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    As a UK student wanting to study medicine in America I wasn't sure if we still had to go to pre medical school because we would have already studied similar subjects at A level. Does anybody know if we still have to go to pre med school? If so what subjects are taught at pre med?
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    (Original post by Hollyjones159)
    As a UK student wanting to study medicine in America I wasn't sure if we still had to go to pre medical school because we would have already studied similar subjects at A level. Does anybody know if we still have to go to pre med school? If so what subjects are taught at pre med?
    Medicine is a graduate only entry degree in America. A-levels won't come close to the pre-med requirements (i.e. degree level knowledge).

    It isn't common for UK students to study medicine over there and you would really have to research if our 3 year degrees would cover enough to satisfy entry requirements. You might be better studying a pre-med type degree in America. As long as you have a lot of cash to spare, of course.

    Realistically you'd be better studying medicine here and sitting the USMLE. But it is notoriously difficult to get into America and international medical graduates are often limited to what speciality they can get into (i.e. the less desirable ones).
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    (Original post by Hollyjones159)
    If so what subjects are taught at pre med?
    Scroll down to Requirements (this is just for one med school, but it'll give you an idea):

    https://medicaleducation.weill.corne...a-requirements

    And some more general info here:

    https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/wik...ine_in_the_USA

    You would have a much higher chance of getting an offer here in the UK. Is there a particular reason why you want to study medicine in the USA?
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    The premed curriculum extends beyond A-level - also specifically US medical schools a) require at least 1 year of undergraduate science study at a recognized US college (aka university) and b) normally only accept credit from high school courses in these areas up to a certain limit, and normally require you to have studied similar subjects at university to a higher level in lieu (this is less critical for Physics, normally).

    In any case, the organic chemistry and biochemistry requirements are beyond the scope of any high school curricula at the very least. More generally it's not "pre med school" - it's just, university, during which you take the relevant subjects. The specific subjects required vary a little between medical schools but are generally:

    Spoiler:
    Show

    A one year sequence in biology (this would roughly equate to one quarter of a year in the UK - so usually this is two modules, or one paper at Oxbridge, for example). This should cover both aspects of molecular and cell biology as well as ecology and physiology normally.

    A two year sequence in chemistry (roughly equivalent to half a year of a UK degree, but the nature of the requirements means you'll inevitably doe this as again, roughly a quarter of a year course content over two years) covering "general" chemistry, which is inorganic and physical chemistry similar to but ultimately an extension of the A-level course, and organic chemistry/biochemistry. The latter element would normally be at least second term organic chemistry content if not second year in the UK, normally all the usual reaction mechanisms and so on, and then either a second semester course in organic chemistry (which continues some of the core material but often goes into unnecessary aspects of synthetic chemistry) or a course in biochemistry/biological chemistry. Some will accept "interwoven" courses of chemistry and biochemistry.

    A one year sequence in physics (sometimes specifically calculus based - which would eliminate A-level as a possibility to satisfy this requirement, although any courses you take in the UK in this area would be calculus based) covering "general" physics - in the US this is mainly classical (vector, not required to be analytical!) mechanics and electromagnetism primarily, with some reference to thermal physics and quantum phenomena (this is usually just up to wave-particle duality and aspects of uncertainty, similar to in A-level although perhaps a little more detail on the latter). This is the requirement which will, in almost all cases, be impossible to fulfill on a UK course. The only ones I can think of where you could are Cambridge NatSci (taking Part IA Physics) Durham NatSci (maybe, taking one of the the relevant physics modules in first year) and Southampton NatSci (taking Phys 1011, 1013, and 1015 at some point).

    Also frequently required is some maths background - usually at least a semester (single module) in calculus, and often either a second semester in calculus or a semester in statistics. A maths methods course which would be about a quarter of one years credits in the UK would suffice for this, and A-level Maths would probably satisfy the calculus background (I highly doubt even taking statistics options in Maths and FM would satisfy any stats requirement or a second semester of calculus as a requirement).

