The Guardian view on cryptocurrencies: blockchain of fools
Scroll to see replies
Original post by paul514
Don’t be a speculator if you don’t want to risk it.
Don’t be a speculator if you don’t want to risk it.
Agreed. But there are some things I think should not be speculated with. And currency is one of them. It does my head in that housing should be an investment for example. People just need a home.
Original post by ByEeek
Agreed. But there are some things I think should not be speculated with. And currency is one of them. It does my head in that housing should be an investment for example. People just need a home.
Yea but this is a competitor currency and of people want to speculate on its value in a technological sense then it’s no different than trading some shares.
I agree less ‘investments’ should be about speculation and more about solid things, be it a house or a block of wood.
I think some of the biggest misconceptions about bitcoin and cryptocurrencies is that they're trying to replace fiat currency, it's only good for criminals and that it's trying to take the power away from governments and banks. All of which isn't true.
When Satoshi created bitcoin their vision was to create a decentralised alternative currency which wasn't dependant on banks or governments. However as time goes on I think people are starting to realise that you'll never be able to buy your shopping from Tesco or buy clothes from next with bitcoin, that just isn't realistic because it's too volatile.
Fiat is controlled by the government and they dictate it's price, yes the exchange rate changes daily but generally speaking £100 will buy you the same amount of goods as £100 in 6 months time. As demonstrated with bitcoin the price can change by hundreds of percent in the same amount of time which makes it a terrible form of currency.
However as a store of value, bitcoin works very well. Like gold and other precious metals, there is a limited supply and it requires work in order to mine it which gives it value if enough people agree on the fundamental principle that bitcoin has some value based on total supply x work. People store their wealth in gold, which besides it's small use cases is just a shiny piece of metal which enough people have deemed is worth some value.
As the bitcoin market cap increases into the trillions, it will become less and less volatile because it takes more and more money just to move it even 1%. Gold is relatively stable but compared to fiat gold is notoriously volatile.
Bitcoin can and will give people a digital, decentralised asset in which they can store their wealth which as it stands only bitcoin offers. People can remain in denial all they want and try to tell themselves it's just a fad but the global market cap for cryptocurrency is $310billion with bitcoin holding $168billion of the total, second behind is ethereum with $45billion.
Gold was a great way to store wealth in the 1900s but now we're in the 2000s where new digital opportunities are being created. We are witnessing economic change on a global scale, just give it another 25 years and you'll see.
When Satoshi created bitcoin their vision was to create a decentralised alternative currency which wasn't dependant on banks or governments. However as time goes on I think people are starting to realise that you'll never be able to buy your shopping from Tesco or buy clothes from next with bitcoin, that just isn't realistic because it's too volatile.
Fiat is controlled by the government and they dictate it's price, yes the exchange rate changes daily but generally speaking £100 will buy you the same amount of goods as £100 in 6 months time. As demonstrated with bitcoin the price can change by hundreds of percent in the same amount of time which makes it a terrible form of currency.
However as a store of value, bitcoin works very well. Like gold and other precious metals, there is a limited supply and it requires work in order to mine it which gives it value if enough people agree on the fundamental principle that bitcoin has some value based on total supply x work. People store their wealth in gold, which besides it's small use cases is just a shiny piece of metal which enough people have deemed is worth some value.
As the bitcoin market cap increases into the trillions, it will become less and less volatile because it takes more and more money just to move it even 1%. Gold is relatively stable but compared to fiat gold is notoriously volatile.
Bitcoin can and will give people a digital, decentralised asset in which they can store their wealth which as it stands only bitcoin offers. People can remain in denial all they want and try to tell themselves it's just a fad but the global market cap for cryptocurrency is $310billion with bitcoin holding $168billion of the total, second behind is ethereum with $45billion.
Gold was a great way to store wealth in the 1900s but now we're in the 2000s where new digital opportunities are being created. We are witnessing economic change on a global scale, just give it another 25 years and you'll see.
Original post by Ninja Squirrel
I think some of the biggest misconceptions about bitcoin and cryptocurrencies is that they're trying to replace fiat currency, it's only good for criminals and that it's trying to take the power away from governments and banks. All of which isn't true.
When Satoshi created bitcoin their vision was to create a decentralised alternative currency which wasn't dependant on banks or governments. However as time goes on I think people are starting to realise that you'll never be able to buy your shopping from Tesco or buy clothes from next with bitcoin, that just isn't realistic because it's too volatile.
