How has Trump done at the half-way point in his presidency? Watch

username1738683
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#41
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#41
(Original post by 999tigger)
The Pyramids ar Giza, certainly not the wall.
It cannot be seen from the Moon

It was Robert Ripley, the American illustrator who made a fortune with his cartoon feature Believe It Or Not!, who called the Great Wall “The mightiest work of man – the only one that would be visible to the human eye from the Moon”. This statement was, of course, founded on no evidence at all, since it was made 30 years before anyone had been in space. Yet it became sanctioned by use. Even the eminent Sinologist Joseph Needham, author of Science and Civilisation in China, stated that “the Wall has been considered the only work of man which could be picked out by Martian astronomers”. Though discredited by astronauts, the Moon version is still widely quoted as a “fact”. The truth was established once and for all during the first Chinese space flight in 2003, when astronaut Yang Liwei said he couldn’t see anything of it from orbit.

It never stopped 
an invasion

The Wall was easily overrun or avoided by northern tribes. In 1449, the Mongols inflicted a defeat on the Ming south of the Wall, and it was only during a period of peace (1571–1644) that it was completed. However, it fell to the Manchus in 1644 when a local Ming general opened the far eastern gate, Shanhaiguan, to the invaders.
At last, a useful reply! Walls, who the hell ever thought of them in the first place.
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Pinkisk
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#42
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(Original post by zhog)
Cor, you had to learn that from a report? Do you guys go out much?

This is incredible at times, because Kim hasn't put everything down two years into Trump's presidency nothing has happened. That is derangement syndrome.
There is no doubt that walls such as the one built in Israel work and work extremely well. I mean, Israel went from daily/weekly terrorist attacks, abductions assaults etc. to next no terrorism whatsoever the moment the wall was completed. The wall works and works fantastically! There is a question as to whether or not a wall is ethical and appropriate but there is no question whatsoever as to whether or not it will work. Personally, I think the US would be much better off stopping immigration by putting an end to its very destructive foreign policy. I mean, there were no Venezuelans immigrating to the US before the US put crippling sanctions on Venezuela. Today Venezuelans make up the second largest group of immigrants migrating to the US.
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username1738683
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#43
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(Original post by Pinkisk)
There is no doubt that walls such as the one built in Israel work and work extremely well. I mean, Israel went from daily/weekly terrorist attacks, abductions assaults etc. to next no terrorism whatsoever the moment the wall was completed. The wall works and works fantastically! There is a question as to whether or not a wall is ethical and appropriate but there is no question whatsoever as to whether or not it will work. Personally, I think the US would be much better off stopping immigration by putting an end to its very destructive foreign policy. I mean, there were no Venezuelans immigrating to the US before the US put crippling sanctions on Venezuela. Today Venezuelans make up the second largest group of immigrants to the US.
It was an electoral promise, enough people voted for it and want one, it's an all American affair and whether it works for them is their business. What is beyond doubt, from this safe distance, is that Trump wants to curb illegal immigration and the Democrats want to facilitate it. I have no idea of what makes anyone wish it to thrive, other than people who directly benefit from it somehow.

We could say that Obama's Catch and Release policy didn't work very well in terms of deterring illegal immigration either. A wall is always going to be more effective than something that actively encourages it like that.
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999tigger
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#44
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#44
(Original post by zhog)
It was an electoral promise, enough people voted for it and want one, it's an all American affair and whether it works for them is their business. What is beyond doubt, from this safe distance, is that Trump wants to curb illegal immigration and the Democrats want to facilitate it. I have no idea of what makes anyone wish it to thrive, other than people who directly benefit from it somehow.

We could easily say that the Catch and Release Obama policy didn't work very well in terms of deterring illegal immigration. A wall is always going to be more effective than something that actively encourages it like that.
He didnt win the populat vote and this time the democrats were elected by a big majority of the popular vote on the basis of opposing the wall, so just as Trump is carrying out his promise to his voters, th democrats are carrying out theirs.
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username1738683
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#45
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#45
(Original post by 999tigger)
He didnt win the populat vote and this time the democrats were elected by a big majority of the popular vote on the basis of opposing the wall, so just as Trump is carrying out his promise to his voters, th democrats are carrying out theirs.
You're only concerned with frustrating Trump, were the wall a Democrat idea and you'd be singing a different tune altogether. As much as they used to, plenty of clips with their leading figures knocking illegal immigration big time when it was the most lucrative thing to say. Hillary was dead against gay marriage once, can you believe that?

