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Uproar about new CancerResearchUK posters watch

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    (Original post by LauraB101)

    Just my opinion, I am sure I have opened a can of worms here
    that's OK; worms are a healthy option, containing high quality organic protein and only traces of sugars.
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    (Original post by LauraB101)
    The anti-fat shaming movement, I get. Many overweight children are severely bullied at school and suffer depression as a result, and what do overweight people do when they are feeling low? Continue to eat.

    If solving the obesity crisis were as simple as telling people not to eat, it wouldn't be a problem currently affecting 62% of the UK population who are classified as overweight or obese. Losing weight is a hard thing to stick at, as anyone who's ever tried dieting will tell you. Overweight people know that it is affecting their health, but flipping your current lifestyle on its head is easier said than done.

    However, this Sofie woman takes it one step further and says she is fat and doesn't care/will keep making herself bigger. Scientists unanimously agree that being overweight causes a whole host of health problems, and cancer is just one of them.

    I don't fundamentally disagree with the ad campaign from Cancer Research UK, but I think it could be worded differently as it is such a sensitive subject for people who are affected by it. For example, losing weight can improve life expectancy and reduce your risk of cancer by more than half. Labeling people will come off as a personal attack and not have the desired effect.At the end of the day, we don't live in confinement where you can control people's behaviours. They will continue to do as they please, and all you can do is inform people using appropriate methods.

    Just my opinion, I am sure I have opened a can of worms here
    You dont have to flip your lifestyle though. Just eat less and exercise more. Its not that hard. Dieting is a fad as even if your dieting if you are still consuming more calories than you are burning, you wont lose any weight.You need a calorie deficit .

    I dont blame overweight children for it, I blame their parents and imo it should be classed as Child Abuse.
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    I remember seeing it at the bus stop and thinking "oh dear here comes the Tumblr brigade".

    And indeed, here it came.
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    (Original post by Jack22031994)
    Dieting is a fad as even if your dieting if you are still consuming more calories than you are burning, you wont lose any weight.
    To be clear, I agree with the sentiment of the quote, as indeed the entire post. However, and it might seem pedantic to many, my borderline OCD stops me from failing to comment whenever I see that word misused like that.

    No-one means lose weight, when they say lose weight. They invariably mean lose bodyfat. So say bodyfat, if you mean bodyfat, please!!!

    It's hard to lose bodyfat, and calorie restrictive (ie starvation) diets are not the best option, in many professional experts opinion. Losing weight is easy. Anyone can lose two stone in under two seconds. With a chainsaw. Cut a leg off. They'd weigh less!

    Skeletal muscle weighs more than bodyfat, for the equivalent volume. One of the best ways to lose bodyfat is a combination of improved nutrition and exercise.

    In particular, quitting, or at least vastly reducing, alcohol, refined carbohydrate (eg white sugar, white flour) and processed and junk food. Replace with, as much as possible, home cooked meals (made in bulk, the majority frozen in portion sizes) made from fresh, raw, nutritious ingredients. It can work out substantially cheaper too.

    Exercise properly. Strength training like a non-pro power-lifter or bodybuilder. Compound, whole body work outs, with free weights, preferable dumbbells, when appropriate. This helps to develop stabilizing muscles, which would overall increase rate of progress. Machines should only be used by the infirm, disabled or recovering patients, imho. Plus get at the very least 30 mins decent cardio workout each day.

    But the key thing to bare in mind, and why I go off on one about weight =/= bodyfat. It you do the above, since muscle weighs more than bodyfat, bodyfat % could go down, whilst the number on the scales rises!

    If all the feedback is simple what is your mass, rather than what are the relative percentages bodyfat to skeletal muscle, it's impossible to accurately gauge improvement.

    Buy a cheap set of body composition scales. The numeric values will not be accurate, but the trends up or down will be.
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    (Original post by 303Pharma)
    To be clear, I agree with the sentiment of the quote, as indeed the entire post. However, and it might seem pedantic to many, my borderline OCD stops me from failing to comment whenever I see that word misused like that.

    No-one means lose weight, when they say lose weight. They invariably mean lose bodyfat. So say bodyfat, if you mean bodyfat!!!

