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The case for a white identity politics watch

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    Not that long ago, I strongly agreed with The argument that only someone with nothing else to be proud could be proud about being white. I have since changed my mind completely on this issue. So as a straight white male (who isn’t necessarily ‘proud’ of these things, but certainly isn’t ashamed of them either, i thought I’d argue the case for white identity politics by examining the 2 main arguments made against it.


    1: (basically left wing) white people have a unique or at least particularly toxic legacy on the world. Other ethnicities are engaging in identity politics as a legitimate form of resistance.

    2: (basically right wing) identity politics is dumb- we should be concerned with individual merit not accidents of birth.
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    1: History and current events show that all minorities have exactly the same capacity to do evil and regularly do so.

    The fact that white peoples were simply more successful as it should not excuse the fact that if they could have done it, they would have.

    Additionally, things are rarely one dimensional. For instance, it was white Christians that abolished slavery, it was black slavers who SOLD their wares (who would have been slaves anyway) and that slavery continued under the Barbary states.

    As for the aspect of resistance: it seems plausible from a left wing analysis that the WWC have been assaulted by a capitalist class that promotes mass migration to decrease wages and fragment resistance to business interests. High social capital (found in homogenous societies) is anathema to big business.
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    2: Even if you do cynically believes that there’s no reason to be proud of your country and are solely concerned with individual rights, you find yourself also in a predicament.

    Because whilst you may believe in those things, a clear majority of minority’s do- or at least will understandably vote for what is in their interests eg*, and this is unlikely to change as these minorities grow- or may indeed get worse- incentivising the need to form a collective of classical liberals (which is more or less a white interest group)

    Anecdotally I’m friends with a Nigerian economics students who is to the right of me economically who votes labour without thinking because it is rightly economically in his self interest to do so (and at the expense of others/ society)

    *https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.t...eats-2017/amp/
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    Addendum

    A white interest group may also begin to offer solutions as to some oft neglected points of interest:

    Why do white males have such a high suicide rate?

    Why do WWC boys do so badly at school when compared with minorities ?

    Why were vulnerable girls marginalised and ignored in areas like Telford and how can we address the media and political black out (or even blaming of the victims)?
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    Not that long ago, I strongly agreed with The argument that only someone with nothing else to be proud could be proud about being white. I have since changed my mind completely on this issue. So as a straight white male (who isn’t necessarily ‘proud’ of these things, but certainly isn’t ashamed of them either, i thought I’d argue the case for white identity politics by examining the 2 main arguments made against it.


    1: (basically left wing) white people have a unique or at least particularly toxic legacy on the world. Other ethnicities are engaging in identity politics as a legitimate form of resistance.

    2: (basically right wing) identity politics is dumb- we should be concerned with individual merit not accidents of birth.
    I'm on the left and I hate identity politics. The idea that people should think, act and vote one way just because of their religion/race/ethnicity is totally bizarre.

    The last thing we need is the right engaging in it too. Though with Trump, it's already kinda happened.
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    (Original post by DeBruyne18)
    I'm on the left and I hate identity politics. The idea that people should think, act and vote one way just because of their religion/race/ethnicity is totally bizarre.
    What about sexuality or gender or class?
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    What about sexuality or gender or class?
    I oppose that too.

    But i'm left wing for economic reasons and however annoyed I may get at people on my side (and I do), ultimately the right are never going to propose the economic policies to win me over.
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    (Original post by DeBruyne18)
    I oppose that too.

    But i'm left wing for economic reasons and however annoyed I may get at people on my side (and I do), ultimately the right are never going to propose the economic policies to win me over.
    What about the economic policies of the Front nationale in France which were to the left of Macron?
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    What about the economic policies of the Front nationale in France which were to the left of Macron?
    I'm sure there would be some areas of agreement but I find their social policies, overt nationalism and identity politics too off-putting. Don't like Macron though. He's basically a French Osborne.

    I would be willing to accept some social conservatism if it meant some serious investment into our economy and public services but NF are a step top far at the moment though!
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    American identity politics should remain in America, they are not applicable to the UK and the rest of the world at all.

    That said, there's nothing wrong with being proud of your heritage or country. I respect people who are proud of their culture and country no matter where they come from. The problem comes from the fact that being 'white' or any other skin colour in itself isn't anything to be proud of. There's no cultural value in a person's skin.

