White saviour? Stacey Dooley in row with labour Mp David Lammy Watch

Andrew97
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Tv star Dooley was photgraphed in Africa as part of comic relief. This angered labour mp David Lammy who accused Dooley of perpetuating racial stereotypes.


Dooley responded by asking Lammy to come out with her and see the work Comic Relief do. CR claimed Lammy snubbed an offer from them, something Lammy denies.

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-r...-nose-day-film

What do we think of this. Is Lammy being unhelpful (for somebody who prides himself on being anti-racist, he does seem to enjoy bringing skin colours up)
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999tigger
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(Original post by Andrew97)
Tv star Dooley was photgraphed in Africa as part of comic relief. This angered labour mp David Lammy who accused Dooley of perpetuating racial stereotypes.


Dooley responded by asking Lammy to come out with her and see the work Comic Relief do. CR claimed Lammy snubbed an offer from them, something Lammy denies.

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-r...-nose-day-film

What do we think of this. Is Lammy being unhelpful (for somebody who prides himself on being anti-racist, he does seem to enjoy bringing skin colours up)
Lammy has been offered the opportunity to go out and make a video himself. he has yet to accept.
Comic relief has done more good than he ever will.
Celebs raise awareness.
Would Lammy have done the same if the person had been a black celeb? Im willing to bet no.
Labour should have more important issues to deal with, another reason as to why they are unelectable.
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Notoriety
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It's like at a uni when you have a diversity officer who makes spurious race-related claims and is consistently offended by almost everything.

Yeah, obviously they do that because that's their job -- they are there to mention things which involve race and are not equitable, even if they're tenuous or weak or they'll be criticised by their electorate.

It's a similar thing with Lammy -- who earns his keep and mandate by playing identity politics. I just have to switch off whenever he says something, or I'll get mad.
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Guru Jason
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Why should it matter what colour a person is? If they do something to help then that's all that matters. How can some people not understand this?
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by Andrew97)
Tv star Dooley was photgraphed in Africa as part of comic relief. This angered labour mp David Lammy who accused Dooley of perpetuating racial stereotypes.


Dooley responded by asking Lammy to come out with her and see the work Comic Relief do. CR claimed Lammy snubbed an offer from them, something Lammy denies.

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-r...-nose-day-film

What do we think of this. Is Lammy being unhelpful (for somebody who prides himself on being anti-racist, he does seem to enjoy bringing skin colours up)
He isn't wrong though that the charity sector have continued to spread a particular view of Africa (starving children and desperate women) that does well for donations but isn't in any way representative of the continent as a whole. In fact, many African countries have made considerable progress in improving living standards and dealing with poverty. That's a story we don't get exposed to but we are constantly assailed by the negative imagery.

On the white/black thing, it's also been true in the past that the classic charity posture was the white man/woman holding little black babies and weeping. There was a hidden suggestion there that all the Africans need is white do-gooding and they will be fine. They in fact do need more generosity from us, but it's to do with the terms of trade. The EU have fierce protectionist barriers against African goods, which makes it hard for them to export to us. The UK may or may not drop these on leaving, but the UK also has a long history of blocking African exports, so perhaps nothing will change.

For students on gap years, white voluntourism also often has very negative effects.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/pippa...b_4834574.html
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Notoriety
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
He isn't wrong though that the charity sector have continued to spread a particular view of Africa (starving children and desperate women) that does well for donations but isn't in any way representative of the continent as a whole. In fact, many African countries have made considerable progress in improving living standards and dealing with poverty. That's a story we don't get exposed to but we are constantly assailed by the negative imagery.

On the white/black thing, it's also been true in the past that the classic charity posture was the white man/woman holding little black babies and weeping. There was a hidden suggestion there that all the Africans need is white do-gooding and they will be fine. They in fact do need more generosity from us, but it's to do with the terms of trade. The EU have fierce protectionist barriers against African goods, which makes it hard for them to export to us. The UK may or may not drop these on leaving, but the UK also has a long history of blocking African exports, so perhaps nothing will change.

For students on gap years, white voluntourism also often has very negative effects.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/pippa...b_4834574.html
Shoulda known you'd support his BS.
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by Notoriety)
Shoulda known you'd support his BS.
And your thoughts on what I actually said? Or was that it? :rolleyes:
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Notoriety
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
And your thoughts on what I actually said? Or was that it? :rolleyes:
I get mad, so I have to close my eyes.

I am interested to know about the protectionist barriers. What sectors are those? Because under the WTO there's obviously various exceptions designed to encourage favoured trade with the least developed nations. (Note in some articles people are even miffed by this, as it reinforces an inferior view of the least developed nations -- damned if you help and damned if you don't.).
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jameswhughes
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Red Nose Day is incredibly racist, why isn’t it black nose day?
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by Notoriety)
I get mad, so I have to close my eyes.

