The 'actual' cheapest laptop complete with pen
FORENOTE: This isn't an advertisement for the thinkpad. I just thought other people should know about this as it took me a long time to find something like this
The x200T, x201T, x220T and x230T thinkpads are from what i've found the cheapest laptop computers complete with a pen and touchscreen interface, that are still a viable alternative for students who no longer want to take just paper notes alone without breaking the bank.
Don't get me wrong there are a few caveats and i'm not comparing these models to something like a modern surface device or an ipad pro. The main point of this thread is the price.
The Microsoft surface go (there new budget model) clocks in at around £475. Which is expensive, it's half my rent for this term.
A brand new ipad pro will set you back a whopping £770 (as of 04/03/2019) and if you want a pen thats an additional £60. Sounds fun.
So why even consider one of these as a student?
Look at that clunky boi. Why is it worth it? It looks like it was built in the 90s. I'll explain...
Price
Obviously these things aren't in general retail anymore but originally they cost around £2000 and where top of there class for 2008 > 2012. You can get an x200T from ebay for well under £100 and an x230T for probably under £200 which comes with an i5/i7 processor that can match intel i3 processors of this generation and the ability to upgrade to 8gb or even 16GB of RAM.
Versatile
You can use it for note taking in lectures and as a general laptop. The pen is one of the first to have pressure sensitivity and an eraser on the back so it works with most art programs and it feels great to write with. 4GB of ram is about enough for most multitasking and it supports DDR3 RAM which is still pretty quick. Palm rejection isn't an issue because it doesn't register your palms anyway, it only registers the pen and surprisingly there is almost no lag between the pen and the screen.
Almost unbreakable
These kinds of laptops are absolutely indestructible. The case, keyboard, components and screen are solid. You could run over it in a Honda civic and it would still be fine. (p.s. don't quote me on that). If something does break you can replace it really easily. The HDD, RAM, battery are all interchangeable and you can (if you want) swap the entire motherboard between models of the X200T series and they should still fit. Not to mention you could break 4 of these and still probably have spent less than on a surface pro laptop.
So an overall list of all the positives an negatives...
Positives
- Very cheap (for what it provides)
- Pen interaction is great. Almost on par with the surface and you can store the pen in the laptop.
- The keyboard is one of the best keyboards ever produced for a laptop, it's tactile and has a lot of travel.
- Almost unbreakable.
- Parts can be easily replaced and cost next to nothing to buy
- Once upgraded should perform as well as a cheap tablet or chromebook if not better.
- Battery life (stated by lenovo) lasts a solid 10 to 14 hours.
- The 220T and 230T models also boast a good quality display for the price. On par with modern chromebooks.
Downsides
- It's clunky and relatively heavy
- The hard drive is slow (you will need to upgrade to an SSD)
- Used model battery life may be significantly less than a new battery
- This isn't a gaming computer. Any program requiring a lot of use from a GPU will flop. The GPU is an original intel HD integrated graphics chip.
- Rotating the screen to go into tablet mode is a bit over complicated.
- Audio quality is well, bad. Grab a pair of headphones
- Old hardware. Depending on how it's been stored could lead to problems.
If after all of that your not dissuaded then this might actually be quite a good alternative.
Heres what I would reccomend: (After a lot of time in the comments debating on whats best)
- For all models grab a brand new SSD (128GB or 256GB model, they are easily installed by removing a single skrew with a standard phillip head skrewdriver
- Same goes for the RAM. If your system come swith 2GB of RAM upgrade it immediately. (Again really simple, 4 skrews on the back. This should take 5 minutes max).
x200T (< £100) (2008)
This will only run well on a FOSS based system such as linux (the friendly penguin). The simplest approach is to install Ubuntu which works straight out of the box and also happens to be free. This dosen't come with a trackpad (only a trackpoint) and only upgrades to 4GB. For a FOSS system it works brilliantly though.
x201T (>£100 but <£200)
Faster than the x200T and this shows as it originally came with windows 7 and is easily upgradeable to windows 10 Early generation intel i7 options are available. Everything else is relatively the same as the x200T
x220T / 230T (< £200 [if your lucky]) (2011/2012) [Reccomended model]
Will comfortably run windows 10, comes with a trackpad, has a brilliant battery life if you get a new battery, will come with a HDMI port included, has support for a USB 3.0 port and could include extra features such as a fingerprint sensor (although it's kind of a fad). Also comes with a decent resolution screen for the time period. Overall i'd reccomend getting a model with a warranty that refurbished if you can although if your tech savvy you should be fine buying a used one.
p.s. if there are any questions please feel free to contact me. Thanks.
p.s.s if you are looking to buy one of these systems based on the reccomendation but need more information please contact me and I will be willing to help.
Buying used parts off ebay (especially batteries) can be risky and I would reccomend only buying the actual computer off ebay and the addiitonal parts such as the SSD from a more trusted seller such as Amazon, Crucial or Ebuyer to name a few at random.
