EU’s Donald Tusk says there is a special place in Hell for Brexiteers Watch

Vinny C
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#41
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(Original post by generallee)
"The truth shall set you free." John 8:32

But only voting Leave will do that, not Remain. Looks like we have yet another slogan!
Fed up being called a moaner, a loser? Don't get fooled again!
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StriderHort
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#42
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(Original post by generallee)
So why did we allow him to wield enourmous power over us then? And why are Remainers arguing that he should continue to do so?
Seems far more competent and even handed than our home grown crop of questionably elected & mandated rulers, it's not like our own house of parliament is free from snide comment, religious rhetoric, jeers and 'unhelpful comments' ..along with simply FKing things up.

I don't think it's ever that I've felt the EU is 'so great', it's more than our own system is 'so bad'...and the EU seemed to at least balance it out a bit...the idea of a permanent Tory government having free reign to do what it wants without oversight scares the proverbial out of me, it really does.
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generallee
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(Original post by Strotty)
Just wondering which part of what it was that Rees-Mogg, Johnson, Gove et al said that was actually true that you voted for ?? My mum's a big leaver - ask her why she voted she'll say "oh it's because I don't want them telling us what to do"..... really mum! Everything else is built round a fantasy - what Britain could be like. We are already the world's 5th largest ecomony - BEING IN THE EU! What position will be be in being out of the EU?

General Lee - typical brexiteer approach - claim the remainder mob are traitors / project fear / betrayals. This over-emotional language is why people vote Brexit in the first place. It's not "Project fear" etc - nope - it's "Project-I-know-what-side-my-bread's-biuttered-on" actually. The EU mitigates the extreme left and the extreme right in our country. We leave EU and we're ruled by Rees-Mogg and Johnson. They're ok - they have plenty of cash, but it's the little man that will be left without a job.

Brexiteer response ??/ Typically - "That'll never happen" (and cross fingers).... let's watch what happens with Nissan pulling out of Sunderland. They've already ceased production of new models, so when they pull the plug on Qashquai etc, they'll close the plant. Thousands of jobs. Dyson - he's a big leaver ... what's he done?? Moved his production to Singapore. This guy really puts his money where his mouth is!! Not so much then!

Next time just take mote of when a Brexiteer says "Oh that'll never happen!.... That's Project fear again!" No mate - it's realising when you've got it good!
I voted to regain our sovereignty. If we have a clean Brexit, or a deal with the Irish backstop effectively mitigated, eventully leading to Brexit, fine. If it doesn't happen if we end up neither leaving nor remaining, a vassal state, which is May's original deal, or if we somehow Remain after all of this (that seems most unlikely, but for the sake of argument) then my vote will have been betrayed. Seventeen and half million votes will have been betrayed, the most people who have ever voted for anything in our entire political history

By a Remainer Parliament, (both Commons and Lords), by a Government led by a Remainer in which Brexiteer Brexit Secretaries were deliberately excluded from influence, by a Remainer Judiciary, by a Remainer Civil Service, and a largely Remainer MSM. The establishment ignoring a direct instruction from the people and doing instead what IT wanted.

The parliamentary system will be revealed to be broken. The people won't have had their will, the establishment will have shamelessly frustrated it. Democracy itself will be destroyed in this country for a generation, maybe longer. 52% of the voting population decided something and this was not reflected in the House of Commos which is probably less than 15% Leaver. All of the main Parloamentary Parties, the Tories, Labour, the SNP, the Lib Dems, Plaid, are ALL Remain. They didn't want to ever deliver Brexit and they wouldn't have. Why should we have been surprised?

That would be a monumental failure of democracy. Terminal for the present system, I think which will have to torn up and replaced. Parliament should be the servants of the people not their masters. So the struggle will continue until we cease to be what fifty years in the EU has turned us into, a Member State. And become a Nation State once more. Free and sovereign.
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the bear
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Sign seen in Liverpool this week

"What is missing from the Eropean Nion ?"
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generallee
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(Original post by the bear)
Sign seen in Liverpool this week

"What is missing from the Eropean Nion ?"
Very droll.