I am interested to know about the protectionist barriers. What sectors are those? Because under the WTO there's obviously various exceptions designed to encourage favoured trade with the least developed nations. (Note in some articles people are even miffed by this, as it reinforces an inferior view of the least developed nations -- damned if you help and damned if you don't.).
It's true that the picture is better now than it was (not least due to extensive public pressure), but the LDC rules exclude Africa's three biggest economies - Nigeria, RSA and Kenya - and the tariffs by an amazing coincidence still bear down heaviest on the food produce of Africa, which is generally their most profitable output after mineral extraction.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-45342607
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chazwomaq
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
There was a hidden suggestion there that all the Africans need is white do-gooding and they will be fine.
I agree with all your comment except this. When I watch a comic relief VT with a white presenter I don't make that assumption, and I'm skeptical that many do.

It's perfectly normal for a British program to be made with a British presenter, many of whom will be white. To say otherwise is racist - "sorry, only black people can travel to Africa and film, only Asians can film in India etc. etc." That sounds more Stormfront than progressive.
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Underscore__
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What a complete and utter tool
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Notoriety
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
It's true that the picture is better now than it was (not least due to extensive public pressure), but the LDC rules exclude Africa's three biggest economies - Nigeria, RSA and Kenya - and the tariffs by an amazing coincidence still bear down heaviest on the food produce of Africa, which is generally their most profitable output after mineral extraction.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-45342607
Yeah, agri is a sensitive market. One of the last things countries are protectionist about. It is not a direct attack on African countries; it's just that agri products happen to be the African countries' stronger exports. But there are legit real academics who criticise more favourable treatment of the LDCs because it is a sign of Western superiority, coming in to save the day. I think it's an unhelpful mentality to have -- you really have to look at the practical realities of turning down favoured treatment over the myopic pride of rejecting it.

I think that a white country tends to have white celebrities; if you're trying to get people to donate through celeb sensationalism, you are gonna get some whities in the mix. Sure, there could be more eduction about the strength of some of the larger economies -- but the raw mechanics of what happened make perfect sense. Unless you reject the celeb sensationalist method of fundraising, but then how much monies would be donated each year.
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YaliaV
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(Original post by Notoriety)
Shoulda known you'd support his BS.
Indeed.

Why is Stacey being targeted when white people have been helping Africans for many years? Was Lenny Henry more acceptable as a black man? I don’t know his history, but I doubt he has ever experienced true poverty - why is it any different? Is it not acceptable for white people to help Africans now? Should they just stop?
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Underscore__
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(Original post by YaliaV)
Indeed.

Why is Stacey being targeted when white people have been helping Africans for many years? Was Lenny Henry more acceptable as a black man? I don’t know his history, but I doubt he has ever experienced true poverty - why is it any different? Is it not acceptable for white people to help Africans now? Should they just stop?
I wonder how Mr Lammy would feel if this majority white country, as well all of the other mostly white countries, cut foreign aid to Africa. I bet he wouldn’t be praising us for giving up the white saviour complex then.
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YaliaV
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(Original post by Underscore__)
I wonder how Mr Lammy would feel if this majority white country, as well all of the other mostly white countries, cut foreign aid to Africa. I bet he wouldn’t be praising us for giving up the white saviour complex then.
Lammy may also be black, but what poverty has he experienced and what right does he have to judge people who are trying to help? He doesn’t look like he has ever missed a meal. He’s being racist by lumping all white people together, when he has nothing remotely in common with starving people in Africa just because he is black.
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Decahedron
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Raising awareness is complete bull**** at this point. Everyone is aware of the poverty on the African continent.

I would much rather hear from the actual people in poverty and the actual people helping them not another celeb doing their 10 minute segment on how important it is for us to give our money while they live in their mansions.
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by Decahedron)
I would much rather hear from the actual people in poverty and the actual people helping them not another celeb doing their 10 minute segment on how important it is for us to give our money while they live in their mansions.
Exactly. What we don't get are the African voices, we just hear from European missionary interpreters, whose services are no longer required.
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999tigger
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(Original post by Decahedron)
Raising awareness is complete bull**** at this point. Everyone is aware of the poverty on the African continent.

I would much rather hear from the actual people in poverty and the actual people helping them not another celeb doing their 10 minute segment on how important it is for us to give our money while they live in their mansions.
No it isnt because plenty of people dont understand the situation over there, because they are in a UK bubble.
You do get to hear from the actual people and the people helping them.
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
He isn't wrong though that the charity sector have continued to spread a particular view of Africa (starving children and desperate women) that does well for donations but isn't in any way representative of the continent as a whole. In fact, many African countries have made considerable progress in improving living standards and dealing with poverty. That's a story we don't get exposed to but we are constantly assailed by the negative imagery.

On the white/black thing, it's also been true in the past that the classic charity posture was the white man/woman holding little black babies and weeping. There was a hidden suggestion there that all the Africans need is white do-gooding and they will be fine. They in fact do need more generosity from us, but it's to do with the terms of trade. The EU have fierce protectionist barriers against African goods, which makes it hard for them to export to us. The UK may or may not drop these on leaving, but the UK also has a long history of blocking African exports, so perhaps nothing will change.

For students on gap years, white voluntourism also often has very negative effects.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/pippa...b_4834574.html
What’s the issue with focussing only on the negatives to increase donations? You’ve said that it isn’t “representative” of Africa but you haven’t said what the problem with that is. And are your reasons important enough to cause a decrease in donations?
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