Chaes97
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Hi guys,

So I just registered here today since I'm wondering whether or not I have a decent chance of breaking into investment banking (BB preferred).

Some context:
I'm Dutch, 21 years old, and just finished my BSc. in International Business Administration at RSM Erasmus University (considered the best b-school in the Netherlands, and top 10 in Europe). My overall GPA is 3.9/4.0. Since the investment banking scene in mainland Europe is pretty small, it has become my goal to move to London in the future in order to pursue a career in IB. I don't (yet) have relevant work experience, which is why I decided to take a gap year next year (between my BSc. and MSc.) and do several internships. From September onwards, I'll do a client coverage internship (corporate/institutional banking) at a top 3 bank in my country until the end of December. After that, I want to do another internship (in corporate finance/M&A) either at the same bank or somewhere else. Having done all that, I want to secure a summer internship position at a BB in London, get a FT offer, do my MSc. in the Netherlands, and start working.

Having completed 2 internships by then, what are my chances of getting that summer internship in London? I have some extra-curriculars on my CV (board member of investment club, organizing a trip for a study association, a (perhaps irrelevant) R&D internship that I did after my first year, and some voluntary tutoring work).

I know that internationals might be at a disadvantage when it comes to recruitment, especially if you didn't go to LSE, LBS, Oxbridge, or similar tier 1/2 b-schools. But quite some people that I know made it to London in the end, so I guess it's all about dedication and motivation.

Thanks a lot guys, hope someone could enlighten me .

Chaes

Edit: thread title might be slightly misleading, I meant to say "... non-UK/USA student".
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gicu
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Don't want to discurage you but in my opinion quite low. You have finished university and haven't done an internship so far. Even if you make up for those years in those two internships you mentioned , just take a step back and picture the competition from year 2 super competitive UK students from LSE UCL Oxbridge. I think the best bet for you is to land a FO at a BB in Benelux , kill it , and then transfer to London . According to efinancialcareers only 1%( that means only one student) from RSM got a FO position at JPM. GS , MS have no intake of RSM students in 2017( the only other BB taking RSM was Barclays at 5%, but I bet this dude/dudes had previously done a lot of internships ). I know those numbers are for analyst recruitment, not for summer internships, but I believe they are quite significant because banks hire mostly from their summer interns.
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Chaes97
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(Original post by gicu)
Don't want to discurage you but in my opinion quite low. You have finished university and haven't done an internship so far. Even if you make up for those years in those two internships you mentioned , just take a step back and picture the competition from year 2 super competitive UK students from LSE UCL Oxbridge. I think the best bet for you is to land a FO at a BB in Benelux , kill it , and then transfer to London . According to efinancialcareers only 1%( that means only one student) from RSM got a FO position at JPM. GS , MS have no intake of RSM students in 2017( the only other BB taking RSM was Barclays at 5%, but I bet this dude/dudes had previously done a lot of internships ). I know those numbers are for analyst recruitment, not for summer internships, but I believe they are quite significant because banks hire mostly from their summer interns.
First of all, thank you for your reply.
Judging by your reply, I'm guessing you're either from the UK or USA. As far as I know, most of what you wrote is kind of incorrect. I know about 15-20 RSM graduates personally that, today, work at GS, JPM, MS, etc. When browsing through LinkedIn, I see loads (literally loads) of RSM (and Economics) graduates working at a BB in London, Amsterdam, New York, etc. Therefore I think this 1%, as well as the notion that MS/GS don't take RSM students, is false.

Additionally, to my understanding this whole culture of summer internships is typically an Anglo-American / UK kind of thing. In mainland Europe it is in fact rather uncommon to do summer internships as usually it is not included in the Bachelor curriculum. Only in the third year there's an opportunity to either go on exchange (I went to Beijing) or to do an internship. But at this stage, getting into a BB is close to impossible. Actually I was one of the few (I guess <5%) of students that did a voluntary internship after my freshman year in university. I just did it to distinguish myself and to gain some hands-on experience.

Throughout the last few months, I have been in contact with numerous people, including those that work or will start working at a BB in London and all of them gave me a fair chance. So that's why I'm kind of surprised by what you said. But most of those people are Dutch, so that could explain the difference in perspectives.
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gicu
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(Original post by Chaes97)
First of all, thank you for your reply.
Judging by your reply, I'm guessing you're either from the UK or USA. As far as I know, most of what you wrote is kind of incorrect. I know about 15-20 RSM graduates personally that, today, work at GS, JPM, MS, etc. When browsing through LinkedIn, I see loads (literally loads) of RSM (and Economics) graduates working at a BB in London, Amsterdam, New York, etc. Therefore I think this 1%, as well as the notion that MS/GS don't take RSM students, is false.

