The Student Room Group

Choosing a University for Games Development?

So I'm coming to the end of my first year at college (in the UK, Loughborough if anyone knows) and doing a BTEC Level 3 Games Development course. So far I've got some pretty good grades: 4 Distinctions and 2 merits (one of which was an exam and 4% off a Distinction.)

I was wondering if anyone could help me with what university might be good for Games Development/Programming as I'm much more into the programming and technical side rather than the art/actual design (likely due to my pretty bad art skills since I'm right handed yet a nerve in my right arm was damaged a couple years ago meaning I can't use my index finger, therefore I can't draw.)

I've heard good things about Staffordshire, from college students/teachers and even some nurses at hospital when I go for checkups. There's also options like De Montfort, Teesside and Derby University. (although being near Loughborough, De Montfort and Derby are the closest and Teesside the farthest.)

Also, if I do end up going to Uni, would you recommend I stay in accomodation or come home every day? Not sure about the cost of that although I'm already pretty independent as I like to cook for myself (so I can calorie count sometimes) and like to cook Rice, Pasta and the Pasta/Rice Packets from Aldi alongside some veg.

In short, any recommendations for Universities with a Games Development/Programming course and should I stay in accomodation if I do end up going? Thanks in advance!
(edited 5 years ago)
Reply 1
Original post by DanF_2000
So I'm coming to the end of my first year at college (in the UK, Loughborough if anyone knows) and doing a BTEC Level 3 Games Development course. So far I've got some pretty good grades: 4 Distinctions and 2 merits (one of which was an exam and 4% off a Distinction.)

I was wondering if anyone could help me with what university might be good for Games Development/Programming as I'm much more into the programming and technical side rather than the art/actual design (likely due to my pretty bad art skills since I'm right handed yet a nerve in my right arm was damaged a couple years ago meaning I can't use my index finger, therefore I can't draw.)

I've heard good things about Staffordshire, from college students/teachers and even some nurses at hospital when I go for checkups. There's also options like De Montfort, Teesside and Derby University. (although being near Loughborough, De Montfort and Derby are the closest and Teesside the farthest.)

Also, if I do end up going to Uni, would you recommend I stay in accomodation or come home every day? Not sure about the cost of that although I'm already pretty independent as I like to cook for myself (so I can calorie count sometimes) and like to cook Rice, Pasta and the Pasta/Rice Packets from Aldi alongside some veg.

In short, any recommendations for Universities with a Games Development/Programming course and should I stay in accomodation if I do end up going? Thanks in advance!

The unis you have mentioned (Derby, Teesside and De Montfort) are not so great unis, if you're on track for Distinctions you could go somewhere much stronger.

Why not consider:
University of Leicester - BSc Computer Science or BSc Software Engineering - D*D*D*

University of Nottingham - BSc Computer Science - D*D*D*

University of Birmingham - BSc Computer Science (with foundation yr) - DDD

Personally, I would recommend living out as its a great experience and you'd have a lot more choice of where you could study compared to if you commuted. I lived out for my bachelors and am now commuting for my masters and I hate it, if I had commuted for my bachelors I would've missed out on so much as I'm experiencing now. Also, as weird as it sounds, you'll probably find that living out is more affordable than commuting due to the difference in student finance you get. If you live at home they give you barely anything in terms of maintenance whereas if you live out you'll get a lot more, and in some cases the cost of weekly rent is around the same or sometimes less than commuting. For me, when I lived out it only cost an extra £16 a week for a room compared to getting the train (only a 20 min train journey too) but the difference in finance was about £4.5-5k which covered the rent so was much more affordable, the maintenance loan when living at home actually wouldn't have even covered a year's worth of train fares - just something for you to consider.

As well as that, and as I have already said, you'd have a lot more options in terms of where you could go and with Distinction grades you should be aiming higher than some of the unis that you mentioned.

Hope this helps :smile:
(edited 5 years ago)
I studied Software Engineering at Staffs (several years ago - before they built the new computing/tech buildings in Stoke - the new facililties seem to be pretty decent though), however as the poster above mentioned, it's certainly not the most prestigious university, but the prestige of a university doesn't really carry much weight when it comes to technical IT careers. As for games programming in particular, I'm not even sure that there are any 'top' universities who even offer that as an option, so if this is the type of career you'd like to follow, then your best choice would probably be Abertay Dundee.

Staffs computing-related courses (Software Engineering, Game programming, Network engineering, etc) are all very vocational - i.e. the modules are focused on technical skills rather than theory/logic or mathematics. With that said, Game programming naturally involves more Maths than most of the other courses - simply because mathematics is an important skill in creating computer games (Topics such as mechanics, geometry and probability are important in games and simulators).