    I mean, take Turkey for example. People with fair skin and blue eyes are just as Turkish as those with darker skin colour. The people are united by their shared heritage, values, and culture. Now that's something to be proud of.
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    (Original post by DeBruyne18)
    but I find their social policies, overt nationalism and identity politics too off-putting.
    Why?
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    (Original post by VászolySzilvia)
    American identity politics should remain in America, they are not applicable to the UK and the rest of the world at all.
    The identitarisn movement began in France and spread throughout Europe. This is a western phenomenon

    That said, there's nothing wrong with being proud of your heritage or country. I respect people who are proud of their culture and country no matter where they come from. The problem comes from the fact that being 'white' or any other skin colour in itself isn't anything to be proud of. There's no cultural value in a person's skin.
    It’s more than just skin colour- eg albino Africans are not ‘white’ and would be offended if they were referred to as so!

    I mean, take Turkey for example. People with fair skin and blue eyes are just as Turkish as those with darker skin colour. The people are united by their shared heritage, values, and culture. Now that's something to be proud of.
    Not an expert on turkey but I’m not so sure. Most Caucasian Turks I meet are all horrified for instance with Erdogan, whereas more Arabic ones love him- as well as differences in religousosity and culture. I would say that Caucasian Turkish culture has been eroded to Arabic Turkish culture.,
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    (Original post by VászolySzilvia)
    American identity politics should remain in America, they are not applicable to the UK and the rest of the world at all.

    That said, there's nothing wrong with being proud of your heritage or country. I respect people who are proud of their culture and country no matter where they come from. The problem comes from the fact that being 'white' or any other skin colour in itself isn't anything to be proud of. There's no cultural value in a person's skin.

    I mean, take Turkey for example. People with fair skin and blue eyes are just as Turkish as those with darker skin colour. The people are united by their shared heritage, values, and culture. Now that's something to be proud of.
    so then why is it okay for black people to be proud of their skin colour or brown people being proud for being brown lol. I acc kind of agree with what your saying but there's no denying that people generally express pride over their skin colour, everyone, except white people... lol
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    I agree with identity politics, if other races are aloud to do it, so should whites. All races should be able to take pride in themselves and should want to better themselves.
    However, I think it being in places like America is retarded considering the fact America has always been a melting pot, a multicultural nation.
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    (Original post by justanotherchica)
    so then why is it okay for black people to be proud of their skin colour or brown people being proud for being brown lol. I acc kind of agree with what your saying but there's no denying that people generally express pride over their skin colour, everyone, except white people... lol
    Eh, for some people their skin colour forms a part of their personal identity. It's just a thing that people are taught in America and are raised with that idea in mind.
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    Why?
    For starters I don't like identity politics or nationalism. The NG espouse both.
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    (Original post by DeBruyne18)
    For starters I don't like identity politics or nationalism. The NG espouse both.
    Yeah so why do you not like identity politics or nationalism?
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    (Original post by DeBruyne18)
    I oppose that too.
    Forgot to go into this. So you oppose class or sexual politics. Presumably you think it was legitimate then because of the obvious barriers they faced but that it’s no longer the case today, so it’s not necessary?
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    Forgot to go into this. So you oppose class or sexual politics. Presumably you think it was legitimate then because of the obvious barriers they faced but that it’s no longer the case today, so it’s not necessary?
    Pretty much. For example I have a great admiration and respect for second wave feminists who campaigned for and achieved real equality in law for women. Third wave feminism I'm much less enthusiastic about.

    I very much dislike people thinking, voting or acting a certain way just because of their demographics. I hate identity politics on the left and it actually tends to come more from the centre left liberals like Clinton, rather than the economic left wing like Sanders.

    For example I'm a white male but a back female social democrat would represent me better than a right wing white male, for example.
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    (Original post by Davij038)
    The identitarisn movement began in France and spread throughout Europe. This is a western phenomenon
    Identitarians maybe, but this distinction between 'white' and 'black' and all other skin tones is an American social construct, and realistically speaking it's mostly Americans reinforcing it.

    (Original post by Davij038)
    It’s more than just skin colour- eg albino Africans are not ‘white’ and would be offended if they were referred to as so!
    Exactly, forming an identity based on skin colour is pointless, and in this case can be harmful.

    (Original post by Davij038)
    Not an expert on turkey but I’m not so sure. Most Caucasian Turks I meet are all horrified for instance with Erdogan, whereas more Arabic ones love him- as well as differences in religousosity and culture. I would say that Caucasian Turkish culture has been eroded to Arabic Turkish culture.,
    As far as politics are concerned yes, there are geographical areas more likely to vote for one sort of party than another. In general though Turkey is quite a mixed bag in terms of genetics: this person and this person look like they're from completely different countries yet they both likely have parents born in Turkey.
 
 
 

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