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Rainfall
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#81
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#81
(Original post by Lemur14)
The link at the bottom of the OP takes you to a form to nominate

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Ik but it doesnt work
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SoulfulTwist
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#82
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#82
What's the problem, I'm sure they take into consideration who you nominate. And the ones nominated deserve it too anyway. Just give a proper explanation why you've nominated them.
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Lemur14
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#83
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#83
(Original post by Rainfall)
Ik but it doesnt work
Hmm...how about now? Think I've managed to fix it...
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04MR17
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#84
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#84
Others have made points (on both sides) which I agree with. So I won't comment much. Other than to say that I nominated lots of people for this award and in those nominations commented on how it may come across to have consecutive CAs winning. STs and SLs will have seen this in my nominations and will have come to this decision aware of how it may look. Pointing it out now doesn't do much except take away from 2 incredibly deserving winners.
(Original post by Notoriety)
No one more deserving than Cavy.

But CAs 2 for 2; the other I have never even heard of. As it stands, MoM seems to be rewarding the in-group of community staff than the community itself.
It doesn't take much effort to go and look in the Scottish Qualifications forum and see the gargatuan efforts Labrador has gone to on that. It's not the most obvious thing on the site but they deserved it whether you've heard of them or not.
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Rainfall
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#85
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#85
I have nominated for someone who is never appreciated and deserves this award more than anyone else. Ya’ll better vote for him/her.
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Notoriety
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#86
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#86
(Original post by 04MR17)
Others have made points (on both sides) which I agree with. So I won't comment much. Other than to say that I nominated lots of people for this award and in those nominations commented on how it may come across to have consecutive CAs winning. STs and SLs will have seen this in my nominations and will have come to this decision aware of how it may look. Pointing it out now doesn't do much except take away from 2 incredibly deserving winners.

It doesn't take much effort to go and look in the Scottish Qualifications forum and see the gargatuan efforts Labrador has gone to on that. It's not the most obvious thing on the site but they deserved it whether you've heard of them or not.
See Snufkin's post, acknowledging the reason behind this award was to do away with the in-group bias of TSR Awards. It is not that any poster does not deserve it; it is simply that awarding consecutively to members of the CA does not do away with the perception of in-group bias. Plus these members have had "appreciation" from the TSR Gods by virtue of being CAs. I do wonder why the STs were excluded from this award: because they have already been rewarded or because other STs would just vote for their mates? Might STs not have an affinity for CAs in a similar way?

A more general point, the people most aware of TSR's "schemes" are those who are in a staff position of sorts -- it seems logical therefore for CAs to be the most likely to nominate. And now we have had two CAs winning back-to-back. It seems you're in agreement with the point about perception, hence your putting it in your nomination note. I am not sure why you thought to quote me.

(Original post by Rainfall)
I have nominated for someone who is never appreciated and deserves this award more than anyone else. Ya’ll better vote for him/her.
I am not going to.
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04MR17
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#87
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#87
(Original post by Notoriety)
See Snufkin's post, acknowledging the reason behind this award was to do away with the in-group bias of TSR Awards. It is not that any poster does not deserve it; it is simply that awarding consecutively to members of the CA does not do away with the perception of in-group bias. Plus these members have had "appreciation" from the TSR Gods by virtue of being CAs. I do wonder why the STs were excluded from this award: because they have already been rewarded or because other STs would just vote for their mates? Might STs not have an affinity for CAs in a similar way?

A more general point, the people most aware of TSR's "schemes" are those who are in a staff position of sorts -- it seems logical therefore for CAs to be the most likely to nominate. And now we have had two CAs winning back-to-back. It seems you're in agreement with the point about perception, hence your putting it in your nomination note. I am not sure why you thought to quote me.
My second paragraph was directed at you (which you appear to have not read or conveniently ignored). Nothing else. The rest was just a general comment. I've read Snufkin's post and the whole conversation. Your concerns are valid as are the replies you've had. There is nothing left for me to say.
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CoolCavy
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#88
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#88
I think to see a pattern you need at least 5 results, at least that's what we were always taught in science