    Finally, much more nebuously it's often indicated that some requirement of English (in terms of writing)is required, as virtually all colleges have their first years take a yearlong "English" or writing sequence, and increasingly some social science background (some elements of sociology and slightly more of psychology is now on the MCAT I believe). Strictly speaking, by the end of the degree you will be at a suitable level of academic writing, but demonstrating this may be awkward. The social science stuff is less of a "you need to take this specific course content" and more "you need to be able to understand these are people and not petri dishes".


    Thus, it's very unlikely you can satisfy all the criteria, even leaving aside the almost ubiquitous (or possibly ubiquitous) requirement of studying science in the US for at least one year. However, there are a number of "postbaccalaureate premedical" programmes, which are often non-degree or certificate type programmes where you'll take the relevant pre-med courses over ~2 years (usually while working in a relevant field as work experience part time). However such programmes are a) usually for students who are "career changers" i.e. haven't done a great deal of science in their undergraduate studies - often if you've covered more than half the required subjects, you won't be eligible and b) due to the fact that these courses are necessarily part time (due to the UG teaching schedules and the chemistry-organic chemistry sequence being done over 2 years) which may make it impossible to get an appropriate visa.

    There are a few masters programmes there however which include the opportunity to cover areas you've missed (or for students who have taken them previously and done poorly, retake those subjects) along with more advanced options (usually in biomedical areas) and a masters project or thesis usually. These "improvers" programmes may be your best bet as a result (unless you have dual citizenship). Either way though, both sets of programmes are extremely expensive with virtually no funding unless you're from an underrepresented minority in medicine typically.

    Some medical schools may exercise a degree of discretion in this matter depending on your background, but even then you're in competition with a lot of other students, and international students are at an even higher rate of competition normally similar to here in the UK. Realistically, you're better off doing your primary medical qualification in the UK and applying for a residency or fellowship in the US and then trying to secure a permanent visa to continue working there. Bear in mind though, residency match rates for international students are very low and you would need really outstanding performance in medical school (and relevant publications etc) for most programmes. You may be a little better positioned in a very unpopular specialty which has a great demand (like rural/family medicine usually). I believe fellowships aren't as unduly competitive as residency spots, or rather they're about as competitive for US doctors as international ones, and they're often shorter and it's not as uncommon for international doctors to get a visa for the 1-2 years or so as I understand.

    You may want to ask/read around on studentdoctor.net which is a forum which focuses around US medical studies and professions, for more insight.
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    (Original post by Hollyjones159)
    As a UK student wanting to study medicine in America I wasn't sure if we still had to go to pre medical school because we would have already studied similar subjects at A level. Does anybody know if we still have to go to pre med school? If so what subjects are taught at pre med?
    You would still have to go to pre-medical school for 4 years. In the US, you would do organic chemistry, biology, chemistry and most likely a course or two of english and physics. In actuality, the US pre-med curriculum is quite rigorous and wouldn't be a simple repeat of your A-levels.
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    (Original post by artful_lounger)
    The premed curriculum extends beyond A-level - also specifically US medical schools a) require at least 1 year of undergraduate science study at a recognized US college (aka university) and b) normally only accept credit from high school courses in these areas up to a certain limit, and normally require you to have studied similar subjects at university to a higher level in lieu (this is less critical for Physics, normally).

    In any case, the organic chemistry and biochemistry requirements are beyond the scope of any high school curricula at the very least. More generally it's not "pre med school" - it's just, university, during which you take the relevant subjects. The specific subjects required vary a little between medical schools but are generally:

    Spoiler:
    Show





    A one year sequence in biology (this would roughly equate to one quarter of a year in the UK - so usually this is two modules, or one paper at Oxbridge, for example). This should cover both aspects of molecular and cell biology as well as ecology and physiology normally.

    A two year sequence in chemistry (roughly equivalent to half a year of a UK degree, but the nature of the requirements means you'll inevitably doe this as again, roughly a quarter of a year course content over two years) covering "general" chemistry, which is inorganic and physical chemistry similar to but ultimately an extension of the A-level course, and organic chemistry/biochemistry. The latter element would normally be at least second term organic chemistry content if not second year in the UK, normally all the usual reaction mechanisms and so on, and then either a second semester course in organic chemistry (which continues some of the core material but often goes into unnecessary aspects of synthetic chemistry) or a course in biochemistry/biological chemistry. Some will accept "interwoven" courses of chemistry and biochemistry.