As far as career prospects go, Staffs have a good working relationship with a lot of employers, and their courses all include an option to take a 12-month industrial placement - if you choose Staffs (or any university which offers a placement year), then I would strongly urge you to take the 12-month placement option because you'll gain a huge amount of valuable experience from doing this, which will greatly enhance your employment prospects. With that in mind, you may not necessarliy find a placement at a games company, but at the beginning of your career, any kind of software engineering placement is great experience to have - placements involving something like embedded programming or other kinds of real-time systems are very relevant, but overall, software engineering in the games industry is broadly the same as most other industries.

Overall Staffs is not an exceptional uni (there's no point comparing it to universities like Imperial/Warwick/Bristol/etc), and the courses are nowhere near as intense as those universities either, but their computing faculty is reasonably good in terms of the facilities and the lecturers so it's not a bad choice if your main reason for going to university is to get into a career related to programming and/or games development then it's not a bad choice - the IT industry as a whole values technical skill, enthusiasm, experience, problem solving ability and communication/team-working skills more highly than any particular qualification.

Lastly, have a look at this thread - there are some great replies here: https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=2278813
(edited 5 years ago)
Reply 3
@DanF_2000 @winterscoming

Newcastle University (Russell Group and ranked 22nd in UK) - BSc Computer Science (Game Engineering) - D*DD - https://www.ncl.ac.uk/undergraduate/degrees/g450

Leeds (Russell Group and ranked 13th in UK) - MEng or BSc Computer Science with High-Performance Graphics and Games Engineering - D*D*D* - https://courses.leeds.ac.uk/i069/computer-science-with-high-performance-graphics-and-games-engineering-meng-bsc#section3

Original post by winterscoming
...but the prestige of a university doesn't really carry much weight when it comes to technical IT careers. As for games programming in particular, I'm not even sure that there are any 'top' universities who even offer that as an option, so if this is the type of career you'd like to follow, then your best choice would probably be Abertay Dundee.


I disagree with this somewhat. There are practical degrees that teach a lot of skills which do serve a purpose, however with time these skills will become outdated and there are a lot of, not so great, universities that offer really un-challenging and frankly easy programmes that do not overly help graduates looking for employment. However, this is not me directing that towards Staffordshire (I purposely omitted it from my list on my post when referring to the unis mentioned by the OP) , I have heard their programmes are very vocational and skills oriented, which is good, but there are loads of low ranked unis that offer programmes that don't qualify graduates in much at all.

In my opinion, a strong and challenging degree in a general subject, like Computer Science, is the way to go as: Firstly, it equips graduates to go into a wide range of related technical roles. Secondly, the heavy maths content, which might not be overly practical, will equip graduates with much better problem modelling/solving skills. And finally, the programming does tend to be on a much higher level too.
Original post by yt7777
In my opinion, a strong and challenging degree in a general subject, like Computer Science, is the way to go as: Firstly, it equips graduates to go into a wide range of related technical roles. Secondly, the heavy maths content, which might not be overly practical, will equip graduates with much better problem modelling/solving skills. And finally, the programming does tend to be on a much higher level too.


If anyone is interested in a middle-ground, then I'd be happy to discuss BSc(Hons) Computing for Games at Falmouth University in more depth. This is a computing degree that combines strong elements of computer science and software engineering, and applies them to challenges and opportunities presented by games. It offers a balance between mathematical rigor and practical concerns, much like a traditional computing course, but is studio-orientated and immerses students in a series of multi-disciplinary game making projects (alongside composers, designers, animators, artists, writers, and so on). The interdisciplinary approach is distinct from traditional computing and computer science courses, and helps our students develop production, teamwork, and communication skills that are valued very highly by employers in the games and visual effects industries. Many of our students also incorporate and publish indie games by the end of their time at the university.

It's a relatively new course, not to be confused with the existing BA(Hons) Game Development: Programming course at Falmouth.
Original post by yt7777

I disagree with this somewhat. There are practical degrees that teach a lot of skills which do serve a purpose, however with time these skills will become outdate and there are a lot of, not so great, universities that offer really un-challenging and frankly easy programmes that do not overly help graduates looking for employment. However, this is not me directing that towards Staffordshire (I purposely omitted it from my list on my post when referring to the unis mentioned by the OP) , I have heard their programmes are very vocational and skills oriented, which is good, but there are loads of low ranked unis that offer programmes that don't qualify graduates in much at all.

