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Why do women want gender equality in the workplace, but not in dating? watch

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    (Original post by loveleest)
    You do realise that delegalising abortion is just going to make women "abort" in illegal, harmful ways?
    They should do what they want and face the consequences.
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    (Original post by Wired_1800)
    I guess that I am the guy and you are the wall.
    :laugh:
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    (Original post by Wired_1800)
    Who goes on a date with a guy and fears they will be killed in public?
    Who said anything about in public?

    Some men (definitely not all, but enough) behave in violent and dangerous ways when things don't go their way, especially on dates. There have been multiple cases of women going on a date and the man trying to rape them and/or kill them. There have been cases of women being threatened with guns, knives, etc for refusal. Because the 'friend zone' exists. No - it is not a woman's job to have sex with you if you're 'nice' to them. It doesn't work that way, and more often than it should ever happen (I.w it shouldn't happen at all) men can get violent because of a woman's refusal to be their sexual object. Nobody is a walking sexual object - they are first and foremost a person.

    That is why women fear death and rape after a date because the way society has been built up in a way that a man can get angry if you say no. And yes, I realise that not all men are like this and that not ever date is going to be like that. But is happens and it really shouldn't.

    Onto the topic of the thread, the gender pay gap does exist. Otherwise Iceland (I think) wouldn't have needed to make a law to make it illegal. But the pay gap also exists between different racial groups so let's not forget about that either. Yes there are problems with the world, and it shouldn't be about lowering one group, but rather raising the other up.

    I read a very good post on tumblr that said, to paraphrase, men (or anyone for that matter) should never have been in a position to control women's (or any other group that didn't ever used to have many rights) rights and the laws regarding them.
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    (Original post by Becca G)
    Funny how whenever we are talking about equality, the issue of beating women ALWAYS comes up. Always.
    Ppl are already beating women mate, the point is that we want them to stop. ‘Being able to hit a woman’ in comparison with ‘women wanting equal reproductive rights, equal opportunities and no bias’ are not the same thing, because beating women isn’t a right. Can’t we just stop all violence towards each other? I’m all for self defense, really. But it’s hard to believe that women are the most violent out of the two genders, when all mass shooters, violent criminals and serial offenders are men.
    I understand that there are feminists who believe all men should die, bla bla bla but if so, they aren’t real feminists. Literally all real feminists want is political, social and economic equality. And what some might see as ‘picking and choosing’ is actually us addressing that some groups of people (women, LGBT, black, hispanic, etc.) need a little more help getting there than other groups (white straight men). I’m not saying that men don’t have problems, they have plenty like higher suicide rates, toxic masculinity, etc. But even then, it seems as if feminism is the only movement actually trying to help guys and shed light on their problems too.

    So excuse me if I call someone stupid when they say that feminism is stupid, because it has helped so many women of all sexualities and nationalities and even men too, to gain equal rights, opportunities and safety.
    If you want another example other than the “beating women” example how about this. Look at what’s going on in Hollywood right now with all the sexual harassment allegations. Why are all the protests to that about women being treated unfairly in Hollywood? Men have been sexually harassed in Hollywood too in fact Brendan Fraser just came out today with his story but because he’s a male I doubt anyone will take him seriously. Obviously more women have been harassed but it happens to men too but nobody mentions the men. Notice when all these celebs are making their speeches they say “I stand by the women who have been abused” but they ignore the men? That’s not equality is it?

    Another example I can give you is the Barry Bennell case. A football coach who has just been locked up for sexually abusing young footballers on more than 50 separate occasions. That’s just as bad as what Harvey Weinstein did but you don’t see marches and protests against sexual abuse of young footballers and you don’t see celebs wearing black and making speeches in honour of abuse victims in general it’s always about “the women who have been abused.” There’s plenty cases of men being raped or sexually harassed or stalked but because they are men nobody will take them seriously not even the police. That’s not equality.

    Another example is mental health. Men find it much harder to admit they have mental health problems than women because men are meant to be “strong” and are told to “man up” if they open up . That’s not equality is it but do you ever see people protesting about it?

    My point is that’s a lot of feminists (not all) seem to think that things like rape and sexual harassment etc happen exclusively to women when in actual fact the men find it just as difficult to speak up as the women but when you see these movements like the “Time’s Up” or “Me Too” whatever it’s called it’s all about the women and not a thought is given to men.

    There are situations in this world where men are unfairly treated better than women and vice versa but a lot of “feminists” don’t see it like that.

    If men stared calling themselves “Meninists” and protesting for equal rights in areas that they aren’t given as much recognition as women then they’d be laughed at and called greedy.

    Why can’t everyone just agree that men and women both need more recognition in certain things instead of feminists trying to act like men own the world and keep women locked up in cages?

    Sorry for any grammar mistakes I’m typing this on my crappy phone and drunk auto correct.
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    (Original post by Wired_1800)
    I have explained this point before.