Fiat is controlled by the government and they dictate it's price, yes the exchange rate changes daily but generally speaking £100 will buy you the same amount of goods as £100 in 6 months time. As demonstrated with bitcoin the price can change by hundreds of percent in the same amount of time which makes it a terrible form of currency.
However as a store of value, bitcoin works very well. Like gold and other precious metals, there is a limited supply and it requires work in order to mine it which gives it value if enough people agree on the fundamental principle that bitcoin has some value based on total supply x work. People store their wealth in gold, which besides it's small use cases is just a shiny piece of metal which enough people have deemed is worth some value.
As the bitcoin market cap increases into the trillions, it will become less and less volatile because it takes more and more money just to move it even 1%. Gold is relatively stable but compared to fiat gold is notoriously volatile.
Bitcoin can and will give people a digital, decentralised asset in which they can store their wealth which as it stands only bitcoin offers. People can remain in denial all they want and try to tell themselves it's just a fad but the global market cap for cryptocurrency is $310billion with bitcoin holding $168billion of the total, second behind is ethereum with $45billion.
Gold was a great way to store wealth in the 1900s but now we're in the 2000s where new digital opportunities are being created. We are witnessing economic change on a global scale, just give it another 25 years and you'll see.
When Satoshi created bitcoin their vision was to create a decentralised alternative currency which wasn't dependant on banks or governments. However as time goes on I think people are starting to realise that you'll never be able to buy your shopping from Tesco or buy clothes from next with bitcoin, that just isn't realistic because it's too volatile.
Fiat is controlled by the government and they dictate it's price, yes the exchange rate changes daily but generally speaking £100 will buy you the same amount of goods as £100 in 6 months time. As demonstrated with bitcoin the price can change by hundreds of percent in the same amount of time which makes it a terrible form of currency.
However as a store of value, bitcoin works very well. Like gold and other precious metals, there is a limited supply and it requires work in order to mine it which gives it value if enough people agree on the fundamental principle that bitcoin has some value based on total supply x work. People store their wealth in gold, which besides it's small use cases is just a shiny piece of metal which enough people have deemed is worth some value.
As the bitcoin market cap increases into the trillions, it will become less and less volatile because it takes more and more money just to move it even 1%. Gold is relatively stable but compared to fiat gold is notoriously volatile.
Bitcoin can and will give people a digital, decentralised asset in which they can store their wealth which as it stands only bitcoin offers. People can remain in denial all they want and try to tell themselves it's just a fad but the global market cap for cryptocurrency is $310billion with bitcoin holding $168billion of the total, second behind is ethereum with $45billion.
Gold was a great way to store wealth in the 1900s but now we're in the 2000s where new digital opportunities are being created. We are witnessing economic change on a global scale, just give it another 25 years and you'll see.
I don't believe Bitcoin is objectively the best cryptocurrency right now but one of the reasons to hold Bitcoin is the fact you're holding a piece of the first blockchain ever created, this is history and every one of us is an early adopter. I'm certain that Ethereum is going to be doing amazing things in the next two years, the potential is through the roof.
Thought this was our crypto thread 
@Ninja Squirrel
@Ninja Squirrel
Original post by FriendlyPenguin
Why?
Because people need it to run their daily lives. You wouldn't want mad speculation on essentials like water and food. If people want to gamble their money, they are more than welcome to go down Bet Fred.
Original post by ByEeek
Because people need it to run their daily lives. You wouldn't want mad speculation on essentials like water and food. If people want to gamble their money, they are more than welcome to go down Bet Fred.
Who are you to tell people what to speculate upon?
Original post by Ganjaweed Rebel
I don't believe Bitcoin is objectively the best cryptocurrency right now but one of the reasons to hold Bitcoin is the fact you're holding a piece of the first blockchain ever created, this is history and every one of us is an early adopter. I'm certain that Ethereum is going to be doing amazing things in the next two years, the potential is through the roof.
Well I don't think there is a "best" cryptocurrency because different coins serve different purposes. There's no doubt that bitcoin is the best for long term storage of wealth but something like ethereum is hands down the best from a technological aspect. It has so many use cases it's unreal. When you see companies like JP Morgan, Intel, AXA, Toyota, Samsung, Microsoft, BP, Credit Suisse, Mastercard and dozens others all hiring blockchain developers and are backing the Ethereum Enterprise Alliance, it's a no brainer that this technology will be worth trillions in the future.
Ethereum really is 21st century digital technology at it's finest.
