Turn on thread page Beta

M469 – Irish Language Motion 2018 watch

    • Wiki Support Team
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    Wiki Support Team
    What is this?/I'm confused
    Hi there. If you're confused as to what is going on here then you are probably new to this section of TSR. This is a Model House of Commons, a forum where we emulate the structure of the Real Life House of Commons as an excuse to debate politics.

    If you are seeing this and you want to get involved in the debate, please feel free. You do not need to join a party, get approval or join any group to get stuck in right away. If you enjoy it and you do want to join a party then you can do so here. If you have any questions or need any help please message me. I am the current speaker of the house and part of my role involves offering impartial advice to new members so I will always be happy to answer what questions you have. Alternatively, you can read the new members guide to get advice on a wide range of issues.

    Note: Please refrain from making comments about how we spend our free time. It is our free time to spend.


    M469 – Irish Language Motion 2018, Saracen's Fez MP
    This House:–

    (1) Regrets the deadlock in the formation of a new devolved administration in Northern Ireland.

    (2) Recognises the fact that the Irish language is the oldest surviving language on the island of Ireland, and recognises the continuing existence of an Irish language community in Northern Ireland.

    (3) Regrets therefore that the Irish language is a sticking point in coalition negotiations in Northern Ireland.

    (4) Affirms its support for the rights of Irish language speakers, with a medium-term goal of a Northern Ireland fully bilingual in English and Irish at the official level.
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    Northern Ireland should not aim to become bilingual when the Irish language is a minor language; all minor languages in all countries should be discouraged.
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Jacob E)
    Northern Ireland should not aim to become bilingual when the Irish language is a minor language; all minor languages in all countries should be discouraged.
    Why should peoples cultures be discouraged
    • Wiki Support Team
    Online

    19
    ReputationRep:
    Wiki Support Team
    (Original post by Jacob E)
    Northern Ireland should not aim to become bilingual when the Irish language is a minor language; all minor languages in all countries should be discouraged.
    Why should the native language of the island of Ireland be discouraged there?
    • Community Assistant
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    Community Assistant
    Nay. Mainly because of 3 and 4.
    • Aston Villa FC Supporter
    • Political Ambassador
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    Aston Villa FC Supporter
    Political Ambassador
    1 and 2 are fine i guess. It’s not necessary to support Irish being an official language throughout everything, because that goes through a lot of effort for that to happen. Should there be sufficient demand for it, it’s fine and we have no reason to oppose it but is it truly worth it at this stage?
    Posted on the TSR App. Download from Apple or Google Play
    • Wiki Support Team
    Online

    19
    ReputationRep:
    Wiki Support Team
    (Original post by CountBrandenburg)
    1 and 2 are fine i guess. It’s not necessary to support Irish being an official language throughout everything, because that goes through a lot of effort for that to happen. Should there be sufficient demand for it, it’s fine and we have no reason to oppose it but is it truly worth it at this stage?
    Point 2 is in effect the reasoning for point 4: people in Northern Ireland who speak Irish, the oldest surviving language on the island of Ireland, should have the right to deal with their government through the medium of Irish.
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    Aye, this has my support.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    Aye from me.
    • Community Assistant
    • Political Ambassador
    Offline

    22
    ReputationRep:
    Community Assistant
    Political Ambassador
    4 is too divisive. Simple as.
    • Political Ambassador
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    Political Ambassador
    Aye. Still wary about 4
    • TSR Support Team
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    TSR Support Team
    (Original post by Saracen's Fez)
    Why should the native language of the island of Ireland be discouraged there?
    But it isn't the native language of the vast, vast, vast majority of people in Ireland (North or South). Okay, Irish was spoken in Ireland before English was - but that's not a good enough reason to spend a lot of money making unilingual areas officially bilingual (and that is, from what I gather, the purpose of an Irish Language Act - what's the point of having Irish street signs in Anglophone areas?) :confused:

    Both the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland should follow Finland's example and make both English and Irish dual official languages (no 'national' language and no language hierarchy). That would sort out many of these problems.
    • Wiki Support Team
    Online

