look at the data. It's been show all over the world all through history. The richer and more educated a society is, the less it believes in God.
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    Me, reading her comment in your reply. This isn't maths where one counter example is enough. Look at the data. It's been show all over the world all through history. The richer and more educated a society is, the less it believes in God.
    As with all research, results vary according to the questions posed and the groups selected to do the research (having done some temp work for a market research company I know this to be true).

    I've heard this argument many times before but delving further into this, (and I know you won't other to read this but I've done it for my own satisfaction ) it appears that this type of study has been done over a long number of years, 60+ years, and sample sizes varied from 20 to more that 1,000 people.

    From what I can see negative relationship between intelligence and religiosity was only present in 35 out of the 63 studies, a couple of the studies showed a significant positive relationship between intelligence and religiosity, while the rest showed no relation at all therefore no substantial disparities.

    But at the end of the day it really doesn't matter for Christians. We're talking about heart change. We don't have to go round defending our intelligence because God's love is for the educated and the uneducated.

    The most important fact is that God is there for the loved, unloved, the millionaire, the penniless and, one of the most important things in finding God is being humble. A trait you will never find in an atheist, although you will get a glimpse in an agnostic and that glint is the doubt in their mind which says 'possibly I just don't know'.

    And just because you're a Christian doesn't mean life is easy or happy or good all the time. In fact you are bound to face more challenges and more struggles but God is with you, that's the difference. Life isn't all happy clappy. Although sometimes it is.
 
 
 
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