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DayneD89
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What is this?/I'm confused
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A209 - Opening Speech Amendment, The Rt. Hon Afcwimbledon2 MP (Lib). Seconded by: The Rt. Hon Conceited MP (Lib), The Hon. Mrwb9876 MP (Liber), The Rt. Hon 04MR17, MP (Lib), The Rt. Hon Mr T 999 MP (Nat Con)

This amendment seeks to amend how Bills are presented in the house in order to better stimulate debate, and also to better simulate the IRL House of Commons.

To amend the Guidance Document section on Bill Formatting from:
Bill Summary Paragraph
All bills should provide an explanatory paragraph that outlines the aim of the legislation and a basic rationale for why it is necessary. Optionally, further points that could be used to justify the legislation can be entered here. To keep the bill tidy, the notes section should be wrapped with a spoiler tag as follows: [/i]
[spoiler]


[i]Summary Paragraph and additional notes goes here[/i]


[/spoiler]
[i]


to:
Opening Speech
As is customary in the IRL Commons, each bill must be accompanied by an opening speech written by the main author of the bill. This would be provided by the Speaker at submission and posted in a second post as part of the thread created at each reading.

This should be started in the following format:

Mr Speaker,

The <<name of bill>>... Housing Equality Bill 2018 seeks to...

This should then continue to provide a detailed justification that outlines the aim for the legislation, a basic rationale for why it is necessary and an argument as to why they believe it should be put into law.

It should be finished with:
I commend the <<name of bill>> Housing Equality Bill 2018 to the house.

With regards to links to existing bills and economic costings etc, this should remain in a spoilered notes bill, however no formal argument or paragraph should remain in this section.
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JMR2020.
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Nah too confusing and too much hastle,
No.
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Jammy Duel
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Nope, and it already exists: it's called the notes.
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CountBrandenburg
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But why though? How will this effect things in bill writing? I’m sure we could just stick an argument in the notes for arguments sake
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WobblyBovine
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I mean, I like the idea, but I’m not sure if people would be willing to exchange a few lines of summary for a speech. And I think the formattings messed up DayneD89
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TheDefiniteArticle
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Yeah, we have this as the notes. Nay.
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Tanqueray91
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All this does is regurgitate the notes, and is very unnecessary... we want more bills, not more things to deter people from writing bills.
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Saracen's Fez
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I like the idea of formalising the notes into an opening speech, and in fact was thinking about it a bit myself recently, though I'd like to see a word limit implemented if we are going to bring them in.

Also in the case of a government or opposition bill, the relevant (shadow) minister ought to be making (or be attributed) the speech, regardless of author.
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username1751857
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Not needed. Just use the notes. Nay.
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Aph
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(Original post by Saracen's Fez)
I like the idea of formalising the notes into an opening speech, and in fact was thinking about it a bit myself recently, though I'd like to see a word limit implemented if we are going to bring them in.

Also in the case of a government or opposition bill, the relevant (shadow) minister ought to be making (or be attributed) the speech, regardless of author.
The notes are already formalised in th e GD. but the gd isn’t enforceable.
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LibertarianMP
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Aye
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Saracen's Fez
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(Original post by Aph)
The notes are already formalised in the GD. but the gd isn’t enforceable.
Indeed, and in truth they are sometimes necessary and sometimes don't really feel needed, dependent upon the bill. Also there's a large variation in what people use a Notes section for.

A short (maybe 200, maximum 300 word) speech to introduce the bill would be better, with notes to be restricted to costings, hyperlinks and sources.
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04MR17
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To all the people who've already referenced the notes as a valid reason, I'll point towards the severe lack of notes in legislation so far this term. If you're so pro-notes put them in the bills.
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username280380
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(Original post by JMR2018)
Nah too confusing and too much hastle,
No.
(Original post by Jammy Duel)
Nope, and it already exists: it's called the notes.
(Original post by CountBrandenburg)
But why though? How will this effect things in bill writing? I’m sure we could just stick an argument in the notes for arguments sake
(Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
Yeah, we have this as the notes. Nay.
This amends the notes part of the GD and tweaks the formatting. It doesn't make it compulsory but makes it a good idea to do that. Would you rather have a bill that creates true debates or the Aye/nay fest we suffer from now

(Original post by mobbsy91)
All this does is regurgitate the notes, and is very unnecessary... we want more bills, not more things to deter people from writing bills.
How is this actually going to stop people from writing bills? It's in the GD so doesn't have to happen and will ensure better bills.

(Original post by Saracen's Fez)
I like the idea of formalising the notes into an opening speech, and in fact was thinking about it a bit myself recently, though I'd like to see a word limit implemented if we are going to bring them in.

Also in the case of a government or opposition bill, the relevant (shadow) minister ought to be making (or be attributed) the speech, regardless of author.
What kind of word limit would you think for? I like the idea of one too but for something like a finance bill - you might need more than 200 words.

(Original post by Aph)
The notes are already formalised in th e GD. but the gd isn’t enforceable.
This. This amends the not completely enforceable part of the Bill formatting section and gives us a suggestion for something that could make the debate in the house so much better.
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Saracen's Fez
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(Original post by Afcwimbledon2)
What kind of word limit would you think for? I like the idea of one too but for something like a finance bill - you might need more than 200 words.
Presumably something like a Finance Bill would follow a Budget SoI though, and that would be where the long introductory speech would be made. I'm minded to think that anything else should be able to be summarised into about 300 words, bearing in mind the proposer could continue to speak to and defend the bill outside of their protected second post.
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username280380
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(Original post by JellyMilk)
I mean, I like the idea, but I’m not sure if people would be willing to exchange a few lines of summary for a speech. And I think the formattings messed up DayneD89
Formatting is ok - it looks better in the GD on the wiki than it does on TSR formatting. Having to use No parse boxes to make the previous section make sense.

Don't see a speech taking more than 10-15 minutes to write if it's a short bill and 200 words of more informal flowing language is easier to do than what we currently have. Look at my notes for the Housing Equality Bill - it would have been quicker to write a speech for it than formal notes.
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Joep95
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A brilliant way to deter members from writing a bill, the notes are often unimportant for the debate.
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username280380
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(Original post by Saracen's Fez)
Presumably something like a Finance Bill would follow a Budget SoI though, and that would be where the long introductory speech would be made. I'm minded to think that anything else should be able to be summarised into about 300 words, bearing in mind the proposer could continue to speak to and defend the bill outside of their protected second post.
Thats true - I might try an OS for third reading of the housing bill and see how word count turns out.
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username280380
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(Original post by joecphillips)
A brilliant way to deter members from writing a bill, the notes are often unimportant for the debate.
How? This is part of the GD so isn't enforceable and thus you don't have to do one. It improves the concept of notes (when people bother to use them) and will improve the debates part of the house.
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username2080673
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(Original post by joecphillips)
A brilliant way to deter members from writing a bill, the notes are often unimportant for the debate.
The type of people who would be deterred by this wouldn't be likely to create bills anyways.
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