In my opinion, a strong and challenging degree in a general subject, like Computer Science, is the way to go as: Firstly, it equips graduates to go into a wide range of related technical roles. Secondly, the heavy maths content, which might not be overly practical, will equip graduates with much better problem modelling/solving skills. And finally, the programming does tend to be on a much higher level too.

I understand what you mean about universities with poor teaching standards, and I agree it's not helpful to waste time or money on those courses, so just to clarify, my point was more that there are a lot of non Russell Group universities which do have have a decent standard of teaching, facilities and industry connections despite being outside of that group and having lower entry requirements, so while they're much lower on the rankings from an academic or research perspective, there aren't any problems in terms of skills taught for employment prospects. (Abertay Dundee in particular have a very strong game development course)

On the note about skills becoming outdated, I'd argue that it doesn't actually matter as the reality of working in a technical career in IT is there's a constant requirement to work with new tools and technologies, and each day involves being asked to solve all manner of problems which a degree wouldn't have taught you how to solve, so there's always a need to spend time learning, researching and figuring things out by yourself. Anyone starting a new job as a graduate can expect 3-5 years down the line to have developed a long list of skills relevant to their particular career path far beyond anything they may have been taught at university, with their employment prospects being based on those skills and that experience rather than their education.

What you say about the content of a general Computer Science degree is true, and it's great for someone who wants to keep their options wide-open as a graduate, or who is keen on staying in academia or a heavily research-based role, but for someone with a very specific career goal in mind, it makes more sense to look at ways of boosting graduate employability prospects because that's the time when the content of their degree matters most.

A lot of vocational degrees are based on the skills employers are looking for, so for somebody who has already made up their mind to enter a field such as game development, a game programming degree will cover a lot more material which is directly relevant to prospective employers - for example, geometry for computer graphics or having specific knowledge of game design theory.

Aside from that, I think the most important factor for anyone to consider in choosing a course is how enjoyable they'll find it, being that students are more likely to be successful in learning subjects and modules they enjoy than ones they dislike. I know plenty of people enjoy the mathematical side of computer science and the abstract/theoretical stuff so Computer Science is ideal for those people even if they do have a specific career in mind at the end, but there are a lot of people who prefer vocational courses too.
Reply 6
Original post by winterscoming
I understand what you mean about universities with poor teaching standards, and I agree it's not helpful to waste time or money on those courses, so just to clarify, my point was more that there are a lot of non Russell Group universities which do have have a decent standard of teaching, facilities and industry connections despite being outside of that group and having lower entry requirements, so while they're much lower on the rankings from an academic or research perspective, there aren't any problems in terms of skills taught for employment prospects. (Abertay Dundee in particular have a very strong game development course)

I totally agree, there are plenty of good courses out there. But it can be very easy to confuse what may be a genuine good course and a course that is very well marketed.

I've seen computing degrees in the UK that have no maths modules and allow students options that can include no programming either, which is just crazy, but they give the course a fancy name which makes it sound attractive for students and essentially tricks them in to thinking they're getting really well qualified but they actually aren't. But that is Computing, and some niche subset courses of Computing. My point that with Computer Science it is hard to go wrong no matter what the university, however a 'better' university is always preferable however you decide to quantify that.

Original post by winterscoming

On the note about skills becoming outdated, I'd argue that it doesn't actually matter as the reality of working in a technical career in IT is there's a constant requirement to work with new tools and technologies, and each day involves being asked to solve all manner of problems which a degree wouldn't have taught you how to solve, so there's always a need to spend time learning, researching and figuring things out by yourself. Anyone starting a new job as a graduate can expect 3-5 years down the line to have developed a long list of skills relevant to their particular career path far beyond anything they may have been taught at university, with their employment prospects being based on those skills and that experience rather than their education.

Agreed, however a degree that is near 100% made up of skills that are in demand at the present maybe isn't the best idea, this would be more suited to a certification or vocational training course, not a degree programme. Not saying that it isn't good that current technical skills are being taught, it's just my personal opinion that the skills from a degree just last you forever, which is what you get with a course that has a significant amount of theoretical content allowing you to learn concepts and teach you how to apply these to any given problem, not just in the particular language or technology that happened to be taught at a particular university.

Original post by winterscoming

What you say about the content of a general Computer Science degree is true, and it's great for someone who wants to keep their options wide-open as a graduate, or who is keen on staying in academia or a heavily research-based role, but for someone with a very specific career goal in mind, it makes more sense to look at ways of boosting graduate employability prospects because that's the time when the content of their degree matters most.