I'll come quietly if you can find any trace of a Border Patrol agent who doesn't think walls work, the only ones I've heard think they do. Never heard one say that Catch and Release was ever a good idea either but maybe they just don't fancy the added workload it generates.
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999tigger
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#46
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#46
(Original post by zhog)
You're only concerned with frustrating Trump, were the wall a Democrat idea and you'd be singing a different tune altogether. As much as they used to, plenty of clips with their leading figures knocking illegal immigration big time when it was the most lucrative thing to say. Hillary was dead against gay marriage once, can you believe that?
Nothing to do with me you just keep making consistently untrue or ignorant comments.
Mine was that although it was part of Trumps manifesto, it was also part of the Democrats and their election an margin of victory was greater and more recent.

He needs a lot more than $5 billion is more like $25 bulliobn as a min and without taking into acount cost increases.
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The RAR
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#47
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#47
(Original post by Pinkisk)
He's done a really good Job. He's kept all of his promises, which is a first for a politician.
This, I am not a Trump fan in anyway but it's rare these days to see politicians keeping their promises before getting elected. Trump has done everything, or almost everything he promised during the campaign, even if they were controversial like the Muslim Ban. The wall idea seems a bit stupid as...well it's a damn wall and migrants can still go through it. He slightly better than Obama, and unlike previous presidents, he is not a war mongerer and really wants peace.
Of course, by no means is Trump perfect, the government shutdown was ridiculous, 800,000 people were left without pay including senators and cops. How are you meant to protect America against illegal migrants without the men necessary? I doubt the border guards will be working overpay just to be called a patriot, they have a family to feed.
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yankeedog1953
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#48
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Firstly, Obama was a community organizer, teacher, and in Congress a short time. He's a socialist. That " stimulous package " was a waste of capital. He thinks jobs are the result of ideology : not supply and demand. Give Trump 800 billion and watch what would happen.

The polls i see show his overall performance aproval numbers slowly ticking up.
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Realitysreflexx
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#49
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#49
Hasn't started a global conflict.

So he's done fine.
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yankeedog1953
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#50
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I think Trump wants a wall to try and slow the unchecked flow of drugs into the US as much as illegal entry. He HATES drugs and drug traffickers.
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Dez
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#51
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#51
(Original post by zhog)
Of course not, the people you follow want the border to be as porous as possible and a wall is a bit of an obstacle to that desire. To call someone willng to deter illegal immigration as possible 'vain' is an euphemism expressing how much bother that represents to them. They want to see thousands of people trekking the land, keeping gangs ticking nicely and generally just implementing the Open Borders dream. You want that too, don't you?
Strawman argument. Kindly don't waste my time with nonsensical replies like this.
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username1738683
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#52
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(Original post by Dez)
Strawman argument. Kindly don't waste my time with nonsensical replies like this.
Chicken...
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turquoise_badger
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#53
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(Original post by zhog)
Look, do you know what the first man-made construction visible from space is? This 'walls don't work' line originates entirely from people engaged in an effort to prevent one from being built at all. It's a line from people interested in facilitating illegal immigration, it's not as if they don't work to some extent in terms of deterring it. Ask Israel.
Actually, the story that the Great Wall of China can been seen from space is a myth. You can't actually see it.

A wall works in Israel because they have the manpower to patrol it constantly, because they have top-of-the-line surveillance and monitoring equipment to help the guards, and because the border is relatively small in length.

On the other hand, the US-Mexico border is over 3 million miles long, and covers rivers and villages. Monitoring and patrolling that wall constantly would be a near impossible task in terms of provision manpower and surveillance equipment.