(Original post by Rainfall)
I have nominated for someone who is never appreciated and deserves this award more than anyone else. Ya’ll better vote for him/her.
i dont think we can vote? thought we just nominate and the ST vote on it
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Rainfall
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#89
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#89
(Original post by CoolCavy)
I think to see a pattern you need at least 5 results, at least that's what we were always taught in science



i dont think we can vote? thought we just nominate and the ST vote on it
Ughhh then I should’ve written more for the why part. Tbh if they vote on it then it will be incredibly bias
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Notoriety
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#90
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#90
(Original post by 04MR17)
My second paragraph was directed at you (which you appear to have not read or conveniently ignored). Nothing else. The rest was just a general comment. I've read Snufkin's post and the whole conversation. Your concerns are valid as are the replies you've had. There is nothing left for me to say.
I ignored it on account of your saying that my comments potentially minimise the deserved achievements of the two recipients. It seems odd that you're complaining I never tried to rebut your second para, which would logically involve having a go at this Labrador character.

It doesn't take much effort to go and look in the Scottish Qualifications forum and see the gargatuan efforts Labrador has gone to on that. It's not the most obvious thing on the site but they deserved it whether you've heard of them or not.
I don't spend much time on there, nor does any one else. So how did he manage to get nominated for it?

I might observe that 735 of his posts are in Scottish Quals (2nd highest), but the one with the highest is "Forum Games". Your most common is also Forum Games, a healthy 27k posts. The much venerated SoulfulTwist, who bravely defended the recipients, has 3k. It is fairly common for TSR insiders, i.e. the people who corrupted TSR Awards, to frequent this forum. Considering that it is mostly CAs and insiders who nominate, and Labrador's most frequented area of the site is for TSR insiders, might Labrador's being a TSR insider influenced his being nominated? Call me sceptical.

Again, I am not saying he doesn't deserve it; I am just observing that MoM was set up to be more than a popularity contest voted for by a handful of people.
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04MR17
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#91
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#91
(Original post by Notoriety)
I don't spend much time on there, nor does any one else. So how did he manage to get nominated for it?

I might observe that 735 of his posts are in Scottish Quals (2nd highest), but the one with the highest is "Forum Games". Your most common is also Forum Games, a healthy 27k posts. The much venerated SoulfulTwist, who bravely defended the recipients, has 3k. It is fairly common for TSR insiders, i.e. the people who corrupted TSR Awards, to frequent this forum. Considering that it is mostly CAs and insiders who nominate, and Labrador's most frequented area of the site is for TSR insiders, might Labrador's being a TSR insider influenced his being nominated? Call me sceptical.

Again, I am not saying he doesn't deserve it; I am just observing that MoM was set up to be more than a popularity contest voted for by a handful of people.
If you're going to speculate on people posting in Forum Games and that having any connection with this then you're just being silly. If you're not going to look at the quality of someone's detailed help and replies then speculating on the distribution of their post count is not going to help you. I'm complaining that you're going to dismiss someone because you haven't heard of them, and when suggested that you actually go and look at what they do, you first ignore that, and then speculate based on a brief glance at posting statistics. Your original concerns were valid. But if this is the way that you go about presenting them then I shall bid you goodnight Sir.

Spoiler:
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P.S. Labrador is not necessarily a he
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Notoriety
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#92
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#92
(Original post by 04MR17)
If you're going to speculate on people posting in Forum Games and that having any connection with this then you're just being silly. If you're not going to look at the quality of someone's detailed help and replies then speculating on the distribution of their post count is not going to help you. I'm complaining that you're going to dismiss someone because you haven't heard of them, and when suggested that you actually go and look at what they do, you first ignore that, and then speculate based on a brief glance at posting statistics. Your original concerns were valid. But if this is the way that you go about presenting them then I shall bid you goodnight Sir.

Spoiler:
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P.S. Labrador is not necessarily a he


No, in truth I checked that user out before I posted my first comment. At first, I thought my lack of knowing him/her was a good thing as it meant the awards were working as planned and then I saw a) CA and b) 999 posts in Forum Games.

Then you have Cavy who is as famous and well-known a user as can be. Not quite the celebration of outsiders who missed out on the TSR Awards, as was the goal stated in that thread with Snufkin and Doones (which I cannot seem to find).

With respect, I was not interested in having this exchange with Snufkin, so I am not sure why you think I might be more interested in having it with you.
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SoulfulTwist
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#93
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#93
(Original post by Notoriety)
I ignored it on account of your saying that my comments potentially minimise the deserved achievements of the two recipients. It seems odd that you're complaining I never tried to rebut your second para, which would logically involve having a go at this Labrador character.



