tdart
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Hey Guys!

I have to compare the pressentation of ideas about youth and war in the poems 'Anthem for Doomed Youth' and 'Who's for the Game?'. I have to include the ideas and attitudes in each poem, the tone and atmosphere in each poem and the effects of the language and structure used. I'm really unsure as to what I should write about, so would greatly appreciate some help.
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Fox Corner
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Hi! I've moved this thread to the English forum for you Hopefully someone can help you out here
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tdart
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(Original post by Fox Corner)
Hi! I've moved this thread to the English forum for you Hopefully someone can help you out here
Thank you
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jamesg2
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Jessie Pope was a pro-war poet. I believe this poem was written in 1916. It is interesting that in 1916 she was a well known English poet. It has been documented that her poem "The Call" was one of the inspirations for Owen's Dulce Et Decorm. In his first draft he dedicated it " to Jessie Pope" and though he changed that dedication to a "certain poetess" - and everyone would have known who that was - it was not until the final draft that he removed the dedication. “Dulce et Decoum Est” is very much a Jessie Pope sentiment. She believed in that sentiment. Though I have not seen this poem, it is really a copy of the ideas of “The Call.”

The critical difference between Owen and Pope - aside from the fact that he is vastly superior poet - is that he had experienced war and Pope had not.

The metaphor “The Game” should lead you in to writing a serious criticism. That is the critical difference in how each view the war.

Many of Jessie Pope’s poems were written pre-conscription - hence her eagerness for the young to joining up.

I am struck by verse 3. Before he decided on “Disabled” as the title for his poem, Owen had provisionally entitled the poem “Why He Joined.” And why he joined was because of the Jessie Pope sentiments and the encouragement of Meg. In that poem the soldier is bitter for what he has lost: limbs gratitude and the affection of Meg who has now deserted him. In the “Game” “she” can be seen as a metaphor for both country and girl.

“Anthem For Doomed Youth” - which during draft 2 was briefly entitled “The Wrestlers”: people who contend with difficulties in adverse circumstances - before settling - with the aid of Sassoon who contributed “Doomed” on its present title.

The heart of this poem is about appreciation: put bluntly who gives a damm about what is happening and why. Very much a disabled theme. The answer is no-one: soldiers are killed or critically wounded to an orchestral sound of “monstrous guns.” Effectively as they are dying others are being killed.

Line 8 - which leads into the sestet. The sestet is a more difficult verse that the octet. However it appears to focus on the feeling and concerns of the Home Front, compared to the battlefront in the octet. The sestet appears to use the conventional items in the traditional church service to link the ideas in the verse.

The poem ends with line 14:- And each slow dusk a drawing-down of blinds. This is a line that effectively remained the same from draft 1. More than other lines Owen is reflecting on the grief of those at home. It was a common feature in those days when there had been a death in the family to draw down the blinds to indicate the house is in mourning. Note “And each slow dusk”, thus suggests that this grief will be everlasting. Maybe this line links to the idea of the nation, and it is the country that each day it is remembering this loss.

None of these ideas are in Pope’s poem. The metaphor “game” sums up her attitude to war.

It is easy to be bitter about Jessie Pope - apparently Owen referred to her as “that damm woman.” If you read his first draft of Dulce you can easily see his bitterness towards her. However she was not indifferent to war and death: she simply was ignorant of what was going on. That is the difference between a Owen poem and a Pope poem. The bitterness that we read in an Owen poem is the conesuence of experience. Pope was - like most of the UK until the papers began to write about. What was happening - oblivious to what was going on. Her focus and her concern was for her country and encouraging others to enter the war to save her country. It would be interesting to know what sort of poetry she would have written had she really known what was going on and experienced what Owen had.
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mollieking12345
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hi i have an english test on monday and i just wanted to ask to see if you know how to do slic [structure,language,ideas and context] as im stuck and i hope that you could help.
(Original post by tdart)
Hey Guys!

I have to compare the pressentation of ideas about youth and war in the poems 'Anthem for Doomed Youth' and 'Who's for the Game?'. I have to include the ideas and attitudes in each poem, the tone and atmosphere in each poem and the effects of the language and structure used. I'm really unsure as to what I should write about, so would greatly appreciate some help.
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