Transgender males/females should be made to pay for their NHS treatment?

Original post by BlueIndigoViolet

wouldnt class trans surgeries as solely preventative lol

That wasn't the question, I'm asking about all surgery.

Reply 81

Original post by Decahedron

That wasn't the question, I'm asking about all surgery.

using foresight to judge how all identity politics arguments turn out lol - not all preventative surgery should be ruled out, just a few with not much benefit/without exploiting mental conditions especially trans surgery...

Reply 82

999tigger

Original post by BlueIndigoViolet

says the guy who wants to demonise anything he doesn't agree with as transphobic and ignorant... :colonhash:

Just when they are actually ignorant..

I never mentioned transphobic. Yet another example of you making things up. Truly pathetic.

Reply 83

Original post by 999tigger

Just when they are actually ignorant..

I never mentioned transphobic. Yet another example of you making things up. Truly pathetic.

ah ok, they're ignorant when they don't align themselves with you. yep, seems legit ... :colonhash:

Reply 84

Original post by BlueIndigoViolet

using foresight to judge how all identity politics arguments turn out lol - not all preventative surgery should be ruled out, just a few with not much benefit/without exploiting mental conditions especially trans surgery...

How have you quantified benefit?

I'm not watching anything that comes from the Russian state propaganda channel.

Reply 85

Original post by Decahedron

How have you quantified benefit?

I'm not watching anything that comes from the Russian state propaganda channel.

Lol, yet we have no problem gobbling up British propoganda... perhaps this is more to your liking from the USA - regardless the fact stands no matter how hard it is to accept for trans surgery activists...

Reply 86

999tigger

Original post by BlueIndigoViolet

ah ok, they're ignorant when they don't align themselves with you. yep, seems legit ... :colonhash:

They are ignorant when they have no knowledge of the various conditions associated with transgender and the way medical services are provided.

Reply 87

Original post by 999tigger

They are ignorant when they have no knowledge of the various conditions associated with transgender and the way medical services are provided.

im sorry, I didn't realise i was speaking to a gender reassignment surgeon... my bad...

Reply 88

Original post by BlueIndigoViolet

Lol, yet we have no problem gobbling up British propoganda... perhaps this is more to your liking from the USA - regardless the fact stands no matter how hard it is to accept for trans surgery activists...

Transitioning isn't right for everyone, this is why we have GICs to properly explore all the options.

From a peer reviewed paper. "Only 0.6% of transwomen and 0.3% of transmen who underwent gonadectomy ("bottom surgery") were identified as experiencing regret."

Reply 89

username521617

17

Original post by Decahedron

Transitioning isn't right for everyone, this is why we have GICs to properly explore all the options.

From a peer reviewed paper. "Only 0.6% of transwomen and 0.3% of transmen who underwent gonadectomy ("bottom surgery") were identified as experiencing regret."

I find it a little odd that the authors were conducting this study on the success rate of their own clinic but didn't report that as a conflict of interest.

Anyway, I'm not seeing how many patients they actually kept track of over the years, only how many they treated. That's an issue with a lot of studies like this and the Devil can be in the details - many of the patients 'drop off the radar' over the years and the ones that stick around are more likely to be satisfied, especially the ones who had the surgery recently (regret becomes more likely over time). So it was what, 0.3 - 0.6% of all their patients ever, or of a few hundred people that didn't kill themselves and followed up with the clinic? It doesn't say in the summary.

Reply 90

Original post by Dandaman1

I find it a little odd that the authors were conducting this study on the success rate of their own clinic but didn't report that as a conflict of interest.

Anyway, I'm not seeing how many patients they actually kept track of over the years, only how many they treated. That's an issue with a lot of studies like this and the Devil can be in the details - many of the patients 'drop off the radar' over the years and the ones that stick around are more likely to be satisfied, especially the ones who had the surgery recently (regret becomes more likely over time). So it was what, 0.3 - 0.6% of all their patients ever, or of a few hundred people that didn't kill themselves and followed up with the clinic? It doesn't say in the summary.

I like how you have found every possible way to discredit the peer reviewed paper.

I feel it should be covered - as long as it is absolutely the right thing to do.

I spent 7 years determined I wanted a sex change. Then in 2010 I had some sort of epiphany where I realised that how my outsides look wouldn't change anything and learned to be at peace with what I was born with. I still have issues with gender identity to this day but gender reassignment surgery wouldn't be the answer. Had I had surgery back then I feel I'd regret it now - but had someone told me that at 17 I'd have been offended! So for this reason I think the long wait times and clinics are absolutely necessary - because those who will get funded by the NHS will be unlike me. They'll be the ones who really need it to be strong enough to continue living.

(edited 5 years ago)

Reply 92

Stiff Little Fingers

Original post by BlueIndigoViolet

wouldnt class trans surgeries as solely preventative lol

It's not solely preventative in this case (solely preventative for the type of surgery discussed would be something like an hysterectomy due to high cancer risk), it's also about treatment and improving quality of life for those receiving it. But, it makes sense to treat people with the most effective form of treatment, particularly when depression, anxiety and other mental health disorders are common comorbidities (I'm not going to be sarcastic, we all know why that is) - it's preventative in that it lowers the need of further medical care going forward (particularly when mental health services are incredibly stretched)

Reply 93

jamma blue

9

*****ys are beautiful ppl and be not respected

Reply 94

brb revising

8

This entire arquement on the ‘yes’ side is ridiculous, many people are saying that it’s not ‘life threatening’ so it doesn’t warrant help? A U.S. study showed that more then half of f>m trans teen have attempted suicide. I’d warrant that life-threatening.
Also, insuating that the only valid cause for attention is physical is ridiculous. What about mental health support? Eating disorders, depression, OCD, PTSD etc. These people need support to live their best lives, which they are entitled to. Sure, you may not die if you suffer from anxiety or PTSD, but does that mean they should be left to suffer?
Finally, it’s NOT the same as a nose job! Getting a nose job can boost your self-esteem, which is great BUT having ‘treatment’ or hormones can make you look the way you identify! It means so much to trans people when you finally pass as the gender you identify as.

Reply 95

Whatevenisschool

9

The NHS should only be for procedures that make you well or healthy again

Reply 96

username3434964

Original post by Whatevenisschool

The NHS should only be for procedures that make you well or healthy again

Which this does

Reply 97

Whatevenisschool

9

I realise that

Original post by Bill Nye

Which this does

Reply 98

username3434964

Original post by Whatevenisschool

I realise that

Cool

Reply 99

InArduisFouette