    It's hard to lose bodyfat, and calorie restrictive (ie starvation) diets are not the best option, in many professional experts opinion. Losing weight is easy. Anyone can lose two stone in under two seconds. With a chainsaw. Cut a leg off. They'd weigh less!

    Skeletal muscle weighs more than bodyfat, for the equivalent volume. One of the best ways to lose bodyfat is a combination of improved nutrition and exercise.

    In particular, quitting, or at least vastly reducing, alcohol, refined carbohydrate (eg white sugar, white flour) and processed and junk food. Replace with, as much as possible, home cooked meals (made in bulk, the majority frozen in portion sizes) made from fresh, raw, nutritious ingredients. It can work out substantially cheaper too.

    Exercise properly. Strength training like a non-pro power-lifter or bodybuilder. Compound, whole body work outs, with free weights, preferable dumbbells, when appropriate. This helps to develop stabalising muscles, which would overall increase rate of progress. Machines should only be used by the infirm, disabled or recovering patients, imho.

    But the key thing to bare in mind, and why I go off on one about weight =/= bodyfat. It you do the above, since muscle weighs more than bodyfat, bodyfat % could go down, whilst the number on the scales rises!

    If all the feedback is simple what is your mass, rather than what are the relative percentages bodyfat to skeletal muscle, it's impossible to accurately gauge improvement.

    Buy a cheap set of body composition scales. The numeric values will not be accurate, but the trends up or down will be.
    Yes I do mean bodyfat, as you have pointed out, muscle weighs more than fat.

    Dont diet or be calorie restrictive (to an extent), but as you mentioned just exercise properly and eat well.

    I dont find it hard to do, and guess what? Ive never been fat/overweight
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    (Original post by Jack22031994)
    You dont have to flip your lifestyle though. Just eat less and exercise more. Its not that hard. Dieting is a fad as even if your dieting if you are still consuming more calories than you are burning, you wont lose any weight.You need a calorie deficit .

    I dont blame overweight children for it, I blame their parents and imo it should be classed as Child Abuse.
    Just to clarify, when I say 'dieting' I mean any form of creating a calorie deficit. I'm not sure what you mean when you say dieting still means you are consuming more calories than you are burning? Doesn't sound like a very efficient diet!

    For people to become obese in the first place, it means breaking a cycle of years of bad eating and lack of physical activity. Often when people increase exercise and reduce calorie consumption, they can only keep this up for a short time before they regain all of the weight lost, plus extra.

    Absolutely I agree, parents are responsible when children are overweight. Children are the ones suffering at both ends though, when they are overweight and bullied as a result.
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    (Original post by LauraB101)
    Just to clarify, when I say 'dieting' I mean any form of creating a calorie deficit. I'm not sure what you mean when you say dieting still means you are consuming more calories than you are burning? Doesn't sound like a very efficient diet!

    For people to become obese in the first place, it means breaking a cycle of years of bad eating and lack of physical activity. Often when people increase exercise and reduce calorie consumption, they can only keep this up for a short time before they regain all of the weight lost, plus extra.

    Absolutely I agree, parents are responsible when children are overweight. Children are the ones suffering at both ends though, when they are overweight and bullied as a result.
    I meant some people go on these 'diets,' and believe that it will solve their problems, but do no exercise alongside it.

    That is true but its still their responsibility to do so.

    The bullying is a side issue, and actually in some cases(from personal experience) can make them do something about it. An overweight kid at my school was bullied and over the summer he got ripped as hell because of it. Im not and never will condone bullying but without it, even he says he would still be fat now (9 years on).

    I care more about the children's health. Until we start convicting parents of child abuse, there will always be obese children. It may not surprise you that I dont believe people have a right to have a child either as some people are clearly not competent enough, but thats a different issue.

