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Why do women want gender equality in the workplace, but not in dating? watch

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    (Original post by ANM775)
    I am going to record Suffragette Later on Channel 4

    Is it any good?

    Will it make me want to become a feminist.
    Only if you believe that the battles that those brave women had to fight are anything like the battles left today.

    Only if you don't do your own research from multi viewpoint sources.

    There are plenty of stories that won't be told.
    It is shocking to realise how few people know there is only 10 years between all men getting the vote and all women.
    My great grandfather was the first man in our family to be given the vote and he cast it on the same day that my great grandmother cast her vote in 1918.
    The same suffragettes were keen participants in the white feather campaign that was used to shame men and who also never had the vote into going to fight.
    That the majority of men that fought and died in the hell that were the battlefields of WWI didn't have the vote either.
    In the famous photograph of Pankhurst being arrested outside Buckingham Palace by a police sergeant there are two people that didn't have the vote in that photograph, both her and the policeman.

    So here is an idea....
    How about to balance suffragette you take a look at "The Red Pill" documentary by the award-winning feminist director Cassie Jaye?

    Current Third Wave intersectional Marxist feminism is a long way from suffragette.

    Do your own research and think outside the bubble.
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    Sounds like you're treating a group that literally contains half the human race as though it's monolithic and everyone wants the same things. It's technically possible to make a larger and less useful generalisation, but it would be difficult.
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    True gender equality is a sham and will likely never exist because of social and legal exceptions to this aspiration of 'equality'. People should just accept men and women are different in some regards and that it is okay to have exceptions and equality in everything really is not necessary.
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    Not all women are the same, and I don't adhere to any of your assumptions.
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    This could end up adding fuel to the fire but here goes.

    I am nearly 45, I have been with my ither now for almost 16 years ( since october 2002 ).

    In response to your 1st point of the 2nd list, she asked me out, we were both shy but she but the bullet and took a chance and asked me out.

    I suggested we went for a drink ( non alcoholic as she was driving and I don't drink ) so we went to a place where my dad ( now almost 1 year deceased ) worked in 1 of his 1st jobs, wr talked but both of us lead the conversation as we asked about each others likes/dislikes.

    I have asked her 2x to marry me but both times she has knocked me flat ( not physically) by saying she couldn't see the point of it ( a point she got from a friend if hers who didn't want to marry her fella but because of the dangerous nature of his job she would get nothing if he died ).

    My other half does not expect me to treat her or hold the door open, she knows if I have the money then I will treat her and hold door open if she's right behind me otherwise she's more than happy to open a door herself.

    She never asks me for my coat as she always wears her own.

    She also has no problem with either of us showing emotion.

    We do not live together so the household chore point is irrelevant.

    As has already been pointed out a relationship is reliant on both sides sharing responsibility for making it work otherwise there is absolutely no point being together.
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    (Original post by Maker)
    Write like a knob, get treated like one. Did you break the mirror?
    Don't blame my writing for your poor interpretational skills. The part about sex was said in jest. It should have been obvious. Or am I supposed to provide clear annotations and clarifications for the cognitively challenged?
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    (Original post by Just my opinion)
    Only if you believe that the battles that those brave women had to fight are anything like the battles left today.

    Only if you don't do your own research from multi viewpoint sources.

    There are plenty of stories that won't be told.
    It is shocking to realise how few people know there is only 10 years between all men getting the vote and all women.
    My great grandfather was the first man in our family to be given the vote and he cast it on the same day that my great grandmother cast her vote in 1918.
    The same suffragettes were keen participants in the white feather campaign that was used to shame men and who also never had the vote into going to fight.
    That the majority of men that fought and died in the hell that were the battlefields of WWI didn't have the vote either.
    In the famous photograph of Pankhurst being arrested outside Buckingham Palace by a police sergeant there are two people that didn't have the vote in that photograph, both her and the policeman.

    So here is an idea....
    How about to balance suffragette you take a look at "The Red Pill" documentary by the award-winning feminist director Cassie Jaye?

    Current Third Wave intersectional Marxist feminism is a long way from suffragette.