Created by a 19 year old may I add
(edited 6 years ago)
Original post by Ganjaweed Rebel
Who are you to tell people what to speculate upon?
Who the hell are you screw over the lives of millions of people who have done nothing?
Why do you think we have regulations?
Not sure if The Guardian is on there or not, but there's a Bitcoin obituaries page of people predicting the imminent demise of the currency. They go back to 2010 when it was worth $0.23.
Personally I think it is here to stay, this guy gives some good (if very enthusiastic) reasons why it might:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJWCJCWOxBYSi5DhCieLOLQ
Personally I think it is here to stay, this guy gives some good (if very enthusiastic) reasons why it might:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJWCJCWOxBYSi5DhCieLOLQ
Original post by ByEeek
Who the hell are you screw over the lives of millions of people who have done nothing?
Why do you think we have regulations?
Why do you think we have regulations?
You're acting as if property is held in trust for the good of the collective rather than being the product of sweat and tears and to be used for the enjoyment of the owner at their discretion.
Original post by Ganjaweed Rebel
You're acting as if property is held in trust for the good of the collective rather than being the product of sweat and tears and to be used for the enjoyment of the owner at their discretion.
It’s more like this.
A company provides a product or service, great that actually produces something.
People trading companies shares produces nothing, it’s a high stakes gamble.
It’s a bit like Ed Milliband producers and predators line.
Original post by Ganjaweed Rebel
You're acting as if property is held in trust for the good of the collective rather than being the product of sweat and tears and to be used for the enjoyment of the owner at their discretion.
Agreed. And I have no problem with entrepreneurship and investing to build some form of viable business. However, when the investment stops being about the creation of something useful and turns into a speculation of financial instruments and derivatives whose sole purpose is to increase the wealth of the person speculating at any cost - that is just immoral.
We are 10 years into a weak recession caused by a few greedy men but still felt by a silent majority of Brits their exceedingly weakened government.
Original post by paul514
It’s more like this.
A company provides a product or service, great that actually produces something.
People trading companies shares produces nothing, it’s a high stakes gamble.
It’s a bit like Ed Milliband producers and predators line.
A company provides a product or service, great that actually produces something.
People trading companies shares produces nothing, it’s a high stakes gamble.
It’s a bit like Ed Milliband producers and predators line.
The purpose of financial markets is the efficient allocation of capital and to ensure that stock prices match a fair valuation of the company. If there were no financial analysts and no traders the two things would become so wildly out of touch that performance would have little to do with valuation.
Original post by Ganjaweed Rebel
The purpose of financial markets is the efficient allocation of capital and to ensure that stock prices match a fair valuation of the company. If there were no financial analysts and no traders the two things would become so wildly out of touch that performance would have little to do with valuation.
So?
That only matters to people carrying out these bets.
Original post by paul514
So?
That only matters to people carrying out these bets.
That only matters to people carrying out these bets.
Don't be ridiculous. Ask yourself why companies issue shares and then you'll see why this would be a problem.
Original post by Ganjaweed Rebel
Don't be ridiculous. Ask yourself why companies issue shares and then you'll see why this would be a problem.
They issue shares to raise capital and/or for the owner to cash in some of the company.
They also issue stock as a way of rewarding key staff without going into their cash flow and giving tax benefits to those staff.
Again what’s your point?
Original post by ByEeek
True. But I can exchange it for a new pound at the bank. And if they refuse, I can as a last resort pop down to London and knock on the front door of the Bank of England who will honour that pound regardless.
It is the little phrase "I promise to pay the bearer the sum of..." on our notes that carries the guarantee, not the value of the coin or paper it is written on.
It is the little phrase "I promise to pay the bearer the sum of..." on our notes that carries the guarantee, not the value of the coin or paper it is written on.
There are no absolute guarantees with currencies either.
A one million Reichsmark note was worthless in the Weimar Republic when they were transporting wheelbarrows full of notes to buy a loaf of bread. Same with a country much in the news recently, Zimbabwe.
You may say that the UK is different. In the short term probably yes, but in the long term who knows?
A lack of confidence in Bitcoin is just the irrational emotional fear of someone with no capital to invest (if you'll forgive me saying).
The kind of people who speculate in it can afford to lose everything. They will see wild swings in their share portfolios too. They probably speculate in commodities. None of these have much intrinsic value. Even equities. The value of a company like Apple can fluctuate tens of billions of dollars in a single day. A single hour.
You just don't understand the mindset. It is a different world to yours.