And as many people have already said, people can just dig under the wall, especially if the wall is not being monitored properly. Cartels have been doing this already for God knows how long.

The southern border is not the largest method of illegal immigration into the US. The majority of illegal immigrants enter the country legally, and overstay their visas. A wall will not fix that.
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turquoise_badger
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#54
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(Original post by Jebedee)
Ever tried walking towards a wall, only to be stopped dead in your path unable to pass through the bricks?

There you go, tried and tested.
Do you want me to tell you a secret?

People can dig under walls.

Or go around them.

Or enter the country legally and overstay their visas.
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username1738683
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#55
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#55
(Original post by turquoise_badger)
The southern border is not the largest method of illegal immigration into the US. The majority of illegal immigrants enter the country legally, and overstay their visas. A wall will not fix that.
It's not meant to fix that, it is supposed to be an obstacle to having hundreds of thousands entering the country illegally.

Go on, tell us what would work then. What would you do to try and curb illegal immigration. Bugger all, innit?
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Jebedee
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#56
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#56
(Original post by turquoise_badger)
Do you want me to tell you a secret?

People can dig under walls.

Or go around them.

Or enter the country legally and overstay their visas.
So why do prisons have walls if they can just dig under? Are you suggesting that if just one person slips through then the whole project is pointless? Or that hundreds of thousands of people are going to burrow like moles and get through?

Hungary built a wall and cut their illegal immigration by over 90%, while being one of the major routes for refugees to Western Europe. So unless you have some data to suggest this won't be the case for the US...
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Dez
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#57
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(Original post by Jebedee)
Hungary built a wall and cut their illegal immigration by over 90%, while being one of the major routes for refugees to Western Europe. So unless you have some data to suggest this won't be the case for the US...
Hungary is over 100 times smaller than the US, a border wall there is clearly a far less ambitious project than it would be for the states.
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Underscore__
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#58
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#58
(Original post by turquoise_badger)
Actually, the story that the Great Wall of China can been seen from space is a myth. You can't actually see it.

A wall works in Israel because they have the manpower to patrol it constantly, because they have top-of-the-line surveillance and monitoring equipment to help the guards, and because the border is relatively small in length.

On the other hand, the US-Mexico border is over 3 million miles long, and covers rivers and villages. Monitoring and patrolling that wall constantly would be a near impossible task in terms of provision manpower and surveillance equipment.

And as many people have already said, people can just dig under the wall, especially if the wall is not being monitored properly. Cartels have been doing this already for God knows how long.

The southern border is not the largest method of illegal immigration into the US. The majority of illegal immigrants enter the country legally, and overstay their visas. A wall will not fix that.
Sorry, you’re claiming the US border with Mexico is 3,000,000 miles long? You’re off by about 2,998,500 miles.

The Israeli wall is about 1/4 the length of the US/Mexico border but given the US’ huge spending on defence I don’t think it’s as indefensible as you’re making out.

I’m sure for 25 billion dollars someone could come up with a way to minimise the risk of people digging under the wall; deep foundations, electrified fences underground.

The largest source of illegal immigrant is obviously inherently difficult to measure however most studies seem to put visa overstay as around 45% meaning illegal entry would be more common. Even if we disregard that, minimising the number of people who illegally enter is obviously in the best interest of the US.

The whole discussion on the wall has been derailed and side tracked into a discussion on racism
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Pinkisk
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#59
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(Original post by Jebedee)
So why do prisons have walls if they can just dig under? Are you suggesting that if just one person slips through then the whole project is pointless? Or that hundreds of thousands of people are going to burrow like moles and get through?

Hungary built a wall and cut their illegal immigration by over 90%, while being one of the major routes for refugees to Western Europe. So unless you have some data to suggest this won't be the case for the US...
Touché...
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username1738683
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#60
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(Original post by turquoise_badger)
Do you want me to tell you a secret?

People can dig under walls.

Or go around them.

Or enter the country legally and overstay their visas.
The problem with that logic is that, according to it, nobody would have locks on their front doors. Or even have them at all, why bother when intruders can go round the back or through a window?
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