    In terms of adults though, Im sorry there is no excuse. All the information is freely available and it is a myth that healthy food is more expensive.
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    if smoking was a 'sensitive' subject like obesity and cancer research made a poster like that but saying smoking, would all smokers be offended?? i dont think so, we don't make a big deal when they make posters for smoking because it's obviously an unhealthy lifestyle so why should obesity be any different? yes losing weight is hard but its not impossible. they have a duty to inform the public about risk factors to cancer, imagine if they kept it all secret and lots of people got fat bc they thought it was fine... like seriously guys damn its not that deep, u wanna be fully informed or not edit: fat acceptance is something completely different to health and obesity. fat acceptance is to get people all around the world not to be embarrased or ashamed because they look a certain way. the obesity ad is not saying that all obese people or fat people are bad, they are just reminding people that it is the second main cause of cancer, no positive/negative opinion involved, just facts.
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    (Original post by Jack22031994)

    I dont find it hard to do, and guess what? Ive never been fat/overweight
    (Original post by Jack22031994)
    In terms of adults though, Im sorry there is no excuse. All the information is freely available and it is a myth that healthy food is more expensive.
    You are coming across as judgemental tbh. just because you havent experienced something doesn't mean it's not valid. I think fat acceptance is ludicrious but at the same time you and others on this thread seem to think that you can magically click your fingers and become thin. I am pudgy, I know this. I became pudgy partly because i comfort ate during a levels when i had undiagnosed depression (Have since been diagnosed and either dont eat enough or overeat now which is something im trying hard not to do) and because of PCOS which makes losing weight especially around your middle (where most of mine is) very hard and gaining it very easy. Other people gain weight because of antipsycotic medication or other medication (am still waiting to see if that will happen to me cos only recently started them) so it is not as simple as you make out. And before you say yes i am trying very hard to eat minimally and eat healthy things and finally got past the social anxiety of joining the gym.
    Yes some people are genuinely lazy and complicit but a lot of people are trying hard despite circumstances, these posters just make those sorts of people feel worse (everyone knows being overweight is bad) and wont do anything to change the minds of people who are genuinely lazy and cba.
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    (Original post by CoolCavy)
    You are coming across as judgemental tbh. just because you havent experienced something doesn't mean it's not valid. I think fat acceptance is ludicrious but at the same time you and others on this thread seem to think that you can magically click your fingers and become thin. I am pudgy, I know this. I became pudgy partly because i comfort ate during a levels when i had undiagnosed depression (Have since been diagnosed and either dont eat enough or overeat now which is something im trying hard not to do) and because of PCOS which makes losing weight especially around your middle (where most of mine is) very hard and gaining it very easy. Other people gain weight because of antipsycotic medication or other medication (am still waiting to see if that will happen to me cos only recently started them) so it is not as simple as you make out. And before you say yes i am trying very hard to eat minimally and eat healthy things and finally got past the social anxiety of joining the gym.
    Yes some people are genuinely lazy and complicit but a lot of people are trying hard despite circumstances, these posters just make those sorts of people feel worse (everyone knows being overweight is bad) and wont do anything to change the minds of people who are genuinely lazy and cba.
    I havent meant to come across as judgemental, so I do apologise.Of course not everyone who is overweight is a lazy layabout. I shouldve been more careful with my words so again, I do apologise.

    Im glad you've made steps forward in that regard.

    However, on the poster, what else do you want CancerResearch to do? They havent lied. As some smokers have said, smokers dont react the same to posters of this ilk, that say the same thing about smoking.
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    (Original post by simon_g)
    "(..)
    Cancer Research UK is a research and awareness charity based out of the United Kingdom. It also happens to be the world’s largest independent cancer charity and conducts research into the prevention, diagnosis, and treatment of the disease. In other words, you can trust these people to be experts on all things cancer.(..)"

    https://squawker.org/culture-wars/fatcancer/

    warning- graphic photos.

    what are your thoughts about it?
    It the same old story of my identity or my feelings supersede reality
    Posted on the TSR App. Download from Apple or Google Play
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    (Original post by Jack22031994)
    I havent meant to come across as judgemental, so I do apologise.Of course not everyone who is overweight is a lazy layabout. I shouldve been more careful with my words so again, I do apologise.

    Im glad you've made steps forward in that regard.