Original post by ByEeek
Agreed. But there are some things I think should not be speculated with. And currency is one of them. It does my head in that housing should be an investment for example. People just need a home.
Well the alternative is socialised housing. In which no-one cares about the housing stock and it all goes to $hit.
Look at Eastern Europe and the Soviet Union under communism. Look at Havana now. A wonderful, colonial era city crumbling to dust. Literally falling down.
That does my head in even more. Rubbish food, shortages of basic items, terrible accommodation.
Misery. Everyone equal (except party members). Equally miserable.
Original post by generallee
There are no absolute guarantees with currencies either.
A one million Reichsmark note was worthless in the Weimar Republic when they were transporting wheelbarrows full of notes to buy a loaf of bread. Same with a country much in the news recently, Zimbabwe.
You may say that the UK is different. In the short term probably yes, but in the long term who knows?
A lack of confidence in Bitcoin is just the irrational emotional fear of someone with no capital to invest (if you'll forgive me saying).
The kind of people who speculate in it can afford to lose everything. They will see wild swings in their share portfolios too. They probably speculate in commodities. None of these have much intrinsic value. Even equities. The value of a company like Apple can fluctuate tens of billions of dollars in a single day. A single hour.
You just don't understand the mindset. It is a different world to yours.
A one million Reichsmark note was worthless in the Weimar Republic when they were transporting wheelbarrows full of notes to buy a loaf of bread. Same with a country much in the news recently, Zimbabwe.
You may say that the UK is different. In the short term probably yes, but in the long term who knows?
A lack of confidence in Bitcoin is just the irrational emotional fear of someone with no capital to invest (if you'll forgive me saying).
The kind of people who speculate in it can afford to lose everything. They will see wild swings in their share portfolios too. They probably speculate in commodities. None of these have much intrinsic value. Even equities. The value of a company like Apple can fluctuate tens of billions of dollars in a single day. A single hour.
You just don't understand the mindset. It is a different world to yours.
I have 30% of my savings in cryptocurrency and I'm totally prepared to lose every penny. I've had drops of 40%, 50% and even 66% on ethereum, to me this is normal for crypto and those who panic sell will never make it in investing, in any space whether it's the stock market, precious metals, crypto or anything else.
One member even asked me recently if I was considering selling at least some of my bitcoin because it dropped from $8k to $5,600 (30%) in 5 days. Those kind of people will always lose when it comes to investing unfortunately.
Quick Reply
Related discussions
- The Cryptocurrency Thread
- What’s the most practical cryptocurrency?
- Crypto and bitcoin - any purpose and use beyond their plethora of scams and frauds?
- Seeking Your Expertise: Complete Our Dissertation Survey on Blockchain Automation
- idea.org.uk
- What are the key components of Bitcoin Exchange Development?
- How To Develop a Crypto Wallet like Tronlink?
- cryptocurrency
- Dissertation Idea Dilemma and Supervisor Opinion
- Please I need help on how to rearrange these blockchain
- Financial Development Stage: Spot - Futures - Options?
- Dissertation Idea Dilemma and Supervisor Opinion
- Would the Financial ombudsman be able to help with this scam
- Ravensbourne or UCA for fashion
- Learning Python
- LSE Financial Maths & Statistics - No related work experience... a problem?
- Is it okay to reference non-academic articles in essays?
- Is my poetry any good? Please help
- programming language
- Is Pharmacy a good career choice?
Latest
Trending
Last reply 1 day ago
Why is the political left now censorious and authoritarian??Last reply 1 day ago
Is it true that British unis are prejudiced towards degrees from Scottish unis?Last reply 1 day ago
If the Russell Group was now a fair representation of what it still claims to beLast reply 2 weeks ago
TSR Goes Green: How important will the environment be in this year's election?Last reply 2 weeks ago
Research Rankings of universities if you add Research Quality & Intensity percentagesLast reply 1 month ago
Is University of Birmingham prestigious and respected well enough in UK ?Trending
Last reply 1 day ago
Why is the political left now censorious and authoritarian??Last reply 1 day ago
Is it true that British unis are prejudiced towards degrees from Scottish unis?Last reply 1 day ago
If the Russell Group was now a fair representation of what it still claims to beLast reply 2 weeks ago
TSR Goes Green: How important will the environment be in this year's election?Last reply 2 weeks ago
Research Rankings of universities if you add Research Quality & Intensity percentagesLast reply 1 month ago
Is University of Birmingham prestigious and respected well enough in UK ?