    A one year sequence in physics (sometimes specifically calculus based - which would eliminate A-level as a possibility to satisfy this requirement, although any courses you take in the UK in this area would be calculus based) covering "general" physics - in the US this is mainly classical (vector, not required to be analytical!) mechanics and electromagnetism primarily, with some reference to thermal physics and quantum phenomena (this is usually just up to wave-particle duality and aspects of uncertainty, similar to in A-level although perhaps a little more detail on the latter). This is the requirement which will, in almost all cases, be impossible to fulfill on a UK course. The only ones I can think of where you could are Cambridge NatSci (taking Part IA Physics) Durham NatSci (maybe, taking one of the the relevant physics modules in first year) and Southampton NatSci (taking Phys 1011, 1013, and 1015 at some point).

    Also frequently required is some maths background - usually at least a semester (single module) in calculus, and often either a second semester in calculus or a semester in statistics. A maths methods course which would be about a quarter of one years credits in the UK would suffice for this, and A-level Maths would probably satisfy the calculus background (I highly doubt even taking statistics options in Maths and FM would satisfy any stats requirement or a second semester of calculus as a requirement).

    Finally, much more nebuously it's often indicated that some requirement of English (in terms of writing)is required, as virtually all colleges have their first years take a yearlong "English" or writing sequence, and increasingly some social science background (some elements of sociology and slightly more of psychology is now on the MCAT I believe). Strictly speaking, by the end of the degree you will be at a suitable level of academic writing, but demonstrating this may be awkward. The social science stuff is less of a "you need to take this specific course content" and more "you need to be able to understand these are people and not petri dishes".






    Thus, it's very unlikely you can satisfy all the criteria, even leaving aside the almost ubiquitous (or possibly ubiquitous) requirement of studying science in the US for at least one year. However, there are a number of "postbaccalaureate premedical" programmes, which are often non-degree or certificate type programmes where you'll take the relevant pre-med courses over ~2 years (usually while working in a relevant field as work experience part time). However such programmes are a) usually for students who are "career changers" i.e. haven't done a great deal of science in their undergraduate studies - often if you've covered more than half the required subjects, you won't be eligible and b) due to the fact that these courses are necessarily part time (due to the UG teaching schedules and the chemistry-organic chemistry sequence being done over 2 years) which may make it impossible to get an appropriate visa.

    There are a few masters programmes there however which include the opportunity to cover areas you've missed (or for students who have taken them previously and done poorly, retake those subjects) along with more advanced options (usually in biomedical areas) and a masters project or thesis usually. These "improvers" programmes may be your best bet as a result (unless you have dual citizenship). Either way though, both sets of programmes are extremely expensive with virtually no funding unless you're from an underrepresented minority in medicine typically.

    Some medical schools may exercise a degree of discretion in this matter depending on your background, but even then you're in competition with a lot of other students, and international students are at an even higher rate of competition normally similar to here in the UK. Realistically, you're better off doing your primary medical qualification in the UK and applying for a residency or fellowship in the US and then trying to secure a permanent visa to continue working there. Bear in mind though, residency match rates for international students are very low and you would need really outstanding performance in medical school (and relevant publications etc) for most programmes. You may be a little better positioned in a very unpopular specialty which has a great demand (like rural/family medicine usually). I believe fellowships aren't as unduly competitive as residency spots, or rather they're about as competitive for US doctors as international ones, and they're often shorter and it's not as uncommon for international doctors to get a visa for the 1-2 years or so as I understand.

    You may want to ask/read around on studentdoctor.net which is a forum which focuses around US medical studies and professions, for more insight.
    (Original post by Okorange)
    You would still have to go to pre-medical school for 4 years. In the US, you would do organic chemistry, biology, chemistry and most likely a course or two of english and physics. In actuality, the US pre-med curriculum is quite rigorous and wouldn't be a simple repeat of your A-levels.
    A Level Chemistry and A Level Biology are actually studied in college in America. If you do some MCAT practise papers, you can actually do a large proportion of chemistry questions with solely A Level knowledge.

    They don't study organic chemistry at all in high school, unless they've got a special curriculum going on at the school.

    Thats why their degree is 4 years long
 
 
 
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