UKIP: White working class failed by education focus on women and minorities Watch

Trinculo
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Who agrees with UKIP that the white working class is being lefe behind by an education system that focuses on ethnic minorities and women? Especially boys?
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Blue_Cow
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(Original post by Trinculo)
Who agrees with UKIP that the white working class is being lefe behind by an education system that focuses on ethnic minorities and women? Especially boys?
Ethnic minority here. Just wondering how the education system is focused on people like me?

I've never gone to any extra sessions that teachers have put on, and I've never received tutoring (free or paid) from the school. All of my GCSE and A-Level grades were earned on my own merit, through some pretty hard graft if I dare say so myself. I started secondary school at 8:30 am like everyone else and left at 3:10 pm every single day. Never used an extra minute of untimetabled time.

I'm not accusing you of being a racist, but I'm just wondering how it's focused on people like me. Perhaps it's more prevalent in the North than the South? I've not seen any special treatment bestowed on other people, either.
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Trinculo
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(Original post by Blue_Cow)
Ethnic minority here. Just wondering how the education system is focused on people like me?

I've never gone to any extra sessions that teachers have put on, and I've never received tutoring (free or paid) from the school. All of my GCSE and A-Level grades were earned on my own merit, through some pretty hard graft if I dare say so myself.
That's clearly what the party thinks. Do you think they're wrong?

I suppose the argument is that when girls (in general) do not achieve as highly in certain things, or do not represent in certain A-level or degree subjects, there is a natural assumption that some kind of inherent bias or discrimination is at work. Same with various ethnic groups, and there are always pressures to deal with that - but when white students in certain socio-economic groups don't achieve - there is no appetite to promote their interests.
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Blue_Cow
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(Original post by Trinculo)
That's clearly what the party thinks. Do you think they're wrong?

I suppose the argument is that when girls (in general) do not achieve as highly in certain things, or do not represent in certain A-level or degree subjects, there is a natural assumption that some kind of inherent bias or discrimination is at work. Same with various ethnic groups, and there are always pressures to deal with that - but when white students in certain socio-economic groups don't achieve - there is no appetite to promote their interests.
I'm not saying they're right or wrong. My personal experience =/= the state of the country. I'm just simply asking you how the system is centred around people like me (and women).

Looking at the extra study club classroom doors when walking past at hometime, they were all populated by white males than females/ethnic minority students there. I would see an African-Carribean sometimes, but that was extremely rare.

I do accept that white, working-class males are not very well represented at higher education institutions, though (especially at the 'elite' universities: The Golden Triangle and some ancient Scottish universities, Durham etc.), and something should be done about this on a nationwide scale. I have no idea what can be done, though.
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Trinculo
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(Original post by Blue_Cow)
I'm not saying they're right or wrong. My personal experience =/= the state of the country. I'm just simply asking you how the system is centred around people like me (and women).

Looking at the extra study club classroom doors when walking past at hometime, they were all populated by white males than females/ethnic minority students there. I would see an African-Carribean sometimes, but that was extremely rare.
There is empirical evidence that white working class males do not achieve as highly as many other groups. It's the party that is saying that this is because of a negative impact from trying to deal with women and ethnic minorities.

I don't have any examples. I'm not the one making the claim.
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Blue_Cow
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(Original post by Trinculo)
There is empirical evidence that white working class males do not achieve as highly as many other groups. It's the party that is saying that this is because of a negative impact from trying to deal with women and ethnic minorities.

I don't have any examples. I'm not the one making the claim.
Yeah. I've just finished my edit about white working class males and universities. I have a bad habit of adding in extra thoughts in posts after making them.

What I can say, is that Indian/Chinese families seem to place a MASSIVE emphasis on education. Even ones from deprived backgrounds. This doesn't necessarily mean that they are leeching off the state as UKIP are probably suggesting/getting more 'focus', which might skew whatever statistic UKIP are quoting to back up their claim.
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merlynnn
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There is no focus on minorities. It's just a cultural thing. Many asian, black and other minority cultures have cultures that are education-centric whereas white working class people arent that interested in education.

There isnt a focus on women either. All I can think of is "women in stem" programmes but thats for women who actually seeking that sort of field themselves.