A lot of vocational degrees are based on the skills employers are looking for, so for somebody who has already made up their mind to enter a field such as game development, a game programming degree will cover a lot more material which is directly relevant to prospective employers - for example, geometry for computer graphics or having specific knowledge of game design theory.

Totally understandable that someone would want to specialise if they are lucky enough to have figured this out, but leading on from my previous point, there are some course that allow specialism e.g. Game Development but maintain the core general Computer Science topics in addition to the specialist modules. 2 of which I previously linked.

Original post by winterscoming

Aside from that, I think the most important factor for anyone to consider in choosing a course is how enjoyable they'll find it, being that students are more likely to be successful in learning subjects and modules they enjoy than ones they dislike. I know plenty of people enjoy the mathematical side of computer science and the abstract/theoretical stuff so Computer Science is ideal for those people even if they do have a specific career in mind at the end, but there are a lot of people who prefer vocational courses too.

I strongly agree with this, if you hate what you study then you are a lot more likely to fail or not do as well as you could have. But there is always a trade-off, in terms of a degree its the value for money - cost compared with prospects, taking into account interests. For example, I hated a project management module on my MSc, the content was dry and the assignments weren't enjoyable to do. But, I know the skills that I obtained through this will help me in the future if I want to progress to a PM level. I could have dropped this and picked a module that was less helpful (but a lot more interesting!) but I knew for my personal development it was the correct choice.
Original post by yt7777
I've seen computing degrees in the UK that have no maths modules and allow students options that can include no programming either, which is just crazy, but they give the course a fancy name which makes it sound attractive for students and essentially tricks them in to thinking they're getting really well qualified but they actually aren't.


I'm curious to know which UK computing degrees don't have mathematics or programming in them, and how far their course title diverges from the term "computing", since both of these are explicit parts of the QAA benchmark for computing, against which all computing courses should be validated:

"2.2 Computing as a discipline consists of central elements: Mathematics; Fundamentals of Computation; and realisation of computer systems in both hardware and software." [http://www.qaa.ac.uk/en/Publications/Documents/SBS-Computing-16.pdf, p.7]

It's also worth noting whether a course uses an I or G JACS code, which respectively refer to computing or mathematical science.

With Regards,
Michael
Reply 8
Original post by Falmouth Uni Games Academy (Computing)
I'm curious to know which UK computing degrees don't have mathematics or programming in them, and how far their course title diverges from the term "computing", since both of these are explicit parts of the QAA benchmark for computing, against which all computing courses should be validated:

"2.2 Computing as a discipline consists of central elements: Mathematics; Fundamentals of Computation; and realisation of computer systems in both hardware and software." [http://www.qaa.ac.uk/en/Publications/Documents/SBS-Computing-16.pdf, p.7]

It's also worth noting whether a course uses an I or G JACS code, which respectively refer to computing or mathematical science.

With Regards,
Michael

Hi Michael, I will PM you
Original post by yt7777
Hi Michael, I will PM you


Thanks - much appreciated!

With Regards,
Michael
I would say, look at the placement of it's graduates - do they get employed, and in what sectors; if it's in the relevant area (games development), and if so, where and what type of work (temporary contracts, permanent employment, at major development studios/offices or through contracting agencies or at indie places). This might help you evaluate a) the relative quality of the course, perhaps, and b) more specifically, how relevant the course is to your eventual goals/aims.

Some other places to consider could be Goldsmiths (they at least at the masters level have some Creative Computing and Games Design type courses, and I believe have some CS oriented undergrad courses which will likely have scope to specialise in this area), and Loughborough (which is naturally in your area, a very well regarded uni, and has both strong CS/STEM areas and creative/art and design areas, and likely will have scope to allow you to combine the two from either side in a games focused way for independent work like your dissertation/final year project etc). Do look at more general art or computing courses, depending on your specific strengths and interests, as usually you can to some extent focus in on the games area as above, and having a deeper and broader background on one side can be more beneficial than a general familiarity with both, for some roles in the industry. While formal CS courses often require some background in Maths, not all courses do, including some at reasonably reputable universities - such as Cardiff.
Reply 11
@DanF_2000


I have also just noticed that Sussex have a new course in Games and Multimedia Environments which looks good.

