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Socialists Question Time AKA 'Ask a Socialist' watch

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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    Private property and the structure of the economy aren't fundamental to the socialist party, right.
    Well, no. Regardless of whether our members believe in private property or not (and not all of them hold the same view by any means), I think that we accept that significantly altering how the concept of private property works in today's society may not be in a good thing. In fifty to a hundred years things may be different.

    An actual postition, a real position. Not vagaries masked in language and other waffle.
    Well god forbid that we should use language to explain our position :rolleyes:

    Fine. Property is Theft. My opinion.
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    (Original post by ukebert)
    Fine. Property is Theft. My opinion.
    :mmm:
    :tea:

    Agreed.
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    And in my view, Property isn't theft. Beautiful.
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    (Original post by smalltownboy)
    And in my view, Property isn't theft. Beautiful.
    Well your view would be different to the veiw of the mainstream of the party seeing as you are the furthest right of any member of the party.
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    (Original post by History-Boy)
    Well your view would be different to the veiw of the mainstream of the party seeing as you are the furthest right of any member of the party.
    Though property is theft probably isn't party line, because most of us recognise that abolishing property laws atm would be chaotic. We do need a massive cultural shift.
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    (Original post by History-Boy)
    Well your view would be different to the veiw of the mainstream of the party seeing as you are the furthest right of any member of the party.
    Yeh, it's a strange Socialist party when a Democratic Socialist is the furthest right by a mile.
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    (Original post by smalltownboy)
    Yeh, it's a strange Socialist party when a Democratic Socialist is the furthest right by a mile.
    I fought you where a social democrat after your stance on that internal debate.
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    (Original post by smalltownboy)
    And in my view, Property isn't theft. Beautiful.
    Exactly It isn't something that we can legislate on, so it isn't a party policy. At the moment we are open to all left leaning people who believe in democratic reform, at this stage in terms of policy social democrats like yourself and Nothos (?) aren't significantly different from the rest.
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    (Original post by History-Boy)
    I fought you where a social democrat after your stance on that internal debate.
    No, the question put to me was; "Would you rather live under a Social Democrat or a Communist regime" and I answered Social Democrat because it is far closer to my views than a Communist regime. Though of course it depends on how you define Socialism....to most I am probably a Social Democrat. Though I would ally myself with Robert Page's definition of "transformative democratic socialism" (strong welfare state, fiscal redistribution, some nationalisation)
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    (Original post by smalltownboy)
    .............
    Delete your post quickly plus it was anarchist not communist there's a very important difference their due to Communisms links to totalitarianism.
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    (Original post by paperclip)
    Though property is theft probably isn't party line, because most of us recognise that abolishing property laws atm would be chaotic. We do need a massive cultural shift.
    (Original post by smalltownboy)
    Yeh, it's a strange Socialist party when a Democratic Socialist is the furthest right by a mile.
    Would it be fair to characterise the party as holding an ideal of communism/anarcho-communism but accepting that such extreme policies wouldn't work in the short run (ie. without a massive culture shift) and thus proposing socialist policies?
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    (Original post by History-Boy)
    it was anarchist not communist there's a very important difference their due to Communisms links to totalitarianism.
    I'd have thought a socialist party member would defend communism as not inherently totalitarian. Moreover anarchism is very different from anarcho-communism, and a world away from the state management of goods Adorno spoke about above.

    IMHO the Socialist party needs to decide what it is. While we all know it's a leftist party, there is a huge difference between the kind of Socialism smalltownboy mentions and communism, and anarchism. Does the Socialist Party know what it wants, and what it'll work towards (if those are different things)? Is it a socialist party or is it moving to be a more-radical communist or anarcho-communist party?
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    (Original post by ukebert)
    Well, no. Regardless of whether our members believe in private property or not (and not all of them hold the same view by any means), I think that we accept that significantly altering how the concept of private property works in today's society may not be in a good thing. In fifty to a hundred years things may be different.

    Well god forbid that we should use language to explain our position :rolleyes:

    Fine. Property is Theft. My opinion.
    "Property is Theft" that is an oxymoron though isn't it.

    You're just showing your party doesn't really know what you're about.
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    (Original post by Drogue)
    Would it be fair to characterise the party as holding an ideal of communism/anarcho-communism but accepting that such extreme policies wouldn't work in the short run (ie. without a massive culture shift) and thus proposing socialist policies?
    There are certainly some in the party that hold that view (such as myself) but there are others that do not.
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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    "Property is Theft" that is an oxymoron though isn't it.

    You're just showing your party doesn't really know what you're about.
    I suppose it could be taken as an oxymoron.

    Really though it should read "Property (owned by individuals) is theft (from the people)". Although you probably realised that already and are being deliberately obtuse.
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    There's a socialist in the cast of the play that I'm in (Dracula, if you're anywhere Keele Uni next week come along :p:) and we were talking about property. He doesn't believe in it, so I took his book from him. He hit me with an umbrella and reminded me that he lives by society's rules
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    (Original post by ukebert)
    I suppose it could be taken as an oxymoron.

    Really though it should read "Property (owned by individuals) is theft (from the people)". Although you probably realised that already and are being deliberately obtuse.
    Here, here,
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    (Original post by ukebert)
    I suppose it could be taken as an oxymoron.

    Really though it should read "Property (owned by individuals) is theft (from the people)". Although you probably realised that already and are being deliberately obtuse.
    No I thought it ment that already. But if I 'steal' something which is owned by 'the people', I'm not really stealing it beacuse I am a member of 'the people' and therefore own it anyway, and I can't steal from myself so it is an oxymoron.
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    (Original post by Seven_Three)
    No I thought it ment that already. But if I 'steal' something which is owned by 'the people', I'm not really stealing it beacuse I am a member of 'the people' and therefore own it anyway, and I can't steal from myself so it is an oxymoron.
    I'm sure that I don't actually have to explain this to you.
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    Calm down Ukey, he's young :p:
 
 
 
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