The x200T, x201T, x220T and x230T thinkpads are from what i've found the cheapest laptop computers complete with a pen and touchscreen interface, that are still a viable alternative for students who no longer want to take just paper notes alone without breaking the bank.
Don't get me wrong there are a few caveats and i'm not comparing these models to something like a modern surface device or an ipad pro. The main point of this thread is the price.
The Microsoft surface go (there new budget model) clocks in at around £475. Which is expensive, it's half my rent for this term.
A brand new ipad pro will set you back a whopping £770 (as of 04/03/2019) and if you want a pen thats an additional £60. Sounds fun.
So why even consider one of these as a student?
Look at that clunky boi. Why is it worth it? It looks like it was built in the 90s. I'll explain...
Price
Obviously these things aren't in general retail anymore but originally they cost around £2000 and where top of there class for 2008 > 2012. You can get an x200T from ebay for well under £100 and an x230T for probably under £200 which comes with an i5/i7 processor that can match intel i3 processors of this generation and the ability to upgrade to 8gb or even 16GB of RAM.
Versatile
You can use it for note taking in lectures and as a general laptop. The pen is one of the first to have pressure sensitivity and an eraser on the back so it works with most art programs and it feels great to write with. 4GB of ram is about enough for most multitasking and it supports DDR3 RAM which is still pretty quick. Palm rejection isn't an issue because it doesn't register your palms anyway, it only registers the pen and surprisingly there is almost no lag between the pen and the screen.
Almost unbreakable
These kinds of laptops are absolutely indestructible. The case, keyboard, components and screen are solid. You could run over it in a Honda civic and it would still be fine. (p.s. don't quote me on that). If something does break you can replace it really easily. The HDD, RAM, battery are all interchangeable and you can (if you want) swap the entire motherboard between models of the X200T series and they should still fit. Not to mention you could break 4 of these and still probably have spent less than on a surface pro laptop.
So an overall list of all the positives an negatives...
Positives
- Very cheap (for what it provides)
- Pen interaction is great. Almost on par with the surface and you can store the pen in the laptop.
- The keyboard is one of the best keyboards ever produced for a laptop, it's tactile and has a lot of travel.
- Almost unbreakable.
- Parts can be easily replaced and cost next to nothing to buy
- Once upgraded should perform as well as a cheap tablet or chromebook if not better.
- Battery life (stated by lenovo) lasts a solid 10 to 14 hours.
- The 220T and 230T models also boast a good quality display for the price. On par with modern chromebooks.
Downsides
- It's clunky and relatively heavy
- The hard drive is slow (you will need to upgrade to an SSD)
- Used model battery life may be significantly less than a new battery
- This isn't a gaming computer. Any program requiring a lot of use from a GPU will flop. The GPU is an original intel HD integrated graphics chip.
- Rotating the screen to go into tablet mode is a bit over complicated.
- Audio quality is well, bad. Grab a pair of headphones
- Old hardware. Depending on how it's been stored could lead to problems.
If after all of that your not dissuaded then this might actually be quite a good alternative.
Heres what I would reccomend: (After a lot of time in the comments debating on whats best)
- For all models grab a brand new SSD (128GB or 256GB model, they are easily installed by removing a single skrew with a standard phillip head skrewdriver
- Same goes for the RAM. If your system come swith 2GB of RAM upgrade it immediately. (Again really simple, 4 skrews on the back. This should take 5 minutes max).
x200T (< £100) (2008)
This will only run well on a FOSS based system such as linux (the friendly penguin). The simplest approach is to install Ubuntu which works straight out of the box and also happens to be free. This dosen't come with a trackpad (only a trackpoint) and only upgrades to 4GB. For a FOSS system it works brilliantly though.
x201T (>£100 but <£200)
Faster than the x200T and this shows as it originally came with windows 7 and is easily upgradeable to windows 10 Early generation intel i7 options are available. Everything else is relatively the same as the x200T
x220T / 230T (< £200 [if your lucky]) (2011/2012) [Reccomended model]
Will comfortably run windows 10, comes with a trackpad, has a brilliant battery life if you get a new battery, will come with a HDMI port included, has support for a USB 3.0 port and could include extra features such as a fingerprint sensor (although it's kind of a fad). Also comes with a decent resolution screen for the time period. Overall i'd reccomend getting a model with a warranty that refurbished if you can although if your tech savvy you should be fine buying a used one.
p.s. if there are any questions please feel free to contact me. Thanks.
p.s.s if you are looking to buy one of these systems based on the reccomendation but need more information please contact me and I will be willing to help.
Buying used parts off ebay (especially batteries) can be risky and I would reccomend only buying the actual computer off ebay and the addiitonal parts such as the SSD from a more trusted seller such as Amazon, Crucial or Ebuyer to name a few at random.