    19
    ReputationRep:
    Wiki Support Team
    (Original post by Snufkin)
    But it isn't the native language of the vast, vast, vast majority of people in Ireland (North or South). Okay, Irish was spoken in Ireland before English was - but that's not a good enough reason to spend a lot of money making unilingual areas officially bilingual (and that is, from what I gather, the purpose of an Irish Language Act - what's the point of having Irish street signs in Anglophone areas?) :confused:

    Both the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland should follow Finland's example and make both English and Irish dual official languages (no 'national' language and no language hierarchy). That would sort out many of these problems.
    It's categorically not about who is in the majority, it's about the rights of an indigenous linguistic minority to use their native tongue in their dealings with their government in their nation. Co-official status (or de facto co-official status) would be the goal which should be reached in the medium term.
    • TSR Support Team
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    TSR Support Team
    (Original post by Saracen's Fez)
    It's categorically not about who is in the majority, it's about the rights of an indigenous linguistic minority to use their native tongue in their dealings with their government in their nation. Co-official status (or de facto co-official status) would be the goal which should be reached in the medium term.
    I don't disagree that speakers of Irish should be able to communicate with the state authorities in Irish (note that I said state, not local government - it's impractical to expect local governments to provide services in Irish unless there are a certain number of Irish speakers living there). In Finland there has to be at least 8% minority language speakers in a town before minority rights kick in, which seems sensible. But that is not what Sinn Fein want, rather than supporting Irish speaker's rights, they want to 'Irishise' English-speaking areas, which is unacceptable and a complete waste of money.

    I take issue with your use of 'indigenous' and 'their nation'. Northern Ireland is not a nation - it is a constituent country of the United Kingdom. English speakers in Northern Ireland are indigenous too, and NI is as much their country as it is Irish speakers. Your use of ethno-nationalist rhetoric is part of the problem. Irish and English should have equal official status, but it will never happen so long as Sinn Fein et al. treat English as an alien invader.
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    nay
    Offline

    11
    ReputationRep:
    Aye - I am half English, Half Irish (Republican) and think that it Irish Gaelic should continue to be taught and used in both north and south, although some, of course, will call me slightly biased. Nobody complains about the welsh, so why should we potentially deny Irish speakers the same rights?
    • TSR Support Team
    • Peer Support Volunteers
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    TSR Support Team
    Peer Support Volunteers
    St Andrews Agreement. That is all.

    (Also, hi everyone. I saw Irish language motion. Couldn't resist. Bye everyone).
    • TSR Support Team
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    TSR Support Team
    (Original post by Airmed)
    St Andrews Agreement. That is all.

    (Also, hi everyone. I saw Irish language motion. Couldn't resist. Bye everyone).
    But the St Andrews Agreement only says the Government will introduce an Irish Language Act, which no rational person has objected to. The problem is Sinn Fein wants a blank cheque; they haven't made any kind of proposal for what an Irish Language Act would look like, what would be in it, or how much it would cost. They've taken a minor language issue and blown it up into an argument about identity, purely for political reasons.
    • TSR Support Team
    • Peer Support Volunteers
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    TSR Support Team
    Peer Support Volunteers
    (Original post by Snufkin)
    But the St Andrews Agreement only says the Government will introduce an Irish Language Act, which no rational person has objected to. The problem is Sinn Fein wants a blank cheque; they haven't made any kind of proposal for what an Irish Language Act would look like, what would be in it, or how much it would cost. They've taken a minor language issue and blown it up into an argument about identity, purely for political reasons.
    In all honesty, I can't blame them when you have idiots like Gregory Campbell ****ging off the Irish language...I doubt we will ever have an Irish Language Act, so what I say doesn't really count. Nor does anything any of us say count.

    Anyway, best be off. This place is already starting to weird me out. :lol:
    • Community Assistant
    • Political Ambassador
    Online

    21
    ReputationRep:
    Community Assistant
    Political Ambassador
    I guess we could go the whole hog and go for direct rule so that the ethno-nationalists can get official language status next week for the like 5 people who actually want it.
 
 
 
Turn on thread page Beta
TSR Support Team

We have a brilliant team of more than 60 Support Team members looking after discussions on The Student Room, helping to make it a fun, safe and useful place to hang out.

Updated: February 14, 2018
Poll
How are you feeling in the run-up to Results Day 2018?

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.