the bear
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Great news;

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-4367195...e=news_central
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Retired_Messiah
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#2
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That's both of them doing better now. Jolly good
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icequeenTM
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beaconoflight888
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Maybe they were never poisoned in the first place. This is not the first attempt at anti-Putin propaganda by means of a false flag event.

Porton Down is only 8 miles from the site of the attack.
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the bear
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(Original post by beaconoflight888)
Maybe they were never poisoned in the first place. This is not the first attempt at anti-Putin propaganda by means of a false flag event.

Porton Down is only 8 miles from the site of the attack.
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the bear
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(Original post by beaconoflight888)
Maybe they were never poisoned in the first place. This is not the first attempt at anti-Putin propaganda by means of a false flag event.

Porton Down is only 8 miles from the site of the attack.
are you familiar with this building ?

https://qz.com/wp-content/uploads/20...y=80&strip=all
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uberteknik
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The cat is adamant it had nothing to do with the loss of both guinea pigs.

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the bear
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(Original post by uberteknik)
The cat is adamant it had nothing top do with the loss of both guinea pigs.

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username3509752
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As can be seen with other organophosphate poisonings, novichok agents may cause lasting nerve damage, resulting in permanent disablement of victims, according to Russian scientists.[60] Their effect on humans was demonstrated by the accidental exposure of Andrei Zheleznyakov, one of the scientists involved in their development, to the residue of an unspecified Novichok agent while working in a Moscow laboratory in May 1987. He was critically injured and took ten days to recover consciousness after the incident. He lost the ability to walk and was treated at a secret clinic in Leningrad for three months afterwards. The agent caused permanent harm, with effects that included "chronic weakness in his arms, a toxic hepatitis that gave rise to cirrhosis of the liver, epilepsy, spells of severe depression, and an inability to read or concentrate that left him totally disabled and unable to work." He never recovered and died in July 1992 after five years of deteriorating health.[61]

:thinking:
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username1738683
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It's good to see them on the mend, can't wish that on anyone. Do we know what the alleged motive behind this may have been yet? It's sort of a basic step for any accusation of a crime and in true terms we are told it is because he is a Russian turncoat but of course there has to be more than that, specially if you're going to make it that obvious. One of those where there is more we are not told of than we are led to believe.

Not challenging the assumption that the butler done it, just saying that the motive is missing from the story. That is actually quite a problem when it comes to pointing the finger at someone in decisive terms, I do like a good crime novel but it is a rule of thumb that a motive has to be sniffed out by some genius to get him triggered.
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the bear
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(Original post by zhog)
It's good to see them on the mend, can't wish that on anyone. Do we know what the alleged motive behind this may have been yet? It's sort of a basic step for any accusation of a crime and in true terms we are told it is because he is a Russian turncoat but of course there has to be more than that, specially if you're going to make it that obvious. One of those where there is more we are not told of than we are led to believe.

Not challenging the assumption that the butler done it, just saying that the motive is missing from the story. That is actually quite a problem when it comes to pointing the finger at someone in decisive terms, I do like a good crime novel but it is a rule of thumb that a motive has to be sniffed out by some genius to get him triggered.
it is a replay of the earlier assassination of Alexander Litivnenko

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poison...der_Litvinenko
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e^iπ
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(Original post by zhog)
It's good to see them on the mend, can't wish that on anyone. Do we know what the alleged motive behind this may have been yet? It's sort of a basic step for any accusation of a crime and in true terms we are told it is because he is a Russian turncoat but of course there has to be more than that, specially if you're going to make it that obvious. One of those where there is more we are not told of than we are led to believe.

Not challenging the assumption that the butler done it, just saying that the motive is missing from the story. That is actually quite a problem when it comes to pointing the finger at someone in decisive terms, I do like a good crime novel but it is a rule of thumb that a motive has to be sniffed out by some genius to get him triggered.
You've kind of answered your own question, if he was indeed poisoned by Russia (let's face it he was), it's because he was deemed a traitor.