You know what really is missing?

A Demos.
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generallee
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(Original post by StriderHort)
Seems far more competent and even handed than our home grown crop of questionably elected & mandated rulers, it's not like our own house of parliament is free from snide comment, religious rhetoric, jeers and 'unhelpful comments' ..along with simply FKing things up.

I don't think it's ever that I've felt the EU is 'so great', it's more than our own system is 'so bad'...and the EU seemed to at least balance it out a bit...the idea of a permanent Tory government having free reign to do what it wants without oversight scares the proverbial out of me, it really does.
Our EU rulers competent?? Are you for real?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPgiI46FCDU

I don't disagree that our rulers aren't any better, but we can get rid of them in an election. No voters anywhere in Europe can remove clowns like Tusk and Juncker.

THAT is the fundamental difference.
Last edited by generallee; 1 week ago
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username1738683
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#47
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(Original post by Notoriety)
So if you thoughtlessly chose Brexit, and in doing so without a plan caused chaos, you're someone who is morally condemned. I think that's sensible.
But isn't he referring to those who promoted it, not the ones who chose it? Presumably, those were the ones who voted for what was promoted.

To me, he is referring to Farage, Boris and the parts of the British political system that promoted Brexit. They didn't choose it and it isn't even their fault that Brexit has become a mess. The EU is more responsible for it than they are.
Last edited by username1738683; 1 week ago
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The Champion.m4a
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#48
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Taylor Swift condemning women who joked about her to hell teas.

Joke's on him because I'm an atheist and I don't believe in hell. But if it does, I'm glad I'm a VIP.
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username1738683
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(Original post by MrDystopia)
Quite click-baity as a title. He said it when referring to those who had no idea what the plan was, yet still peddled a fantasy Brexit.
Bah, how could they possibly have a plan at the stage the question was presented? What plan could that possibly be, the terms of the exit would always have to be thrashed out by the Government and Parliament with the EU. Brexit and Trump have something in common.

Free trade with Europe, doing away with the euro courts, customs union, no more freedom of movement, no more paying into the Union, no Irish border, all that was part of the plan and the details were always going to depend on more than could be promised. Had there been this imaginary explicit 'plan' and it would be so full of holes by now that it would have become another weapon to oppose Brexit. This is a very fatuous argument by Remainers.

I have no opinion on Brexit, by the way.
Last edited by username1738683; 1 week ago
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Fruli
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(Original post by Sharif92)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-politics-47143135

Quite unhelpful language from him, not sure how this will ease divisions or help us deliver Brexit. After all, people voted for Brexit, I didn’t, but we should deliver it. This sort of divisive statement is just going to reinforce the Brexiteers’ confidence in their decision to leave.
Donald Tusk is quite right in what he said.
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username1738683
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In real terms, this makes no difference to anything at all. A juicy scrap that will keep the media and guests busy, if there is anything to be drawn from this intemperate choice of language it is that... the spectre of a no-deal scenario is beginning to get to them. It will be forgotten by the end of the week, something else will turn up.

In all this, playing that card and sticking with it could just be the best negotiating tactic to deploy with a reluctant partner, no-deal is as much of a problem to the UK as it is to the EU. The Irish border is a problem on both sides, the veggies we may not get shipped over will be rotting the other side of the Channel. The whole thing is constantly portrayed in public as if the EU are doing the UK a favour by 'allowing' it to leave. By Remainers.
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yudothis
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(Original post by generallee)
The Government and Civil Service has had two whole years to prepare for a possible no deal Brexit. Nothing was done a a deliberate policy.

If we leave without a deal that is on them, (especially Hammond and the Treasury), and the ridicuouls intransigence of the Ireland and the EU over the backstop, not Brexiteers.
"I decided on X, now you go figure it out". Awesome.

And upon close reading of what he said, this is not aimed at Brexiteers, but those hardliners that rather have a no-deal situation than a deal that isn't exactly what they want.

