Jfrank88
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Hi all,

Basically, I have an meng engineering degree and have been working for just over 5 years now upon graduation. I won’t go into details, but it has come to light some cheating during an exam a few years ago took place and it looks like I will lose my degree.

I understand this is totally my fault, I have nobody else to blame, I am ashamed and I am so upset over how I have disappointed my family. However, I have no idea where I will go from now.

I will forever have this revoked degree on my record so will I find it near impossible to get even a simple office job? I was thinking I could work part time in an office and study a course at the open university, then possibly use my future studies to work in the charity sector, however will I even struggle to get anywhere with this route? I’m really lost here! I don’t know how to get round this...

Any help is appreciated
Thank you
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Ray_Shadows
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how did they know you cheated a few years ago
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Jfrank88
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I don’t really want to go into the details...but they know :/
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Nil Admirari
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How did you cheat?
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threeportdrift
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(Original post by Jfrank88)
.............
What work have you been doing for the last 5 years? What you should and can do next will depend on whether you've been using your degree or not.
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Ray_Shadows
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(Original post by Jfrank88)
I don’t really want to go into the details...but they know :/
what proof did they have atleast then
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stoyfan
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(Original post by Jfrank88)
I don’t really want to go into the details...but they know :/
Go on, give us the details mate.
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Jfrank88
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(Original post by threeportdrift)
What work have you been doing for the last 5 years? What you should and can do next will depend on whether you've been using your degree or not.
I’ve been working as a design engineer, so yeah just using my degree pretty much
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hannah00
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Do a second degree, still have another 30 years of career ahead, you dont have to declare what happened to your previous degree, leave it blank
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iodo345
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You could do something vocational that doesn't require a degree.
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threeportdrift
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(Original post by Jfrank88)
I’ve been working as a design engineer, so yeah just using my degree pretty much
Ok, then you need to think back to your recruitment and work out how important your degree was to your recruitment. It's really quite important, so do some decent research and try and find your original paperwork. If a degree is listed as a requirement, then the company do have a right to instantly dismiss you (though they may not, see below). If a degree wasn't a requirement, then that's one hook they don't have.

Then you need to research very carefully, again, finding paperwork if you have it, about the quality of your work and development in the role up until now, any annual appraisals, any promotions, pay increases etc.

Then you need to piece together all your substantial work where you have added value.

What you are putting together is a package of evidence to put to your employer, to convince them that despite not having a degree, and being a cheat, you are a valuable employee to them.

Then you need to choose your target. Probably not central HR, but your best line manager, ie the one that values you most. Book an hour in their diary to discuss 'a personal matter' to make sure they are focussed and not disturbed, and then go and lay out the facts to them. You need to start with the basics of the degree situation, the cheating, the remorse, and then the value you have given to the company.

Then hold your breath. Five years of excellent effort and added value might be enough for them to keep you on. However, if a degree was a requirement, they've got a reason to walk you off the premises there and then.
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Waldorf67
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How on earth would a uni find out something that happened 5 years ago?!
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Napp
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I imagine you could just neglect to tell any current or future employers that your degree was revoked. I assume you have the original and unblemished certificate? Just carry on as normal.
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Jfrank88
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(Original post by threeportdrift)
Ok, then you need to think back to your recruitment and work out how important your degree was to your recruitment. It's really quite important, so do some decent research and try and find your original paperwork. If a degree is listed as a requirement, then the company do have a right to instantly dismiss you (though they may not, see below). If a degree wasn't a requirement, then that's one hook they don't have.

Then you need to research very carefully, again, finding paperwork if you have it, about the quality of your work and development in the role up until now, any annual appraisals, any promotions, pay increases etc.

Then you need to piece together all your substantial work where you have added value.

What you are putting together is a package of evidence to put to your employer, to convince them that despite not having a degree, and being a cheat, you are a valuable employee to them.

Then you need to choose your target. Probably not central HR, but your best line manager, ie the one that values you most. Book an hour in their diary to discuss 'a personal matter' to make sure they are focussed and not disturbed, and then go and lay out the facts to them. You need to start with the basics of the degree situation, the cheating, the remorse, and then the value you have given to the company.

Then hold your breath. Five years of excellent effort and added value might be enough for them to keep you on. However, if a degree was a requirement, they've got a reason to walk you off the premises there and then.
Thanks very much for your reply. That’s means a lot. Assuming though, that I am to lose my job, where am I to turn? I essentially have cheat/revoked degree on my cv forever now as I have my university time and work as an engineer to explain. I won’t be accepted into another university apart from the open university...but what prospects would I have even after that?
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threeportdrift
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(Original post by Jfrank88)
Thanks very much for your reply. That’s means a lot. Assuming though, that I am to lose my job, where am I to turn? I essentially have cheat/revoked degree on my cv forever now as I have my university time and work as an engineer to explain. I won’t be accepted into another university apart from the open university...but what prospects would I have even after that?
No, you have a failed degree, if you have to apply to a job with a full chronology - which you rarely have to do.

