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    • Thread Starter
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    Hi,

    Im really confused about each cardio condition can relate to its heart murmur sounds?

    Eg. Aortic stenosis and pulmpnary stenosis leading to ejection systolic and not late systolic etc?

    is there any way of understanding for all conditions or a thinking pattern that
    im missing?


    or is it just memorizing all of them?

    thanks alot
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    (Original post by Anonymous)
    Hi,

    Im really confused about each cardio condition can relate to its heart murmur sounds?

    Eg. Aortic stenosis and pulmpnary stenosis leading to ejection systolic and not late systolic etc?

    is there any way of understanding for all conditions or a thinking pattern that
    im missing?


    or is it just memorizing all of them?

    thanks alot
    (1) Remember / memorise that aortic stenosis is ejection systolic (it's worth memorising since it's the most common cause of murmurs)

    (2) Then know that if you change any one word, it reverses the murmur - so aortic regurgitation gives you a diastolic murmur, or mitral stenosis gives you a diastolic murmur. If you change 2 words, then it's the same = hence mitral regurgitation is a systolic murmur

    (3) If you want to know why mitral stenosis gives you an pan systolic murmur - think pressure gradient. Literally within the first 5 millisecond that the ventricle starts pumping, the LV pressure > LA pressure so it is pan (i.e. entire of) systolic.

    As opposed to ejection systolic murmur, which means the LV pressure has to > aortic pressure (takes longer than 5 milliseconds) before you can hear a murmur. It's also shorter because when aortic pressure > LV pressure, the murmur stops.

    Btw mitral = tricuspid and aortic = pulmonary (in simple terms for the distolic / systolic murmurs)
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    I always found MR PAN a useful way of remembering mitral regurg is pansystolic.

    Also AS(K)MR ARMS as a way of remembering if they're systolic or diastolic. So aortic stenosis - mitral regurg, than aortic regurg and mitral stenosis, it also helps you kinda work out the order. So like AS is ejection systolic, then MR is pansystolic etc.

    If you think about it with this diagram it makes sense

    • #1
    • Thread Starter
    #1

    (Original post by ecolier)
    (1) Remember / memorise that aortic stenosis is ejection systolic (it's worth memorising since it's the most common cause of murmurs)

    (2) Then know that if you change any one word, it reverses the murmur - so aortic regurgitation gives you a diastolic murmur, or mitral stenosis gives you a diastolic murmur. If you change 2 words, then it's the same = hence mitral regurgitation is a systolic murmur

    (3) If you want to know why mitral stenosis gives you an pan systolic murmur - think pressure gradient. Literally within the first 5 millisecond that the ventricle starts pumping, the LV pressure > LA pressure so it is pan (i.e. entire of) systolic.

    As opposed to ejection systolic murmur, which means the LV pressure has to > aortic pressure (takes longer than 5 milliseconds) before you can hear a murmur. It's also shorter because when aortic pressure > LV pressure, the murmur stops.

    Btw mitral = tricuspid and aortic = pulmonary (in simple terms for the distolic / systolic murmurs)
    .
    thank you soooo much
    • #1
    • Thread Starter
    #1

    (Original post by ecolier)
    (1) Remember / memorise that aortic stenosis is ejection systolic (it's worth memorising since it's the most common cause of murmurs)

    (2) Then know that if you change any one word, it reverses the murmur - so aortic regurgitation gives you a diastolic murmur, or mitral stenosis gives you a diastolic murmur. If you change 2 words, then it's the same = hence mitral regurgitation is a systolic murmur

    (3) If you want to know why mitral stenosis gives you an pan systolic murmur - think pressure gradient. Literally within the first 5 millisecond that the ventricle starts pumping, the LV pressure > LA pressure so it is pan (i.e. entire of) systolic.

    As opposed to ejection systolic murmur, which means the LV pressure has to > aortic pressure (takes longer than 5 milliseconds) before you can hear a murmur. It's also shorter because when aortic pressure > LV pressure, the murmur stops.

    Btw mitral = tricuspid and aortic = pulmonary (in simple terms for the distolic / systolic murmurs)
    .


    thank you soooo much!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! how about other things like


    coarctation of the aorta- mid systolic murmur, maximal over back and mitral valve prolapse =


    late systolic murmur




    is there any thinking process behind these?
 
 
 
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