Additionally, to my understanding this whole culture of summer internships is typically an Anglo-American / UK kind of thing. In mainland Europe it is in fact rather uncommon to do summer internships as usually it is not included in the Bachelor curriculum. Only in the third year there's an opportunity to either go on exchange (I went to Beijing) or to do an internship. But at this stage, getting into a BB is close to impossible. Actually I was one of the few (I guess <5%) of students that did a voluntary internship after my freshman year in university. I just did it to distinguish myself and to gain some hands-on experience.

Throughout the last few months, I have been in contact with numerous people, including those that work or will start working at a BB in London and all of them gave me a fair chance. So that's why I'm kind of surprised by what you said. But most of those people are Dutch, so that could explain the difference in perspectives.
The figures I did quote were for the intake of 2017 alone, according to efinancialcareers. I am quite interested in the possibility to leave the Netherlands for UK as well , cause at this very momment I am waiting for the response of UCL economics ( I did miss my Maths offer by 2.5%to 100%), the backup plan being University of Amsterdam. How well regarded is UvA ? Thanks!
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Chaes97
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(Original post by gicu)
The figures I did quote were for the intake of 2017 alone, according to efinancialcareers. I am quite interested in the possibility to leave the Netherlands for UK as well , cause at this very momment I am waiting for the response of UCL economics ( I did miss my Maths offer by 2.5%to 100%), the backup plan being University of Amsterdam. How well regarded is UvA ? Thanks!
I guess they're kind of incomplete then, but not sure.
So you are also Dutch, or looking to move to the Netherlands?
It is kind of complicated to give the Dutch universities a uniform rating for all their faculties combined. Erasmus University is the place to go to for Business and Economics studies (based on reputation, rankings, research, employment opportunities, etc.). I'd personally rate Tilburg University and Maastricht University 2nd and 3rd, respectively. Other universities I'm not that familiar with, to be honest..
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gicu
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[QUOTE=Chaes97;78709490]I guess they're kind of incomplete then, but not sure.
So you are also Dutch, or looking to move to the Netherlands?
It is kind of complicated to give the Dutch universities a uniform rating for all their faculties combined. Erasmus University is the place to go to for Business and Economics studies (based on reputation, rankings, research, employment opportunities, etc.). I'd personally rate Tilburg University and Maastricht University 2nd and 3rd, respectively. Other universities I'm not that familiar with, to be honest..[/QUOT

Sorry for hijacking your post , but have you got any ideea if MBB in Amsterdam hires non-Dutch speaking employees? Thanks!
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xtrembob
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(Original post by Chaes97)
Hi guys,

So I just registered here today since I'm wondering whether or not I have a decent chance of breaking into investment banking (BB preferred).

Some context:
I'm Dutch, 21 years old, and just finished my BSc. in International Business Administration at RSM Erasmus University (considered the best b-school in the Netherlands, and top 10 in Europe). My overall GPA is 3.9/4.0. Since the investment banking scene in mainland Europe is pretty small, it has become my goal to move to London in the future in order to pursue a career in IB. I don't (yet) have relevant work experience, which is why I decided to take a gap year next year (between my BSc. and MSc.) and do several internships. From September onwards, I'll do a client coverage internship (corporate/institutional banking) at a top 3 bank in my country until the end of December. After that, I want to do another internship (in corporate finance/M&A) either at the same bank or somewhere else. Having done all that, I want to secure a summer internship position at a BB in London, get a FT offer, do my MSc. in the Netherlands, and start working.

Having completed 2 internships by then, what are my chances of getting that summer internship in London? I have some extra-curriculars on my CV (board member of investment club, organizing a trip for a study association, a (perhaps irrelevant) R&D internship that I did after my first year, and some voluntary tutoring work).

I know that internationals might be at a disadvantage when it comes to recruitment, especially if you didn't go to LSE, LBS, Oxbridge, or similar tier 1/2 b-schools. But quite some people that I know made it to London in the end, so I guess it's all about dedication and motivation.

Thanks a lot guys, hope someone could enlighten me .