I don't spend much time on there, nor does any one else. So how did he manage to get nominated for it?

I might observe that 735 of his posts are in Scottish Quals (2nd highest), but the one with the highest is "Forum Games". Your most common is also Forum Games, a healthy 27k posts. The much venerated SoulfulTwist, who bravely defended the recipients, has 3k. It is fairly common for TSR insiders, i.e. the people who corrupted TSR Awards, to frequent this forum. Considering that it is mostly CAs and insiders who nominate, and Labrador's most frequented area of the site is for TSR insiders, might Labrador's being a TSR insider influenced his being nominated? Call me sceptical.

Again, I am not saying he doesn't deserve it; I am just observing that MoM was set up to be more than a popularity contest voted for by a handful of people.
Maybe I'd have agreed with you if they'd been more months and still the same pattern.
There's only been 2....
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Jack22031994
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#94
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#94
OMG A CA WON!!! ITS A CONSPIRACY!!!

I actually totally forgot this was going on :rofl:

btw why is this in A-levels? shadowdweller
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8472
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#95
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#95
Likely this has caused discussion in thread over in the ST Area but i'll leave my final 2 cents of what should be changed about MoTM.

-Remove CAs from being eligible to win
-Use stats such as most rep'd post of that month, highest reps receive per section ect (not sure if you do) in addition to voting and posting.
-Create Volunteer of the month (VoTM) which would be held in private section for ST/CAs picked by SL/CT.

Why? CAs winning is unfair to a certain extent. Let's say all the pride content we've had go up. It was planned and not something a user otherwise would have been able to assist with. However the content nevertheless from Cavy is absolutely stonking. She's done a great job as i've previously stated here. Hence VoTM... It will reward and recognise those who in particular work with CT/SLs to push the site forward outside of replies to their feedback thread saying they've done a good job. MoTM can return to be who just enjoy the site but are regulars but make some good posts and interact with others well.
Second change was use of stats. I presume they've have to come from CT/Stats lady but i'd hope it will make the winner more user's choice whilst avoiding skewed voting from a certain set of members aka coterie.
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Jack22031994
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#96
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#96
(Original post by 8472)
Likely this has caused discussion in thread over in the ST Area but i'll leave my final 2 cents of what should be changed about MoTM.

-Remove CAs from being eligible to win
-Use stats such as most rep'd post of that month, highest reps receive per section ect (not sure if you do) in addition to voting and posting.
-Create Volunteer of the month (VoTM) which would be held in private section for ST/CAs picked by SL/CT.

Why? CAs winning is unfair to a certain extent. Let's say all the pride content we've had go up. It was planned and not something a user otherwise would have been able to assist with. However the content nevertheless from Cavy is absolutely stonking. She's done a great job as i've previously stated here. Hence VoTM... It will reward and recognise those who in particular work with CT/SLs to push the site forward outside of replies to their feedback thread saying they've done a good job. MoTM can return to be who just enjoy the site but and are regulars but make some good posts and interact with others well.
Second change was use of stats. I presume they've have to come from CT/Stats lady but i'd hope it will make the winner more user's choice whilst avoiding skewed voting from a certain set of members aka coterie.
Thats a good idea actually, to separate the two! MoTM and VoTM
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shadowdweller
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#97
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#97
(Original post by Jack22031994)
OMG A CA WON!!! ITS A CONSPIRACY!!!

I actually totally forgot this was going on :rofl:

btw why is this in A-levels? shadowdweller
It's moving around the site to make sure we get nominations for members of all sections
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Jack22031994
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#98
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#98
(Original post by shadowdweller)
It's moving around the site to make sure we get nominations for members of all sections
Oh okay! Thats fair!
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shadowdweller
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#99
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#99
I'd strongly urge, once again, that we leave this debate until next month; as I've previously outlined, we do acknowledge that we need to ensure all members have a fair chance at recognition, and it is something we're discussing about how to tackle. I feel currently there is an argument going on where we're all ultimately on the same side - we all want to make sure that the award is fair, and we're all discussing how to do that.

If people have suggestions for how to improve the award process, then I am very welcoming of that, but I'd ask that we try to avoid continuing the current line of argument, as I don't think it will be getting us anywhere any time soon
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04MR17
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#100
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#100
Made another nomination. This one was important.:heart:
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