    Do your own research and think outside the bubble.
    I agree with this a lot. The suffragettes were also racist. They could recognize gender inequality but not racial inequality. They are not something feminists today should aspire to and I know that many of the younger generation already don't however the old still see to view the suffragettes as the epitome of female heroism
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    (Original post by snowman77)
    - put the majority of effort into sex (this is centered around pleasing the woman - the man's enjoyment is always assumed)
    http://theweek.com/articles/749978/f...-male-pleasure

    It's crazy that you think heterosexual sex is centered around pleasing women when the majority of men cannot even locate the clitorus! In our society heterosexual sex is entirely focused around male pleasure - the male orgasm is the main event and after this the sex is done. If sex is focused around female pleasure why do so many women report not recieving any?
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    Go your own way. Forget about women.
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    (Original post by MB043)
    This could end up adding fuel to the fire but here goes.

    I am nearly 45, I have been with my ither now for almost 16 years ( since october 2002 ).

    In response to your 1st point of the 2nd list, she asked me out, we were both shy but she but the bullet and took a chance and asked me out.

    I suggested we went for a drink ( non alcoholic as she was driving and I don't drink ) so we went to a place where my dad ( now almost 1 year deceased ) worked in 1 of his 1st jobs, wr talked but both of us lead the conversation as we asked about each others likes/dislikes.

    I have asked her 2x to marry me but both times she has knocked me flat ( not physically) by saying she couldn't see the point of it ( a point she got from a friend if hers who didn't want to marry her fella but because of the dangerous nature of his job she would get nothing if he died ).

    My other half does not expect me to treat her or hold the door open, she knows if I have the money then I will treat her and hold door open if she's right behind me otherwise she's more than happy to open a door herself.

    She never asks me for my coat as she always wears her own.

    She also has no problem with either of us showing emotion.

    We do not live together so the household chore point is irrelevant.

    As has already been pointed out a relationship is reliant on both sides sharing responsibility for making it work otherwise there is absolutely no point being together.
    People in unhappy relationships, and people who can't make a happy, stable relationship thanks to their bad attitude towards the whole thing, tend to be loud and vocal. People who are in a happy relationship have less to complain about and so we hear from them less often, but I suspect there are actually more of them out there. Thanks for reminding us of what the healthy norm is.
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    (Original post by snowman77)
    This is what I don't understand about the modern day gender equality/feminism movement. They want equality in some areas, but other areas they are happy for things to stay the same as long as they receive the benefit.

    Women want equal treatment in the workplace with their male colleagues. They want equal pay (FWIW the gender pay gap is a myth - same job for same hours get paid the same, otherwise it's illegal), they don't want to experience sexual harassment in the workplace (what about all the false accusations which ruin men's careers?), they want the same opportunities men have, they want equal opportunities for promotion (despite many of them taking time off for maternity leave).

    This is all fair enough. Except they don't want equality in dating. Men are still expected to:

    - ask the woman out and face possible rejection (women might give subtle hints, but under no circumstances will they ask the man out - that is "his job"
    - pay for the first date (and possible subsequent dates as well)
    - propose to the woman
    - treat her with meals/gifts
    - hold open the door for her
    - give up his coat if she's cold, so he can freeze (but never the other way around)
    - put the majority of effort into sex (this is centered around pleasing the woman - the man's enjoyment is always assumed)
    - be manly and dominant, never show any weak emotions, keep his problems bottled up because otherwise it's "unmanly"
    - household chores must now be shared. Women no longer have to do all the cooking and cleaning, it's shared equally between men, because otherwise it's gender discrimination/oppression. Despite the fact men are still seen as the primary breadwinner in the household and a man without a job is a virtual disaster.


    So back to the original question: Why do women want gender equality in the workplace (and indeed many other areas), but not in dating? I'm interested to hear to views of men, women and any feminists.
    Feminism - a joke that no one really gets.
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    (Original post by Dandaman1)
    There are indeed still sexist double standards in the dating world. The man is expected to be the proactive one and keep his lady happy, and it's always somehow our fault if things aren't fantastic in the bedroom. Everything is always our fault... And we can't have too many expectations or demand anything of our partners, oh no, because that's sexist, but it's okay for women to demand we do certain things, make sacrifices, and so on.