Chaes

Edit: thread title might be slightly misleading, I meant to say "... non-UK/USA student".
I would disagree with the above.

1 year of internship and a Top master will give you very good chances of breaking into IB, however do not neglect the fact that they look for well rounded individuals, if you do any sport/music/activity/volunteering make sure to highlight it and explained what it taught you (can be hard work/commitment/social skills/teamwork/competitiveness/being driven/attention to detail and more). Where do you plan on doing your MSc? RSM or moving to the UK? RSM is a target for the London office. I personally know an analyst/associate working at MS in the CR team that studied at RSM.
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Chaes97
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(Original post by xtrembob)
I would disagree with the above.

1 year of internship and a Top master will give you very good chances of breaking into IB, however do not neglect the fact that they look for well rounded individuals, if you do any sport/music/activity/volunteering make sure to highlight it and explained what it taught you (can be hard work/commitment/social skills/teamwork/competitiveness/being driven/attention to detail and more). Where do you plan on doing your MSc? RSM or moving to the UK? RSM is a target for the London office. I personally know an analyst/associate working at MS in the CR team that studied at RSM.
Yep, I totally agree with what you said. Right now I don't do any volunteering or music activities, though. I did, however, sign up for an ambassador programme at RSM (I am yet to hear whether they take me or not).

I plan on doing my MSc in Finance & Investments or Finance & Investments Advanced at RSM. The tuition fee is only €2000 a year, so it's good value for money. The advanced programme is 8k extra though. I do/am consider(ing) an MSc in London or elsewhere in Europe but the tuition fees are way higher everywhere else, + I'd have to do a GMAT. So I think that, in the end, RSM would be the most sensible choice for me.
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xtrembob
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(Original post by Chaes97)
Yep, I totally agree with what you said. Right now I don't do any volunteering or music activities, though. I did, however, sign up for an ambassador programme at RSM (I am yet to hear whether they take me or not).

I plan on doing my MSc in Finance & Investments or Finance & Investments Advanced at RSM. The tuition fee is only €2000 a year, so it's good value for money. The advanced programme is 8k extra though. I do/am consider(ing) an MSc in London or elsewhere in Europe but the tuition fees are way higher everywhere else, + I'd have to do a GMAT. So I think that, in the end, RSM would be the most sensible choice for me.
Anything is fine, I cannot detail all non finance activities, but you seem to have understood what I meant.
Is your MSc 1 or 2 year long? If 1 year, apply for summers before your Master hoping to get a return offer post master. If 2 year apply for summers during your first year. You should be fine doing your master at RSM, I agree that masters in the UK (and some other unis in Europe) are overpriced.
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Chaes97
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(Original post by xtrembob)
Anything is fine, I cannot detail all non finance activities, but you seem to have understood what I meant.
Is your MSc 1 or 2 year long? If 1 year, apply for summers before your Master hoping to get a return offer post master. If 2 year apply for summers during your first year. You should be fine doing your master at RSM, I agree that masters in the UK (and some other unis in Europe) are overpriced.
The RSM MSc programmes are 1 year long. Some extended MSc.'s like the F&I Advanced programme is 1.5 years. So yeah I think I'll have to start applying for summer analyst positions somewhere in August/September, right?
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xtrembob
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(Original post by Chaes97)
The RSM MSc programmes are 1 year long. Some extended MSc.'s like the F&I Advanced programme is 1.5 years. So yeah I think I'll have to start applying for summer analyst positions somewhere in August/September, right?
Yep, make sure to put your coming internships/what you will do over the year. Apply early, prepare and you will be set. I have just met a Master student a Erasmus University working in S&T for JPM. You should get interviews, after this it will be up to you to do well and get an offer.
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Chaes97
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(Original post by xtrembob)
Yep, make sure to put your coming internships/what you will do over the year. Apply early, prepare and you will be set. I have just met a Master student a Erasmus University working in S&T for JPM. You should get interviews, after this it will be up to you to do well and get an offer.
Yeah, totally.
Sounds good! How did you meet him? You work at JPM yourselves?
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Chaes97
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Does anyone else have anything to add/advise, etc.?
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xtrembob
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(Original post by Chaes97)
Yeah, totally.
Sounds good! How did you meet him? You work at JPM yourselves?
Through friends
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Chaes97
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(Original post by xtrembob)
Through friends
Ah thats pretty convenient then
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