B1445 – Abortion Equality Bill 2019 (Second Reading)

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Saracen's Fez
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B1445 – Abortion Equality Bill 2019 (Second Reading), Joep95 MP, Connor27 MP
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A
bill
to
give fathers equal opportunity to abort parental rights before a child is born.

1. Definitions
(1) Father is the biological male parent.
(2) Mother is the biological female parent.
(3) The abortion deadline is as defined in the Abortion Act 1967 S.1(1)(a)

2. Legal abortion
(1) A father can permanently abort all parental rights and responsibilities to a child-
(A) up to 1 week before the abortion deadline; or
(B) up to 2 weeks after the father discovers about the pregnancy if the mother knew about the pregnancy 1 week before the abortion deadline; or
(C) at any point during the pregnancy with the mothers consent.

3. Process
(1) To abort all parental rights and responsibilities a father must communicate that they intend to by
(a) sending a letter by recorded delivery that has been certified by their solicitor to the mother, and
(b) completing a form which must be submitted to the Registry Office
(2) The message must to clearly state "I am aborting all parental rights and responsibilities to the child you are currently pregnant with"

4. Exemptions
(1) Anyone found guilty of rape may not abort their responsibilities and will remain liable to all financial costs
(2) Anyone found guilty of any form of domestic abuse may not abort their responsibilities and will remain liable to all financial costs

5. Extent, commencement, and short title
(1) This Act does not extend to Northern Ireland.
(2) This Act comes into force on the day on which it is passed.
(3) This Act may be cited as the Abortion equality bill 2019

Notes
Let's do something to reduce legal inequality.

Since 1976 a right has existed for just one group of people and but not another, how in a society where people claim to support equality can this be accepted?

Changes:
Exemption section added
Abortion deadline defined
Added completion of form
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Mr T 999
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Well this is dead :tumble:
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Dafios9128
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(Original post by mr T 999)
Well this is dead :tumble:
Pretty much sums up this place nowadays
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Miss Maddie
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A rapist should automatically lose their parenting rights. There shouldn't be contact with the child directly or indirectly.
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CatusStarbright
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I'm hesitant about the bill. I think that in principle it could be a nice idea, but I worry about the consequences of it in practice.
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SoggyCabbages
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Hmmm an improvement, bit hesitant on 4(1), although rapists shouldn' be allowed to see the children they produce and they should have parental responsibilities removed, that could also unfairly leave a financial burden on the mother who is lumped with a child she may not be able to afford.
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Jammy Duel
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(Original post by SoggyCabbages)
Hmmm an improvement, bit hesitant on 4(1), although rapists shouldn' be allowed to see the children they produce and they should have parental responsibilities removed, that could also unfairly leave a financial burden on the mother who is lumped with a child she may not be able to afford.
I think you're misreading it, they *may not* abort, i.e. they have no choice but to be liable
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Joep95
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(Original post by SoggyCabbages)
Hmmm an improvement, bit hesitant on 4(1), although rapists shouldn' be allowed to see the children they produce and they should have parental responsibilities removed, that could also unfairly leave a financial burden on the mother who is lumped with a child she may not be able to afford.
They aren't but they still pay, for them nothing changes
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Joep95
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(Original post by Miss Maddie)
A rapist should automatically lose their parenting rights. There shouldn't be contact with the child directly or indirectly.
The law for rapists stays the same as it is, this doesn't change anything for them
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SoggyCabbages
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(Original post by Jammy Duel)
I think you're misreading it, they *may not* abort, i.e. they have no choice but to be liable
Oh no I didn't misread it, I was just having a personal conflict with myself. I believe if you rape someone then obviously you do not deserve to see that child, but on the other hand then if the paternal responsibility is legally severed, then the mother cannot expect financial support from the father even if she may need it.

So although I'm uneasy with rapists having responsibility, I will vote aye on this because the mother shouldn't be lumped with sole financial responsibility.
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Joleee
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child support exists because children are a financial burden. when you take the burden off fathers, the burden doesn't go away - it just shifts to everyone else. the state pays for it in the form of social welfare, physical and mental health services (poverty leading to poor diets. father abandonment affecting mental health). children in poor households are more likely to end up in the criminal justice system. children who grow up in poverty are more likely to stay in poverty than get out of it - meaning the state never stops paying.

the 'father' is not the only male in this scenario btw. so is his son and all the other men who don't want to/can't afford to pay for the father getting someone pregnant. this bill isn't justice for men, at all. it only cares about the select who don't want to take responsibility for themselves.
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ns_2
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It is nice to see some of the suggestions brought on board; most notably, the inclusion of the Registry Office to avoid potential arguments surrounding letters and the recognisation of termination of rights under law.

However, whilst I get what 4(1) is attempting to do, I feel it is worded in the wrong way. "not aborting their responsbilities" would entail they retain the right to see their child; something I am vehemently agaisnt. To avoid confusion, I would suggest that it be amended as to read "Anyone found guilty of rape may not invoke the provisions of this Bill, thereby remaining liable to any financial costs and committments under existing law" etc.

Though, I still remain in support of this Bill, and on balance will be voting for it.
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JMR2020.
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No, they should not be able to ‘abort responsibility’ for a child.
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Joep95
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(Original post by JMR2019.)
No, they should not be able to ‘abort responsibility’ for a child.
Why not
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JMR2020.
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(Original post by Joep95)
Why not
If they didn’t want a child, they should have taken caution beforehand.
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Joep95
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(Original post by JMR2019.)
If they didn’t want a child, they should have taken caution beforehand.
So I take it you would support a repeal of the abortion act?
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JMR2020.
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(Original post by Joep95)
So I take it you would support a repeal of the abortion act?
No, men and women are biologically different, and often women do need abortions for various reasons.
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Joep95
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(Original post by JMR2019.)
No, men and women are biologically different, and often women do need abortions for various reasons.
How about just 1(1)(a)

or do women not need to take the precautions as well?
Last edited by Joep95; 1 year ago
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Saunders16
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(Original post by Joleee)
child support exists because children are a financial burden. when you take the burden off fathers, the burden doesn't go away - it just shifts to everyone else. the state pays for it in the form of social welfare, physical and mental health services (poverty leading to poor diets. father abandonment affecting mental health). children in poor households are more likely to end up in the criminal justice system. children who grow up in poverty are more likely to stay in poverty than get out of it - meaning the state never stops paying.

the 'father' is not the only male in this scenario btw. so is his son and all the other men who don't want to/can't afford to pay for the father getting someone pregnant. this bill isn't justice for men, at all. it only cares about the select who don't want to take responsibility for themselves.
Hear, hear.

Have sex, face the consequences of your actions. That is not an argument against abortion, because aborting does not shift the burden elsewhere. Aborting responsibility does.
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ns_2
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(Original post by Saunders16)
Hear, hear.

Have sex, face the consequences of your actions. That is not an argument against abortion, because aborting does not shift the burden elsewhere. Aborting responsibility does.
Would you rather the father attains the right to demand the abortion of the child, then?
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