Will the idea of getting married going be commonly looked at as outdated? Watch

LegallyJasmine
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Was thinking about this for days now, I don't live in the west I live in a country where things are fairly strongly governed by culture and traditions. So, in the 'outside world' 😂 do you think that getting married would ever be considered outdated soon? I really hope it doesn't yet at the same time the more I think about marriage the more it kinda almost doesn't make sense. What do you think?
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Decahedron
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I think it is already becoming outdated. It is really only beneficial for the legal reasons to engage in marriage.
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LegallyJasmine
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(Original post by Decahedron)
I think it is already becoming outdated. It is really only beneficial for the legal reasons to engage in marriage.
So if we were to disregard the legal processes involved, what about just the idea or philosophy of marriage? Like finding a person and spending the rest of your life with that one person even when your feelings fade away. Is that idea considered outdated as well?
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Decahedron
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(Original post by JasmineMonsoon)
So if we were to disregard the legal processes involved, what about just the idea or philosophy of marriage? Like finding a person and spending the rest of your life with that one person even when your feelings fade away. Is that idea considered outdated as well?
No, you don't need marriage to find the person you love and stay with them. If things aren't working out you shouldn't stay in a relationship just because you are married, that is insane and unhealthy.

Putting a ring on someone's finger doesn't make any difference as to how you feel about someone.
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ByEeek
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Not sure what consititutes the "outside" world, but in the UK you are pretty much free to choose whichever path you like. And regardless of your preference of partner, civil partnerships or marraiges exist for all. I like the fact that I am married. I love the fact that the relationship with my wife is recorded as a public record for future generations to see and I feel secure knowing that my relationship is secured under law with a few perks to add.
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LegallyJasmine
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(Original post by ByEeek)
Not sure what consititutes the "outside" world, but in the UK you are pretty much free to choose whichever path you like. And regardless of your preference of partner, civil partnerships or marraiges exist for all. I like the fact that I am married. I love the fact that the relationship with my wife is recorded as a public record for future generations to see and I feel secure knowing that my relationship is secured under law with a few perks to add.
Hahaha well by the outside world I basically meant countries that aren’t so governed by culture so like America and the UK and European countries and stuff (or I think). My question though wasn’t whether they have the free will to do so but rather whether the idea of not getting married would ever be more socially prevalent and acceptable than getting married.
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Last edited by LegallyJasmine; 1 month ago
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ByEeek
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(Original post by JasmineMonsoon)
Hahaha well by outside world I basically meant countries that aren’t so governed by culture so like America and the uk and Europe and stuff (or I think). My question though wasn’t whether they have the free will to do so but rather whether the idea of not getting married would ever be more socially prevalent and acceptable than getting married.
Of course. We have friends with and without kids in long term partnerships who are not married. However they are not protected by the law in the event of a break up. They also benefit from the small tax benefits.
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fallen_acorns
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(Original post by Decahedron)
If things aren't working out you shouldn't stay in a relationship just because you are married, that is insane and unhealthy.
this can only remian true... until you have kids.

Just today there was another article on the BBC about the outcomes of children with two parents and those with one. Even accounting for economic circumstances and including children in families with parents who are unhappy, on average there are still huge statistical disadvantages across the board for children coming from single-parent families.

If we want post-child devorce to be easy and the norm, then we need to completly re-structure the way we raise children in society... because at the moment its a disaster for the kids involved.

---

as for the OP, yes marriage is bassically dead outside of religious groups in the UK. When most people who are not very religious say they want to get married, what they really mean is they want a wedding. Weddings are very much alive and booming, and most girls still dream of a wedding... but marriage? Not really. Its gotten to the point where its almost a given if I ask one of my friends 'why do you want to get married' they will reply with something describing their dream wedding.