Of course the media being the media and people being well people, this was a daft thing to say.
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Vinny C
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(Original post by DSutch)
Wrong choice of words, but he is right to criticise those Brexiteers who have or had no plan. Though if there is a hell I would have sympathy for those having to share it with Boris Johnson at some point in the future.
Boris Johnson & the ERG... when's the album due out?
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DJKL
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(Original post by zhog)
Bah, how could they possibly have a plan at the stage the question was presented? What plan could that possibly be, the terms of the exit would always have to be thrashed out by the Government and Parliament with the EU. Brexit and Trump have something in common.

Free trade with Europe, doing away with the euro courts, customs union, no more freedom of movement, no more paying into the Union, no Irish border, all that was part of the plan and the details were always going to depend on more than could be promised. Had there been this imaginary explicit 'plan' and it would be so full of holes by now that it would have become another weapon to oppose Brexit. This is a very fatuous argument by Remainers.

I have no opinion on Brexit, by the way.
If you select a pick and mix that is impossible because it tramples underfoot the most basic ideals of the other side do not be surprised if you cannot negotiate a deal on that basis. The above aims are contradictory and there is little that can be done to accomodate them all- something has to give, hence the current issue, anything else is wishful thinking and a complete misunderstanding, or non appreciation ,of how the EU and its Customs Union and Single Market fits together and their red lines.

Our problem is our politicians never did their homework re what, realistically, was possible.
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Libtardian
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If brexiteers are going to hell, I'd like to know where he's going.
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TensorTympani
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(Original post by Sharif92)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-politics-47143135

Quite unhelpful language from him, not sure how this will ease divisions or help us deliver Brexit. After all, people voted for Brexit, I didn’t, but we should deliver it. This sort of divisive statement is just going to reinforce the Brexiteers’ confidence in their decision to leave.
He didn't say that all brexiteers would have a special place in hell, he said those who did not have a plan for brexit and campainged for it would have a special place in hell.
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StriderHort
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(Original post by generallee)
Our EU rulers competent?? Are you for real?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPgiI46FCDU

I don't disagree that our rulers aren't any better, but we can get rid of them in an election. No voters anywhere in Europe can remove clowns like Tusk and Juncker.

THAT is the fundamental difference.
Sadly, Yes, I still feel our lot are worse, certainly got our fair share of rude abrupt drunks, plenty of criminals, a whos who of sexual and social offences and it wasn't that long that a huge group all got caught with the their hands in the till, oh yeah, deporting out own citizens, that too. Oh, and the MP who sped, lied repeatedly and compared herself to Jesus.

T & J might not be elected directly by us, but they broadly anwer the to the European council and can be removed by a Euro Parliament vote of censure/confience, same as ours. And agian, what's so great about us? We've got a rigged 2 party system with 3 tory parties, try voting THEM out :confused:
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Andrew97
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Although you can see he may have a point, this is unhelpful
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by Sharif92)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-politics-47143135

Quite unhelpful language from him, not sure how this will ease divisions or help us deliver Brexit. After all, people voted for Brexit, I didn’t, but we should deliver it. This sort of divisive statement is just going to reinforce the Brexiteers’ confidence in their decision to leave.
Tusk is outspoken and uses colourful language ("place in hell"), but he was completely correct in the meaning of what he said. Hardcore Brexiteers have never clearly explained the consequences of Brexit, nor have they ever put forward credible plans for how Britain and the EU will deal with those consequences. Yet they pressed ahead anyway, full of irrational ideological fervour and contempt for the facts.
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username1738683
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(Original post by DJKL)
If you select a pick and mix that is impossible because it tramples underfoot the most basic ideals of the other side do not be surprised if you cannot negotiate a deal on that basis. The above aims are contradictory and there is little that can be done to accomodate them all- something has to give, hence the current issue, anything else is wishful thinking and a complete misunderstanding, or non appreciation ,of how the EU and its Customs Union and Single Market fits together and their red lines.
Well, the EU will have to go to Ireland and build that hard-border themselves then. Yeah, let them stick to their red-lines on that.
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