    However, on the poster, what else do you want CancerResearch to do? They havent lied. As some smokers have said, smokers dont react the same to posters of this ilk, that say the same thing about smoking.
    That's ok, thanks for saying that

    and nothing really, i just dont think it is a good use of their money because if people are trying to lose weight who are overweight (there are a surprising number of those people at the gym which is admirable) they already know it's bad to be overweight and doctor's are always talking about BMI and stuff and the people like those in the article aren't going to change their ways cos they are lazy and set in their ways
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    Well when cancer charities contantly push for "cake and tea" coffee mornings to raise money for charity it's hardly suprising loads of people are fat.

    The elephant in the room with all of this is how bad the offficial healthy diet is for humans. More meat and less carbs is the best way to drop weight. But try telling a doctor that. If you are diabetic that is the best thing you can do to control your desease. But good luck getting it past a health profesional. There is much bigger problems with public health and the science (or lack thereof) than some people on Tumblr.

    To me poeple who are severly overweight occupy the same space in my head as drug abusers do. It isn't good for them but I'm nto going to be unhelpfully judgemental about it and more often than not the standard mainstream repsonse from society is crual, moralising and doesn't even work and nor does it address the real issues causing the problem.
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    (Original post by CoolCavy)
    That's ok, thanks for saying that

    and nothing really, i just dont think it is a good use of their money because if people are trying to lose weight who are overweight (there are a surprising number of those people at the gym which is admirable) they already know it's bad to be overweight and doctor's are always talking about BMI and stuff and the people like those in the article aren't going to change their ways cos they are lazy and set in their ways
    No problem.

    I suppose you have a point there. I jumped to conclusions to fast!
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    One comedian who is currently writing a book (so needs publicity) complained. The majority of people are siding with cancer research.
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    Fat shaming is completley wrong but Cancer Research are simpley trying to raise awarness for one of the biggest risks of increasing the chance of cancer
    other than smoking and genetics. This is to encourage more people to change their lifestyle for the better, but if people don't want to that's there decision.
    The Doctors and Scientists researching what causes an increased risk have carried out enough studies to definitively say that there is a direct link between
    the percentage of body fat and an increased risk of not only just cancer but diabetes as well.

    For Sophie to say "BMI has been debunked" is correct it is not the most accurate way to measure body mass/body fat. But for her to say "This campaign is
    incredibly damaging" and "How the f*** is this okay?" is just wow...nobody is fat shaming just telling people the links found, if these adverts and campaigns
    didn't exist then an even greater proportion of the population would be at risk. I know people around me that have quit smoking and cut what they eat
    becuase they don't want to put those closest to them through the struggles of cancer treatment if it happens to them.
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    (Original post by The PoliticalGuy)
    Ugh.

    Another charity that pays its CEO 200k+ and pleads for money in adverts.

    Shocking how people continue to donate to them.
    Cancer Research UK's CEO salary is only 140K which is remarkably low relative to the charities income and a small fraction of what a private sector CEO of an equivalent size company would be making. Only National Trust and Oxfam pay their CEO a lower amount relative to the charities income and even then not by much.

    Being a CEO of a £300,000,000 a year charity is not exactly something you can do part time as a volunteer.
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    My main criticism would really be that they're not using behavioural science to guide the campaign. Most obese people know it is bad for their health. Telling them again won't do much. It's a lot of money spent on techniques already shown as ineffective that will at best achieve an increase in anxiety without improving outcomes elsewhere.
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    I don’t believe CRUK has any motive other than to bring in more cash for themselves. I don’t think a charity (that spent millions on having a garden at Chelsea flower show) should be deciding on priorities for cancer research. There’s plenty of science showing that fat shaming campaigns are ineffective at changing behaviour...they’ve just paid an advertising agency to come up with something to make them look like they’re doing something.

    Give to macmillan instead of these chumps.
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    (Original post by PQ)
    I don’t believe CRUK has any motive other than to bring in more cash for themselves. I don’t think a charity (that spent millions on having a garden at Chelsea flower show) should be deciding on priorities for cancer research. There’s plenty of science showing that fat shaming campaigns are ineffective at changing behaviour...they’ve just paid an advertising agency to come up with something to make them look like they’re doing something.

    Give to macmillan instead of these chumps.
    A charity called cancer research shouldn’t be helping decide priorities for cancer research. Right.
 
 
 
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