http://www.sussex.ac.uk/study/undergraduate/courses/computer-science-artificial-intelligence-and-digital-media/games-and-multimedia-environments-bsc
Reply 12
Thanks everyone, I'm just mainly looking for universities that are two hours or less away, so a Uni like Falmouth or Abertay might be a bit too far away. I'm looking for places in or near central England like De Montfort, Teesside, Derby, Huddersfield, Lincoln, Wolverhampton, Staffordshire or Aston/Birmingham. In this Games Development Course I'm doing right now at college, the course tutors all recommend Staffordshire, from some of their own personal experience and from students who have left here to go there, and have strongly recommended against Confetti in Nottingham Trent Uni. I might have a look at computer science, although I'd prefer some of the Games Dev courses like:

http://www.tees.ac.uk/undergraduate_courses/Computer_Games/BSc_(Hons)_Computer_Games_Programming.cfm
http://www.staffs.ac.uk/course/computer-games-programming-bsc
http://www.dmu.ac.uk/study/courses/undergraduate-courses/computer-games-programming-bsc-degree/computer-games-programming-bsc-degree.aspx
https://www.derby.ac.uk/computing-courses/computer-games-programming-bsc-hons/
(edited 5 years ago)
Reply 13
Original post by DanF_2000
Thanks everyone, I'm just mainly looking for universities that are two hours or less away, so a Uni like Falmouth or Abertay might be a bit too far away. I'm looking for places in or near central England like De Montfort, Teesside, Derby, Huddersfield, Lincoln, Wolverhampton, Staffordshire or Aston/Birmingham. In this Games Development Course I'm doing right now at college, the course tutors all recommend Staffordshire, from some of their own personal experience and from students who have left here to go there, and have strongly recommended against Confetti in Nottingham Trent Uni. I might have a look at computer science, although I'd prefer some of the Games Dev courses like:

http://www.tees.ac.uk/undergraduate_courses/Computer_Games/BSc_(Hons)_Computer_Games_Programming.cfm
http://www.staffs.ac.uk/course/computer-games-programming-bsc
http://www.dmu.ac.uk/study/courses/undergraduate-courses/computer-games-programming-bsc-degree/computer-games-programming-bsc-degree.aspx
https://www.derby.ac.uk/computing-courses/computer-games-programming-bsc-hons/

But the thing is, if you're on track for Distinctions then you'll have access to top unis. As previously said, those unis really aren't very good (with the exception of Staffordshire, which although doesn't rank high I've heard good things)

You're considering Teeside, so why not look at Newcastle which is a Russell Group and have a Computer Science degree with Games specialism or Leeds isn't too far from you and is also a Russell Group which also has a Computer Science degree with Games/Graphics focus, both I previously linked.

Another option to explore could be Durham with a Foundation year as they have an exceptional reputation (frequently in the top 5/6 in the UK) and again, if you're considering Teesode they're not too far but the difference in the quality of education you'll get will be immeasurable.

Not trying to disrespect anyone who goes to a not so high ranked uni but, do you not feel that if you go somewhere with low entry requirements when you're on track for distinction that you'll be missing out or wondering what could have been if you had pushed yourself? I've have friends in this situation who received top grades (ALL Distinctions) in their BTEC and chose to go somewhere for an easier ride, now after graduating have regret.

All fees for uni are the same and the only way to get value for money isn't like most things where you can pay more for higher quality, the value of your higher education is determined on what grades you get from college and what quality of institution that gets you into. And if you keep on track for all distinctions and go somewhere that doesn't require that level then you could be doing yourself a disservice.
Original post by DanF_2000
Thanks everyone, I'm just mainly looking for universities that are two hours or less away, so a Uni like Falmouth or Abertay might be a bit too far away. I'm looking for places in or near central England like De Montfort, Teesside, Derby, Huddersfield, Lincoln, Wolverhampton, Staffordshire or Aston/Birmingham. In this Games Development Course I'm doing right now at college, the course tutors all recommend Staffordshire, from some of their own personal experience and from students who have left here to go there, and have strongly recommended against Confetti in Nottingham Trent Uni. I might have a look at computer science, although I'd prefer some of the Games Dev courses like:

http://www.tees.ac.uk/undergraduate_courses/Computer_Games/BSc_(Hons)_Computer_Games_Programming.cfm
http://www.staffs.ac.uk/course/computer-games-programming-bsc
http://www.dmu.ac.uk/study/courses/undergraduate-courses/computer-games-programming-bsc-degree/computer-games-programming-bsc-degree.aspx
https://www.derby.ac.uk/computing-courses/computer-games-programming-bsc-hons/


Hi @DanF_2000

Please give me a shout if you have any specific questions about any of our games courses and I'll do my best to answer them.

Thanks

Amy
Hi Dan

Please give me a shout if you have any questions about the course here at Teesside. We love it (obviously) but if you'd like to know more just get in touch!

Thanks, good luck with your research :smile:

Laura

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