    The death penalty acts as a deterrent and a solution for one-time situations and stone-cold killers. If someone kills another person and denies them the opportunity to live, laugh and grow old, why should we give them their life and play happy family.
    Because no one deserves to die even if they have done something horrible, they deserve to sit and take their penance and live with what they’ve done
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    (Original post by Becca G)
    THANKYOU to the only other person on this thread who actually has brain cells.
    That's a bit harsh.

    So if someone just so happens to disagree with you then they lack brain cells, but the one person that agrees with you just so happens to have brain cells?
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    (Original post by Wired_1800)
    If a 15 year old knows that she will get the death penalty for committing abortion, i strongly doubt she will be in a hurry to end her own life in the process. If she then goes ahead with it, then we have to demand her life in payment for the unborn child.
    Its not an unborn child though (depending on how far along in the pregnancy she is) its a foetus. And of the woman is far enough along in the pregnancy that the ‘child’ would be able to survive then they probably dont want the abortion and they’re getting it for medical reasons, if they had truly wanted an abortion they would’ve done it sooner
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    (Original post by Unknown-99)
    If you want another example other than the “beating women” example how about this. Look at what’s going on in Hollywood right now with all the sexual harassment allegations. Why are all the protests to that about women being treated unfairly in Hollywood? Men have been sexually harassed in Hollywood too in fact Brendan Fraser just came out today with his story but because he’s a male I doubt anyone will take him seriously. Obviously more women have been harassed but it happens to men too but nobody mentions the men. Notice when all these celebs are making their speeches they say “I stand by the women who have been abused” but they ignore the men? That’s not equality is it?

    Another example I can give you is the Barry Bennell case. A football coach who has just been locked up for sexually abusing young footballers on more than 50 separate occasions. That’s just as bad as what Harvey Weinstein did but you don’t see marches and protests against sexual abuse of young footballers and you don’t see celebs wearing black and making speeches in honour of abuse victims in general it’s always about “the women who have been abused.” There’s plenty cases of men being raped or sexually harassed or stalked but because they are men nobody will take them seriously not even the police. That’s not equality.

    Another example is mental health. Men find it much harder to admit they have mental health problems than women because men are meant to be “strong” and are told to “man up” if they open up . That’s not equality is it but do you ever see people protesting about it?

    My point is that’s a lot of feminists (not all) seem to think that things like rape and sexual harassment etc happen exclusively to women when in actual fact the men find it just as difficult to speak up as the women but when you see these movements like the “Time’s Up” or “Me Too” whatever it’s called it’s all about the women and not a thought is given to men.

    There are situations in this world where men are unfairly treated better than women and vice versa but a lot of “feminists” don’t see it like that.

    If men stared calling themselves “Meninists” and protesting for equal rights in areas that they aren’t given as much recognition as women then they’d be laughed at and called greedy.

    Why can’t everyone just agree that men and women both need more recognition in certain things instead of feminists trying to act like men own the world and keep women locked up in cages?

    Sorry for any grammar mistakes I’m typing this on my crappy phone and drunk auto correct.
    You said that men find it harder to speak about their mental health and get help, but thats just another thing that feminists want to bring light to, they want to break down stereotypes so that men don’t have to find it difficult
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    (Original post by EqualitySloth)
    You said that men find it harder to speak about their mental health and get help, but thats just another thing that feminists want to bring light to, they want to break down stereotypes so that men don’t have to find it difficult
    Also i do agree with you that both men and woman need recognition in certain areas i just believe that woman are generally more oppressed and need a little more help getting to where men are
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    (Original post by Wired_1800)
    Who goes on a date with a guy and fears they will be killed in public?
    Many women do....
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    (Original post by Wired_1800)
    They should do what they want and face the consequences.
    So you are not against abortion if it hurts the women? Ok
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    (Original post by snowman77)
    This is what I don't understand about the modern day gender equality/feminism movement. They want equality in some areas, but other areas they are happy for things to stay the same as long as they receive the benefit.

    Women want equal treatment in the workplace with their male colleagues. They want equal pay (FWIW the gender pay gap is a myth - same job for same hours get paid the same, otherwise it's illegal), they don't want to experience sexual harassment in the workplace (what about all the false accusations which ruin men's careers?), they want the same opportunities men have, they want equal opportunities for promotion (despite many of them taking time off for maternity leave).

    This is all fair enough. Except they don't want equality in dating. Men are still expected to:

    - ask the woman out and face possible rejection (women might give subtle hints, but under no circumstances will they ask the man out - that is "his job"
    - pay for the first date (and possible subsequent dates as well)
    - propose to the woman
    - treat her with meals/gifts
    - hold open the door for her
    - give up his coat if she's cold, so he can freeze (but never the other way around)
    - put the majority of effort into sex (this is centered around pleasing the woman - the man's enjoyment is always assumed)
    - be manly and dominant, never show any weak emotions, keep his problems bottled up because otherwise it's "unmanly"
    - household chores must now be shared. Women no longer have to do all the cooking and cleaning, it's shared equally between men, because otherwise it's gender discrimination/oppression. Despite the fact men are still seen as the primary breadwinner in the household and a man without a job is a virtual disaster.