You would need to leverage your professional experience, so chances are that you'd have to take a bit of a step back, but it's not impossible.

Basically, you have no degree, but 5 years professional experience in design engineering. You have to apply for jobs that will accept that profile. It was a degree level job, so it should give you a decent lot of workplace evidence. But 5 years is the length of experience whereby degrees become much less relevant anyway.

What you will need to do is become very proficient at how you handle questions about why no degree, why a failed degree, why did you leave your last job etc. You need the right balance of honesty versus gliding over things and humility versus selling yourself. That will probably take some outside advice and practice to get right.
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Jfrank88
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(Original post by threeportdrift)
No, you have a failed degree, if you have to apply to a job with a full chronology - which you rarely have to do.

You would need to leverage your professional experience, so chances are that you'd have to take a bit of a step back, but it's not impossible.

Basically, you have no degree, but 5 years professional experience in design engineering. You have to apply for jobs that will accept that profile. It was a degree level job, so it should give you a decent lot of workplace evidence. But 5 years is the length of experience whereby degrees become much less relevant anyway.

What you will need to do is become very proficient at how you handle questions about why no degree, why a failed degree, why did you leave your last job etc. You need the right balance of honesty versus gliding over things and humility versus selling yourself. That will probably take some outside advice and practice to get right.
I wish I could do what you are saying, but that simply won’t work. I have an meng degree, which if I failed, I would fall back onto the beng hons. Also, my job titled started off as a ‘graduate engineer’, in a large company, so I wouldn’t be able to blag this unfortunately :/
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threeportdrift
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(Original post by Jfrank88)
I wish I could do what you are saying, but that simply won’t work. I have an meng degree, which if I failed, I would fall back onto the beng hons. Also, my job titled started off as a ‘graduate engineer’, in a large company, so I wouldn’t be able to blag this unfortunately :/
Well first of all, you need to be sure the University will award you the BEng, that isn't a given. They can't have awarded a BEng in the first place, or SFE wouldn't have paid for the MEng. The only degree you have/had is an MEng.

So let's take it that your job had a requirement that you had a degree. The employer would be successful in arguing that as you cheated, you knew you hadn't properly been awarded the degree, therefore you got the job by fraud in your application, and they can dismiss you. But that's the black and white thinking of TSR and text books.

It costs a lot for a business to recruit, and if you've been doing the job decently for the last 5 years, they might well take a different view. They might take the pragmatic position that you did all the coursework and just used a phone in the exam (or whatever) and that it was a moment of madness in the last few days, they might want to see your transcript (can you get a copy of that now, before your degree is finally revoked? it could be very useful). Plus they wouldn't get recruiting a grad to replace you, now they'd have to recruit a grad with 5 years experience, they might think that is more trouble than it's worth.

The two real issues are a)do you work for a vast, very rules based, black and white organisation and b)how good an employee have you been for the last 5 years and are you worth saving. Chances are No to the first question and hopefully Yes to the second, but ...
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Muttley79
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(Original post by Jfrank88)
I wish I could do what you are saying, but that simply won’t work. I have an meng degree, which if I failed, I would fall back onto the beng hons. Also, my job titled started off as a ‘graduate engineer’, in a large company, so I wouldn’t be able to blag this unfortunately :/
So are they just removing/revoking the MEng? That means you still have a BEng ie a degree.

Do they actually have proof you cheated and why has it taken 5 years to come to light? Might be worth talking to CAB for advice.
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threeportdrift
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(Original post by Muttley79)
So are they just removing/revoking the MEng? That means you still have a BEng ie a degree.

.
Does it though? I've dealt with the academic statues of two universities and in both the BEng wasn't awarded if it was an integrated Masters, you had to pass the exams, but once you'd passed and committed to the MEng, that was the only degree awarded. I understood that was the only way that SFE would agree to pay for the MEng element. It's different for medics who iirc get 2 degrees out of one continuous period of degree study, but I don't think a lost MEng can be taken to automatically default to a BEng in this case.
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patch-111
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As mentioned above, what proof do they have against you? Even if it's solid proof, if you have been a good student with a respectable record throughout your time at the Uni you may be able to argue against the claims, at the very least even gain some partial credit. How significant was the cheating?
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