    But we put up with it for the sex...
    Christ I'd hate to be with a guy with this mindset.
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    Seriously man, your view of women is so far detached from reality it's been a roller-coaster to read. You need to stop assuming women are one homogenous group that are all the same and go talk to women as if they are really people... Because, well, they are.

    I would be interested to see any proof you have to substantiate your claim, because at the moment you just appear to be a bitter, angry person with no clear point.
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    (Original post by Dandaman1)
    Don't blame my writing for your poor interpretational skills. The part about sex was said in jest. It should have been obvious. Or am I supposed to provide clear annotations and clarifications for the cognitively challenged?
    Knob.
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    (Original post by snowman77)
    This is what I don't understand about the modern day gender equality/feminism movement. They want equality in some areas, but other areas they are happy for things to stay the same as long as they receive the benefit.

    Women want equal treatment in the workplace with their male colleagues. They want equal pay (FWIW the gender pay gap is a myth - same job for same hours get paid the same, otherwise it's illegal), they don't want to experience sexual harassment in the workplace (what about all the false accusations which ruin men's careers?), they want the same opportunities men have, they want equal opportunities for promotion (despite many of them taking time off for maternity leave).

    This is all fair enough. Except they don't want equality in dating. Men are still expected to:

    - ask the woman out and face possible rejection (women might give subtle hints, but under no circumstances will they ask the man out - that is "his job"
    - pay for the first date (and possible subsequent dates as well)
    - propose to the woman
    - treat her with meals/gifts
    - hold open the door for her
    - give up his coat if she's cold, so he can freeze (but never the other way around)
    - put the majority of effort into sex (this is centered around pleasing the woman - the man's enjoyment is always assumed)
    - be manly and dominant, never show any weak emotions, keep his problems bottled up because otherwise it's "unmanly"
    - household chores must now be shared. Women no longer have to do all the cooking and cleaning, it's shared equally between men, because otherwise it's gender discrimination/oppression. Despite the fact men are still seen as the primary breadwinner in the household and a man without a job is a virtual disaster.


    So back to the original question: Why do women want gender equality in the workplace (and indeed many other areas), but not in dating? I'm interested to hear to views of men, women and any feminists.
    please refrain from generalizing all women into one category in your mind which is clearly influenced by sexist media
    i suggest you expand your social circle as not all women are like so
    your argument for gender equality in relationships though to some extent is unfortunately true however i believe as feminists we are ever growing and expanding in our knowledge and views and how we ought to be treated.
    personally i think that the two are equal in relationships and the woman should not always be portrayed as a damsel in distress as that is highly sexist(even though many women want to be treated as such however it is the man's choice to either accommodate such behavior or walk out of the relationship but if he truly loves the women i dont see what is wrong with holding a door open for her or paying for nights out. this should be seen as a selfless loving gesture and not an oppressing demand). i believe both man and woman should be equal in the relationship and once its based on communication, the two can sort out whose 'responsibility' it is to pay for nights out and open doors for whom
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    and equality in everything really is not necessary.
    Cool. So it would be ok to discriminate against men? i.e. pay men less simply because they are men?
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    (Original post by ByEeek)
    Cool. So it would be ok to discriminate against men? i.e. pay men less simply because they are men?
    Common misconception by new age feminists; women are not paid less than men for the same jobs in the UK - this is not lawful. Statistics quoted by feminists regarding salary differences and demographics are due to things like career decisions by women e.g. to have kids etc.

    When it comes to specific industries e.g. entertainment, however, then of course, I really do not care if men are paid less than women - it is supply and demand. There is no reason why female footballers should get paid the same as men because no one really cares about watching women play football, for example, or why male models should be paid the same as women models...
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    Because feminists are complete hypocrites.
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    (Original post by snowman77)
    They are expecting men to ask them out, pay for things etc. but not taking their fair share.
    There was no need for the thread to carry on for this long.

    Not every woman is like that.

    End of story.
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    Common misconception by new age feminists; women are not paid less than men for the same jobs in the UK - this is not lawful.
    Sorry - yes, you are quite right. Let me rephrase the question. Would it be acceptable to promote women to higher grades, simply because they are women, thereby allowing them to earn more even though the actual day-to-day job they do is more or less the same as their lower grade male counter-parts?
 
 
 

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