    So back to the original question: Why do women want gender equality in the workplace (and indeed many other areas), but not in dating? I'm interested to hear to views of men, women and any feminists.

    So true! I am a woman and I think if you are a feminist and want equality you need to think of everyone. However I think demanding rights in the workplace is very different to dating like you want to be able to be treated equally whatever job you have, and not have a risk of being assaulted or harassed.. and with dating it is pretty similar but it seems it not an “important” issue in society right now. It definitely is something that’s wrong, women who aren’t feminists do it and are just self-centered ,as it fits in with masculinity and how it hasn’t changed but feminist has over time, which are both something that needs to change. These are the things men did for women in the 1950s, you can’t pick and choose things men can’t do!

    Also household chores I think should be done by anyone/everyone, when around children parents should do both as don’t want them to think stereotypes are actually real.

    Overall men shouldn’t rape, assault or harass women and stand up for this and women saying they should pay and attempting to manipulate you of your masculity isn’t okay.
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    (Original post by JustACoincidence)
    Who said anything about in public?

    Some men (definitely not all, but enough) behave in violent and dangerous ways when things don't go their way, especially on dates. There have been multiple cases of women going on a date and the man trying to rape them and/or kill them. There have been cases of women being threatened with guns, knives, etc for refusal. Because the 'friend zone' exists. No - it is not a woman's job to have sex with you if you're 'nice' to them. It doesn't work that way, and more often than it should ever happen (I.w it shouldn't happen at all) men can get violent because of a woman's refusal to be their sexual object. Nobody is a walking sexual object - they are first and foremost a person.

    That is why women fear death and rape after a date because the way society has been built up in a way that a man can get angry if you say no. And yes, I realise that not all men are like this and that not ever date is going to be like that. But is happens and it really shouldn't.

    Onto the topic of the thread, the gender pay gap does exist. Otherwise Iceland (I think) wouldn't have needed to make a law to make it illegal. But the pay gap also exists between different racial groups so let's not forget about that either. Yes there are problems with the world, and it shouldn't be about lowering one group, but rather raising the other up.

    I read a very good post on tumblr that said, to paraphrase, men (or anyone for that matter) should never have been in a position to control women's (or any other group that didn't ever used to have many rights) rights and the laws regarding them.
    I do not that many dates are setup to rape and murder women. I think it is more like this:

    Boy meets girl, he likes girl. Boy asks girl on date, he is worried about rejection. Girl accepts date. Boy tries to impress girl during the date. Sometimes date goes well and girl accepts another date. Sometimes date goes bad, boy cries or feels sad. If it goes well, boy asks girl to be his gf and things blossom.

    It is not:

    Boy meets girl, he likes girl. Boy asks girl on date. Girl accepts date. Boy tries to drug girl during date. Girl gets drugged and boys murders her.

    It is horrible to think that.

    To your second point, pay discrimination is often mistaken for pay gap. Pay discrimination, which is paying men and women different wages for the exact job, is against the law and now does not exist.

    However, the pay gap, which is the average pay between men and women in an organisation, does exist and is due to different factors.

    Some people stupidly mix pay discrimination with the pay gap.
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    (Original post by EqualitySloth)
    Because no one deserves to die even if they have done something horrible, they deserve to sit and take their penance and live with what they’ve done
    Lol, okay.
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    (Original post by EqualitySloth)
    Its not an unborn child though (depending on how far along in the pregnancy she is) its a foetus. And of the woman is far enough along in the pregnancy that the ‘child’ would be able to survive then they probably dont want the abortion and they’re getting it for medical reasons, if they had truly wanted an abortion they would’ve done it sooner
    Please go back to read previous pages, we have already discussed the topic of when does life begin.
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    (Original post by loveleest)
    Many women do....
    Then you should go on the date. Why would you go on a date with a man that you fear would kill you, it does not make sense.
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    (Original post by loveleest)
    So you are not against abortion if it hurts the women? Ok
    I have discussed this point before. I am against abortion in many forms. The ONLY form where I leave it to the judgment of the medical officials is the point where there is a life or death situation between the mother and child. For example, if the child lives, the mother dies or if the mother lives, the child dies. Other forms, I am against abortion.
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    (Original post by Wired_1800)
    I have discussed this point before. I am against abortion in many forms. The ONLY form where I leave it to the judgment of the medical officials is the point where there is a life or death situation between the mother and child. For example, if the child lives, the mother dies or if the mother lives, the child dies. Other forms, I am against abortion.
    wow even rape?
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    (Original post by loveleest)
    wow even rape?
    There are rape victims who still keep their child. Some then opt to offer the child for adoption to enable a better life. It is not a life or death situation.
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    (Original post by Wired_1800)
    There are rape victims who still keep their child. Some then opt to offer the child for adoption to enable a better life. It is not a life or death situation.
    Okay and sooo?
    adoption isn't always a good option and sometimes the women is raped by a family member causing the child to have serve complications.
 
 
 
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