Why is patriotism good in America but bad here?

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Abcdefghijk123
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I’m curious of this. Those who say things like ‘proud to be british’ and display the English/British flag in their window are seen as right-wing and even a bit racist in the UK. I often hear people saying they’re ashamed to be English etc. But in America, if you say things like ‘I hate being american’ it’s massively frowned upon. Why is this?
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Axiomasher
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I know this isn't answering the question but I've never understood how you can be 'proud' of something that isn't actually a personal achievement. I'm British because I was born in Britain, I'm English because I was born in England, I didn't really have a hand in that myself.
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jamal tyrone
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(Original post by Abcdefghijk123)
I’m curious of this. Those who say things like ‘proud to be british’ and display the English/British flag in their window are seen as right-wing and even a bit racist in the UK. I often hear people saying they’re ashamed to be English etc. But in America, if you say things like ‘I hate being american’ it’s massively frowned upon. Why is this?
Because this country was taken over by leftist traitors about 70 years agowho want people to feel guilty, rather than proud, of who they are.

In my opinion, English people should be some of the most patriotic in the world. The ideas of economic freedom and laissez-faire capitalism, as well as the belief in property rights and limited government (Magna Carta), stretches back over centuries in Britain and was pioneered by Englishmen. It is on this principle that many colonies (Australia,New Zealand) and former colonies (USA, Hong Kong) have been able to afford such a high quality of life to their citizens, but very few British citizens understand this because, whenever you mention being patriotic, the response is always "muh colonialism."

I am not a nationalist, and people who are often zealously proud of their nationality or race are doing so to compensate for a lack of personal productivity and achievement, but, if more people understood this, I think that the English would be more patriotic.
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jamal tyrone
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(Original post by Axiomasher)
I know this isn't answering the question but I've never understood how you can be 'proud' of something that isn't actually a personal achievement. I'm British because I was born in Britain, I'm English because I was born in England, I didn't really have a hand in that myself.

I agree to an extent, but you can be proud of ideas that are inherently English, like property rights, such as those derived from the Magna Carta.
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fallen_acorns
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on the one hand we have always expressed our patriotism differently then America, and with a few exceptions, have never been such a flag-waving nation..

But that being said, patriotism has declined.

Why? Partly because of multiculturalism, a misunderstanding of the merits and functions of nations and loss of education around our own history and culture..

But mainly because, as with most of western Europe, we are still in the midst of a mass moral exhaustion and communal guilt, after the occurrences of the 18th-20th century.

We are suffering because whilst what Europe did was nothing new, and the way it acted was no worse then what came before it... we had our expansionist/advanced/dominant period just at the time when it was first possible to both truly record and remember it, and possible to consider our actions and their effects.

America escaped this largely because firstly they actually emerged after the chaos of the early 20th century as victorious. The Uk ended the war having 'not lost' by comparison, but certainly not 'victorious'.
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HearMeR0ar
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From a very biased UK point of view - America is massive, anywhere you turn, you hear Americans talk about their eagles and whatever, the gun shootings and Donald trump and their hate for immigrants (from my point of view - very stereotypical), and vice versa, Americans think of tea and fish & chips when you say English. England used to be a country with the majority of its residents white. America was discovered by white and was inhabited by white people till they brought other coloured people in America to serve as slaves. England itself didn’t have any other colours except white till around 1900? (Massive estimate I’m bad with history,), and now both are diverse countries. The reason why Americans are so proud to display who they are is because it’s in your nature, America was a newly found continent and yet it grew to be one of the most complex ones, like, yall made unicorn Frappes mannn, that’s some good **** right there. You all know in your heart that you are American, while in England you’ll still be referred to where you’re from. I’m romanian, born in Romania, so I will refer to myself as Romanian, not English. However it is not found rude or racist if one puts their flags on the window, it shows patriotism. Hope this helped x
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Abcdefghijk123
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(Original post by Axiomasher)
I know this isn't answering the question but I've never understood how you can be 'proud' of something that isn't actually a personal achievement. I'm British because I was born in Britain, I'm English because I was born in England, I didn't really have a hand in that myself.
I agree with this. It’s like being proud to be human. You didn’t get any choice in the matter 😂
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TheRuralJuror
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patriotism in america has a pinch of racism in it...since your a patriot it means you're proud of your nations past ...except its a terrible past, a nation build on genocide and slavery.
a country that still celebrates a murderer that "discovered" their "land".... but ofc people of america don't see it that way because their so terribly educated.
foreigners on the other hand know that bit.
and like the first guy said there's no sens n patriotism.
even if you went to Iraq or whatever, you killed for your country ..lost a leg,had you're friends blown up, you're handed a medal and left to deal with your PTSD until you kill your self with your 1rst amendment
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username1738683
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Oh, the US are catching up fast on this one. From this side of the pond, they seem to be tearing themselves apart like never before and going through the same process of reversing 'pride' into 'shame' Britain has gone through. Slightly behind the curve, that's all.