The education system isnt failing white working class. The white working class men are simply failing themselves. Perhaps its cultural or just general attitudes towards education.
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ParkHyungSuk
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(Original post by Trinculo)
Who agrees with UKIP that the white working class is being lefe behind by an education system that focuses on ethnic minorities and women? Especially boys?
In my experience, ethnic minorities work a hell of a lot harder. There is no systemic bias against white working class.
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merlynnn
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(Original post by Trinculo)
That's clearly what the party thinks. Do you think they're wrong?

I suppose the argument is that when girls (in general) do not achieve as highly in certain things, or do not represent in certain A-level or degree subjects, there is a natural assumption that some kind of inherent bias or discrimination is at work. Same with various ethnic groups, and there are always pressures to deal with that - but when white students in certain socio-economic groups don't achieve - there is no appetite to promote their interests.
It comes down to parenting and values taught at home. There's only so much schools can do.
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HateOCR
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(Original post by merlynnn)
It comes down to parenting and values taught at home. There's only so much schools can do.
I agree. Minority parents tend to have different values. My parents for example emphasise the sacrifices they made to let me live a better life and i feel it is my duty to study hard and achieve the best in life (i come from a minority background too)
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nmudz_009
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(Original post by Trinculo)
Who agrees with UKIP that the white working class is being lefe behind by an education system that focuses on ethnic minorities and women? Especially boys?

Absolute tripe from UKIP
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Trinculo
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(Original post by nmudz_009)
Absolute tripe from UKIP
Why?
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merlynnn
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(Original post by HateOCR)
I agree. Minority parents tend to have different values. My parents for example emphasise the sacrifices they made to let me live a better life and i feel it is my duty to study hard and achieve the best in life (i come from a minority background too)
Exactly. When you compare that to what working class whites are like...well...
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Trinculo
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(Original post by ParkHyungSuk)
In my experience, ethnic minorities work a hell of a lot harder. There is no systemic bias against white working class.
(Original post by merlynnn)
It comes down to parenting and values taught at home. There's only so much schools can do.
Does that mean that other groups with low educational attainment (such as Carribean males and Pakistani males) are also not being discriminated against - and these are simply failures of parenting and social dynamics?
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nmudz_009
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(Original post by nmudz_009)
Absolute tripe from UKIP
Well they don't back it up with any hard evidence do they?
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cat_mac
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I’d love to hear them explain what extra help there is that the white boys are being kept from. It’s so insulting that they need to say we cheated and had extra help, implying that there is no way a woman or poc could be smarter than the god tier white boy!

Nothing to do with girls constantly feeling like they’re not good enough, so always working hard to prove that they are worthy. Nothing to do with different cultures valuing education higher than the british, having different and better study habits to get results. Nothing to do with the social pressure on white boys to goof around and be “cheeky” class clowns instead of focusing on their studies.
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ParkHyungSuk
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(Original post by Trinculo)
Does that mean that other groups with low educational attainment (such as Carribean males and Pakistani males) are also not being discriminated against - and these are simply failures of parenting and social dynamics?
No one is being discriminated against, the environment may not be the best in terms of getting the best education but in the end that is not discrimination.
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HateOCR
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(Original post by merlynnn)
Exactly. When you compare that to what working class whites are like...well...
Im not sure what the generalisation is for white working class people since ive never met or seen another person who is white and in the working class. So i cant really comment
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Trinculo
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(Original post by nmudz_009)
Well they don't back it up with any hard evidence do they?
(Original post by cat_mac)
I’d love to hear them explain what extra help there is that the white boys are being kept from. It’s so insulting that they need to say we cheated and had extra help, implying that there is no way a woman or poc could be smarter than the god tier white boy!

Nothing to do with girls constantly feeling like they’re not good enough, so always working hard to prove that they are worthy. Nothing to do with different cultures valuing education higher than the british, having different and better study habits to get results. Nothing to do with the social pressure on white boys to goof around and be “cheeky” class clowns instead of focusing on their studies.
Ok, I get the gist of your argument. But are you saying that these views are wrong whether they are backed up with some kind of evidence or not? Because let's face it, this is something that is not really possible to prove.

If a party wants to claim that one racial/social/gender group is being disadvantaged in favour of others - and it can't be easily proven what the cause is - is it a legitimate position for a political party to hold, or is it objectively wrong?
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LibertarianMP
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Damn straight. White working class are the most persecuted group in the whole UK. And we're fed up of it!
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