Its a shame because for me marriage - in its actual traditional and religious meaning - is one of the most important foundational blocks of our society. Its the foundation of a solid family unit, currently the best system we have for raising children, and a requirement for stable societies. But in western countries we have slowly, over the past century, replaced family with goverment. Everything you used to rely on your family for, you now go to your goverment for... and with the goverment filling in, people have found themselves with less and less need for family. Child care, Elderly care, Emergency financial help, Education of pre-school children, housing support/help etc. all things that a family used to be the key provider of, but now the goverment is.

Of course they are now realising that the goverment will never care about them like a family would, and its one of the reason politics is becoming so charged and agressive in western countries. People are not just arguing about what happens to their country any more.. now that the goverment takes care of so many intimate aspects of their lives and has become family to them... its become personal. Now they feel personally threatened and that their intimate situation is at stake by each political change - their wellbeing feels threatened. And they are right - it is.
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fallen_acorns
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(Original post by ByEeek)
Of course. We have friends with and without kids in long term partnerships who are not married. However they are not protected by the law in the event of a break up. They also benefit from the small tax benefits.
I think you need to seperate the idea of marriage, with the legal status of it. Marriage is just a sociological function where two people commit to each other to become as close as family. It has gone through countless whims of society - it has been coopted by multiple religions, changed in definition/legality by multiple systems.. addopted and regulated by multiple goverments etc. But at its core its just that - two people commiting to become family through love.

So for me, in its essence and meaning - you don't need to be legally or religiously married to be 'married',

For example -

I have a family member who got married rapidly with a partner the quickly fell in love with, and then seperated after 6 months.. and filed for devorce as soon as they could after that.

I have a friend who has been with his girlfriend for 9 years, own a home together, have 2 children, and are very happy and stable in their relationship/family life.

Sure, legally my family member was married, and my friend has never been.

But by the actual social meaning of marriage, I would say it is reversed. My family member was never married, and never understood or considered themselves married... but my friend is married to his partner, both in his own attitude and how he functions within society. A peice of paper from the goverment, and an expensive party doesn't change the core meaning for me.
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Decahedron
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(Original post by fallen_acorns)
this can only remian true... until you have kids.

Just today there was another article on the BBC about the outcomes of children with two parents and those with one. Even accounting for economic circumstances and including children in families with parents who are unhappy, on average there are still huge statistical disadvantages across the board for children coming from single-parent families.

If we want post-child devorce to be easy and the norm, then we need to completly re-structure the way we raise children in society... because at the moment its a disaster for the kids involved.
It is an interesting study but if you aren't in a functioning relationship it can really screw up your kids later in life when they can't identify what a healthy relationship looks like.

It results don't surprise me one bit, divorce sucks for kids. **** Cafcass.
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ByEeek
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(Original post by fallen_acorns)
But by the actual social meaning of marriage, I would say it is reversed. My family member was never married, and never understood or considered themselves married... but my friend is married to his partner, both in his own attitude and how he functions within society. A peice of paper from the goverment, and an expensive party doesn't change the core meaning for me.
Completely agree. How a couple view their partnership and how the state views it are two different things. My point was that people who are not married often don't appreciate that the state does not recognise them partnership and so they do not benefit. Worse still, in the event of a split, unmarried couples have no obligations to each other. So if a woman owns a house in name, but the man pays the mortgage, he has no claim on the house in the event of a split. He would do if married. Which reminds me - I need to claim my married couples tax allowance.
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tazarooni89
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(Original post by Decahedron)
I think it is already becoming outdated. It is really only beneficial for the legal reasons to engage in marriage.
I think the legal rights and responsibilities conferred by marriage are the main reasons why it was ever actually beneficial in the first place.


For example, the legal ties created by marriage are more costly and time-consuming to get out of than simply ending a relationship. This means that if a person is willing to marry you, it is a greater indicator of long-term commitment to the relationship than if they simply move in with you, where they can simply get up and leave at any time, without warning.