I've never seen so much flag-burning and public displays of 'protest' at the anthem, the pulling down of statues and all that...
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username1738683
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(Original post by jamal tyrone)
I agree to an extent, but you can be proud of ideas that are inherently English, like property rights, such as those derived from the Magna Carta.
England has probably given the world more than any other country, not least... football. Beat that, anyone.

ps, that's soccer, if in the US.
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Airplanebee2
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(Original post by Abcdefghijk123)
I’m curious of this. Those who say things like ‘proud to be british’ and display the English/British flag in their window are seen as right-wing and even a bit racist in the UK. I often hear people saying they’re ashamed to be English etc. But in America, if you say things like ‘I hate being american’ it’s massively frowned upon. Why is this?
See my thread about fake news. I have addressed this point in the OP.
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jbillington
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First of all, it is not inherently racist to be proud to be British or from Britain. However, there is a stigma associated with that kind of nationalism. This is because Nationalism essentially is meaningless. A nation is an
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Scottish15
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It's probably done to Political Correctness in this country.
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Scottish15
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(Original post by Abcdefghijk123)
I’m curious of this. Those who say things like ‘proud to be british’ and display the English/British flag in their window are seen as right-wing and even a bit racist in the UK. I often hear people saying they’re ashamed to be English etc. But in America, if you say things like ‘I hate being american’ it’s massively frowned upon. Why is this?
Why would you be ashamed of being British? Our island is responsible for some of the most important inventions to grace the Earth. Telephone, World Wide Web, Television etc etc.
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the bear
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it will be St George's Day/Shakespeare's Birthday on 23rd April...

i shall certainly be marking it in suitably patriotic style
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Shabalala
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I despise the idea that Britain should be ashamed or embarrassed about its Empire and colonialism.

What we did was no worse than what the Romans did, what the Vikings did, What The Ottomans did or what the Mongols did!

You never see people hating on the Italians, the Scandinavians for their respective empires & conquests, they are proud of what they achieved and it’s not seen as a bad thing at all.

Infact the British Empire along with the Roman Empire has helped drive humanity along massively from backwards cave dwellers to an advanced civilisation.

Sure not everything it did was perfect and there was plenty of attrocities comited along the way but the same can be said for every Empire. You can’t judge an Empire by today’s moral standards those were different times everyone was trying to do the same thing as us back then it just so happens we were better at it!

The fact a tiny Island nation managed to create the largest, most successful and most powerful Empire ever that has basically created the western world and culture we know today is astonishing and definetley nothing to be ashamed about.
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999tigger
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(Original post by Abcdefghijk123)
I’m curious of this. Those who say things like ‘proud to be british’ and display the English/British flag in their window are seen as right-wing and even a bit racist in the UK. I often hear people saying they’re ashamed to be English etc. But in America, if you say things like ‘I hate being american’ it’s massively frowned upon. Why is this?
It isnt, but the UK and English flags are sometimes hijacked by people like the EDL and other organisations which have racist associations.
I dont hear many people who say they hate being English. there are some dissatisfied ones (normally from ethnic minorities) who dislike the UK and are eager to leave.
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Good bloke
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(Original post by Axiomasher)
I know this isn't answering the question but I've never understood how you can be 'proud' of something that isn't actually a personal achievement.
Can you not be proud of a collective achievement? Britain is a successful nation state that got where it is now from the collective efforts of our forebears and of ourselves. The nation state is one of the most important things in your life. It protects you, sets the environment for your life and allows you to prosper in freedom.

If you are lucky and live in a competent and civilised one, that is. If you do then you should be proud of it and seek to defend it.

If you don't, and you live in a state that cannot or does not protect its citizens or that persecutes them, that does not present opportunities to develop or that removes important freedoms like those of expression and belief then you should be ashamed of what you and your forebears have failed to achieve and make greater efforts.
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Jang Gwangnam
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I don't see the point of prancing around, man feels proud about Britain's history but fr we aren't sh*t nowadays - what's there to be proud of?
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SCIENCE :D
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(Original post by Axiomasher)
I know this isn't answering the question but I've never understood how you can be 'proud' of something that isn't actually a personal achievement. I'm British because I was born in Britain, I'm English because I was born in England, I didn't really have a hand in that myself.
Do you love your family?
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