Going to a state school is no excuse for not being determined to get into university

OP

Cherelle Malongo, Oxford University

If you are someone like me – a black, working-class, state-school educated individual from Newham, East London – would you think that you could win a place at Oxford or Cambridge?

Source: Oxford University http://www.lmh.ox.ac.uk/news/foundation-year-student-blog-times-higher-education

Reply 2

Doones

21

Moved to Educational debate.

Reply 3

OP

Original post by Doonesbury

Moved to Educational debate.

Nice!

Reply 4

isaidsteamedhams

going to uni comes from grassroots level i went to a state secondary school no one ever mentioned going to uni and becoming doctors, engineers, accountants and the like we got no backing. if you look at my fb now loads of kids way smarter than me are in doss jobs now/traveling etc. if they got abit of inspiration they might have worked hard in sixth form and got into a uni. my sixth form was a state school a very good one and ppl got into oxbridge and that could have been them

Reply 5

Lucy-01

I agree that going to a state school shouldn’t stop you from applying to top unis if you’ve got the grades. However, some schools don’t encourage this (idk why) and some students don’t have the grades for uni - this occurs more in state schools, as they are usually non-selective. Therefore less of them will go to uni.
I go to a state school and it’s pretty good, as far as I’m aware we have had students progress to Oxbridge and other top unis (we don’t have a sixth form at our school).

Reply 6

OP

Original post by Lucy-16

I agree that going to a state school shouldn’t stop you from applying to top unis if you’ve got the grades. However, some schools don’t encourage this (idk why) and some students don’t have the grades for uni - this occurs more in state schools, as they are usually non-selective. Therefore less of them will go to uni.
I go to a state school and it’s pretty good, as far as I’m aware we have had students progress to Oxbridge and other top unis (we don’t have a sixth form at our school).

That isn't an excuse for not applying.

You don't apply because someone told you to, you apply for yourself. Same with sixth forms, some schools wont tell you when to apply but if you wanted to find a sixth form, you'd find it on your own.

Reply 7

Lucy-01

I wasn’t saying that just because schools don’t tell people to, people won’t apply, but some people might feel discouraged if their school doesn’t suggest applying to a top uni as they might feel like they’re not good enough. I didn’t say it was an excuse, just a contributing factor.

Reply 8

OP

Original post by isaidsteamedhams

going to uni comes from grassroots level i went to a state secondary school no one ever mentioned going to uni and becoming doctors, engineers, accountants and the like we got no backing. if you look at my fb now loads of kids way smarter than me are in doss jobs now/traveling etc. if they got abit of inspiration they might have worked hard in sixth form and got into a uni. my sixth form was a state school a very good one and ppl got into oxbridge and that could have been them

Don't exaggerate. Your school must have by law given out careers guidance to every school leaver.

There is no way you only found out about "going to university" at sixth form. You just didn't want to listen when they did tell you.

Reply 9

OP

Entertainment Forum Helper, Debate & Current Affairs Helper

Original post by Lucy-16

I wasn’t saying that just because schools don’t tell people to, people won’t apply, but some people might feel discouraged if their school doesn’t suggest applying to a top uni as they might feel like they’re not good enough. I didn’t say it was an excuse, just a contributing factor.

It isn't a contributing factor. It is an excuse. "I didn't apply because no one told me to, I went to a state school."

Top unis is also ill-defined in this thread, from now on - when I say top unis I mean Russell Groups.

Reply 10

Andrew97

20

Agreed. Schools should push students to do what is the best for them. For some that will be Uni, others it won’t be. But being in a state school should absolutely not be an excuse for not applying.

Reply 11

Lucy-01

I’ve never heard anyone make that excuse. I think of it as a contributing factor because if you felt like people didn’t think you’d get in to Russell group unis (regardless of what school you went to), you’d be discouraged from applying. I know that you don’t have to wait for the school to tell you to apply for one. Going to a state school is no excuse for not going to uni, and I’m not saying it is at all. I would never use the fact that I went to a state school as an excuse for not going to uni.

Reply 12

OP

Original post by Lucy-16

I’ve never heard anyone make that excuse. I think of it as a contributing factor because if you felt like people didn’t think you’d get in to Russell group unis (regardless of what school you went to), you’d be discouraged from applying. I know that you don’t have to wait for the school to tell you to apply for one. Going to a state school is no excuse for not going to uni, and I’m not saying it is at all. I would never use the fact that I went to a state school as an excuse for not going to uni.

"No encouragement" = contributing factor = excuse

Reply 13

isaidsteamedhams

Original post by physicseastldn

Don't exaggerate. Your school must have by law given out careers guidance to every school leaver.

There is no way you only found out about "going to university" at sixth form. You just didn't want to listen when they did tell you.

well i went a poor quality secondary school so may not be as extensive guidance as other schools but yeah i dont recall any real encouragement in aiming for uni or those dr, engineer etc careers. was more of the get 5 Cs and get into college first and decide there. a recent stat is 38% got 5Cs and above. i had no idea about uni/careers until end of 1st year sixth form

Reply 14

OP

If someone really wanted to go to a Russell Group, they'd apply. Since when did you need an invitation from a school teacher to apply? If you wanted to go to a university, then you'd order their prospectus or go to an open day. I don't see anything on the prospectus order forms that require you to have a letter of recommendation from your teacher.

Reply 15

'Tetragrammaton'

You make it sound like people have to want to go to University...

Reply 16

OP

Original post by 'Tetragrammaton'

You make it sound like people have to want to go to University...

Why would you go to university if you didn't want to? There are plenty of other routes to take. If you don't want to go to uni - then don't. It's not by force.

Reply 17

'Tetragrammaton'

Original post by physicseastldn

Why would you go to university if you didn't want to? There are plenty of other routes to take. If you don't want to go to uni - then don't. It's not by force.

True, although schools do often pressure you and don't leave you with many options. However, that's not what I was saying. The original thing was that going to a state school is not an excuse for not being determined to go to university. If you were already at university, this wouldn't matter. If you're not, the OP is making is seem as though you have to want to.

Reply 18

Miriam29