Marriage also creates legal recognition of the sharing of property. Suppose a man and a woman have children, and the mother decides to leave her career to care for the child, on the presumption that the father will be financially supporting both of them (which is not uncommon at all). If they are unmarried, then she has no legal entitlement to any of his money at all. If the man dies, she will not be a beneficiary of his pension. If he gets annoyed at her one day and simply decides to stop paying for her food and clothing, there's not a lot she can do about it. It's a bigger risk to take in this case.


Whether the state legally recognises your relationship or not can be highly consequential.
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Decahedron
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(Original post by tazarooni89)
I think the legal rights and responsibilities conferred by marriage are the main reasons why it was ever actually beneficial in the first place.


For example, the legal ties created by marriage are more costly and time-consuming to get out of than simply ending a relationship. This means that if a person is willing to marry you, it is a greater indicator of long-term commitment to the relationship than if they simply move in with you, where they can simply get up and leave at any time, without warning.

Marriage also creates legal recognition of the sharing of property. Suppose a man and a woman have children, and the mother decides to leave her career to care for the child, on the presumption that the father will be financially supporting both of them (which is not uncommon at all). If they are unmarried, then she has no legal entitlement to any of his money at all. If the man dies, she will not be a beneficiary of his pension. If he gets annoyed at her one day and simply decides to stop paying for her food and clothing, there's not a lot she can do about it. It's a bigger risk to take in this case.


Whether the state legally recognises your relationship or not can be highly consequential.
Plenty of people used to do it for religious reasons as well as legal.
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tazarooni89
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(Original post by Decahedron)
Plenty of people used to do it for religious reasons as well as legal.
True, but I don't think the "religious reasons" are actually all that different from the legal reasons.

The religious reason to get married is simply that the religion only permits the relationship if it has all the enforceable rights and responsibilities attached to it that come with a legally recognised marriage (rather than just the "mutual understanding" in a de facto relationship that can be broken any time, and carries no weight when it comes to enforceability).
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PTMalewski
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(Original post by JasmineMonsoon)
do you think that getting married would ever be considered outdated soon? I really hope it doesn't yet at the same time the more I think about marriage the more it kinda almost doesn't make sense. What do you think?
No. While the idea of not getting married is more and more accepted, marriage gives some benefits for a family, eg. securing the position of children and other few things.

The problem is however, that more and more young men are getting afraid and reluctant to get married, either because they are afraid of women, or because they're afraid they'll be tied to someone who turns out mental and will poison their life or sue them on made up accusations, or skim half if not most of money they will have earned.
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username4477046
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Depends on the woman and where they are from. Some want to test you. Make sure you be loyal "if you love me, you put a ring on my finger"
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Retired_Messiah
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Sorry if I sound a lil sexist here (not my intent), but to me girls and women seem to hold onto the idea of getting married more strongly than dudes do.

Maybe it's to do with stories of messy divorces. Maybe it's gals being told that they should get married and super value their wedding cause it'll make them hella happys, whereas lads don't rlly get this narrative. Maybe it's both. I dunno. memes
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LegallyJasmine
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(Original post by Retired_Messiah)
Sorry if I sound a lil sexist here (not my intent), but to me girls and women seem to hold onto the idea of getting married more strongly than dudes do.

Maybe it's to do with stories of messy divorces. Maybe it's gals being told that they should get married and super value their wedding cause it'll make them hella happys, whereas lads don't rlly get this narrative. Maybe it's both. I dunno. memes
Nahh to an extent that’s true from what I’ve seen. I guess for me personally I find comfort in the idea of ‘growing old with someone’ as cliché as that sounds. But then again that might be just a romanticized idealized vision that doesn’t reflect reality 🤷*♀️ I actually feel so silly saying that as well. I’d agree that many girls I know mistakenly think that marriage = happiness and whatnot and make it their sole purpose to get married. I’ve seen guys like this as well but I’d say such thinking is more common with the girls I’ve met (or maybe they’re just more vocal about it). I really don’t agree with that type of thinking
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