It also sends a message as to how powerful Russia's intelligence machine is considering it can carry out an attempted assassination in the UK, means that nowhere is safe.
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the bear
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(Original post by e^iπ)
You've kind of answered your own question, if he was indeed poisoned by Russia (let's face it he was), it's because he was deemed a traitor.

It also sends a message as to how powerful Russia's intelligence machine is considering it can carry out an attempted assassination in the UK, means that nowhere is safe.
Putin loves to operate as a shadowy puppetmaster... his sneaky invasion of Crimea gives you the idea of his style.
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e^iπ
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(Original post by the bear)
Putin loves to operate as a shadowy puppetmaster... his sneaky invasion of Crimea gives you the idea of his style.
It's pretty insane to think that a western country with a nuclear arsenal invaded another western country and close to nothing has been done about it.
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Johnny English
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(Original post by beaconoflight888)
Maybe they were never poisoned in the first place. This is not the first attempt at anti-Putin propaganda by means of a false flag event.

Porton Down is only 8 miles from the site of the attack.
Doubt it .
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Napp
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(Original post by the bear)
it is a replay of the earlier assassination of Alexander Litivnenko

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poison...der_Litvinenko
How?
That was a master stroke as far as Assassinations go, it was more or less a complete fluke they managed to find out what he'd been dosed with.

(Original post by the bear)
Putin loves to operate as a shadowy puppetmaster... his sneaky invasion of Crimea gives you the idea of his style.
Well technically his troops were already there
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username1738683
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(Original post by e^iπ)
You've kind of answered your own question, if he was indeed poisoned by Russia (let's face it he was), it's because he was deemed a traitor.

It also sends a message as to how powerful Russia's intelligence machine is considering it can carry out an attempted assassination in the UK, means that nowhere is safe.
He was part of one of those spy-swaps, would the Russians pick his name out of a hat just to convey the message? We know nothing about what activities he was involved in right now, that is what we can safely expect not to hear and there may be good reasons for that too. I agree that the intent to send a message is there, it would be impossible not to but contrarians would argue it could be a decoy to plant it on the Russians.
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e^iπ
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(Original post by zhog)
He was part of one of those spy-swaps, would the Russians pick his name out of a hat just to convey the message? We know nothing about what activities he was involved in right now, that is what we can safely expect not to hear and there may be good reasons for that too. I agree that the intent to send a message is there, it would be impossible not to but contrarians would argue it could be a decoy to plant it on the Russians.
TBH all this spy business is pretty contrived stuff and you are right in saying the public has no idea what goes on behind the scenes, while the finger does point towards Putin, it's not really out of the question that someone else may have done it to frame Russia.
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username1738683
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(Original post by e^iπ)
TBH all this spy business is pretty contrived stuff and you are right in saying the public has no idea what goes on behind the scenes, while the finger does point towards Putin, it's not really out of the question that someone else may have done it to frame Russia.
That's right, people with a wild imagination could even dream up a scenario where he was caught sending sensitive e-mails back to Moscow every night and that it was actually us that tried to dispose of him and send a message to the Russians. And plant it on them with some home-made brew or by plainly fiddling the toxic report. It's amazing, the way some people's minds work.

Not me, my imagination ain't that wild.
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e^iπ
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(Original post by zhog)
That's right, people with a wild imagination could even dream up a scenario where he was caught sending sensitive e-mails back to Moscow every night and that it was actually us that tried to dispose of him and send a message to the Russians. And plant it on them with some home-made brew or by plainly fiddling the toxic report. It's amazing, the way some people's minds work.

Not me, my imagination ain't that wild.
Yep, it's easy to see the Russians as this big evil. empire but imagine what they think about us.

When people think of state propoganda they often think of absurdly outlandish claims such as North Korea claimg they won the world cup but after watching some Russia Today on YouTube, I couldn't help but notice how they never specifically claim anything, it's a bit like the BBC of Russia and it's scary to think that the information we get from the BBC might not always be correct despite it being held as the pinnacle of unbiasedness.
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