(edited 5 years ago)
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Personally I bought a Cube Mix Plus, which was new for £240 including the keyboard and pen. The best part is that it was slim, maybe even slimmer than a surface pro. The screen is the same as the Surface Pro, and it includes a low-power 7th gen intel processor. Seemed like the best compromise to me.
Original post by znedd1
Personally I bought a Cube Mix Plus, which was new for £240 including the keyboard and pen. The best part is that it was slim, maybe even slimmer than a surface pro. The screen is the same as the Surface Pro, and it includes a low-power 7th gen intel processor. Seemed like the best compromise to me.
I mean if your up for something that's really light, a little more updated and has a better battery life it's not a bad option actually.
I would say though that although older processors lack some capabilities, 3D rendering is bad for example but an i5 or i7 from either of these laptops/tablets can match or exceed that. I guess the idea of the thinkpad is for someone who wants something that will last forever.
I think the main issue with these things is they go like hotcakes. I saw a batch of 100 go in a few hours on ebay so it's difficult to find one and some come in pretty bad condition if your not careful.
(edited 5 years ago)
Original post by profjb
FORENOTE: This isn't an advertisement for the thinkpad. I just thought other people should know about this as it took me a long time to figure it out.
So, your sick of lugging around notes, you want a brand new shiny surface laptop or an equivalent ipad pro to jot your work down.
In theory that sounds great but even the Microsoft surface go (there new budget model) clocks in at around £475. Which is expensive, it's half my rent for this term.
The other option...
Buy an old thinkpad tablet.
Look at that clunky boi. Why is it worth it? It looks like it was built in the 90s. I'll explain
Price
Obviously these things aren't in general retail anymore but originally they cost around £2000 and where top of there class for 2008. You can get an x200T from ebay for well under £100 and an x230T for probably under £150 which comes with an i5/i7 processor that can match intel i3 processors of this generation.
Versatile
You can use it for note taking in lectures and as a general laptop. The pen is one of the first to have pressure sensitivity and an eraser on the back so it works with most art programs. 4GB of ram is more than enough for most multitasking and it supports DDR3 which is still pretty quick. Palm rejection isn't an issue because it doesn't register your palms anyway, it only registers the pen and surprisingly there is almost no lag between the pen and the screen.
Almost unbreakable
These kinds of laptops are absolutely indestructible. The case, keyboard, components and screen are solid. You could run over it in a Honda civic and it would still be fine. (p.s. don't quote me on that). If something does break you can replace it really easily. The HDD, RAM, battery are all interchangeable and you can (if you want) swap the entire motherboard between models of the X200T series and they should still fit. Not to mention you could break 4 of these and still probably have spent less than on a surface pro laptop.
Downsides
- It's clunky (although not particularly heavy)
- The hard drive is incredibly slow (you will need to upgrade to an SSD)
- Battery life is mediocre.
- Most models only support 4GB of RAM as a maximum
- This isn't a gaming computer. Any program requiring a lot of use from a GPU will flop. The GPU is an original intel HD integrated graphics chip.
- Some models only come with the trackpoint and no trackpad
- Rotating the screen to go into tablet mode is a bit over complicated.
From my personal experience I recently sold my surface pro and bought one of these x200 models making back about £350. It only has a pentium intel processor but the main bottleneck was the hard drive so I swapped it out for an SSD and 4GB of ram and i've been happy with it since.
p.s. if there are any questions please feel free to contact me. Thanks.
So, your sick of lugging around notes, you want a brand new shiny surface laptop or an equivalent ipad pro to jot your work down.
In theory that sounds great but even the Microsoft surface go (there new budget model) clocks in at around £475. Which is expensive, it's half my rent for this term.
The other option...
Buy an old thinkpad tablet.
Look at that clunky boi. Why is it worth it? It looks like it was built in the 90s. I'll explain
Price
Obviously these things aren't in general retail anymore but originally they cost around £2000 and where top of there class for 2008. You can get an x200T from ebay for well under £100 and an x230T for probably under £150 which comes with an i5/i7 processor that can match intel i3 processors of this generation.
Versatile
You can use it for note taking in lectures and as a general laptop. The pen is one of the first to have pressure sensitivity and an eraser on the back so it works with most art programs. 4GB of ram is more than enough for most multitasking and it supports DDR3 which is still pretty quick. Palm rejection isn't an issue because it doesn't register your palms anyway, it only registers the pen and surprisingly there is almost no lag between the pen and the screen.
Almost unbreakable
These kinds of laptops are absolutely indestructible. The case, keyboard, components and screen are solid. You could run over it in a Honda civic and it would still be fine. (p.s. don't quote me on that). If something does break you can replace it really easily. The HDD, RAM, battery are all interchangeable and you can (if you want) swap the entire motherboard between models of the X200T series and they should still fit. Not to mention you could break 4 of these and still probably have spent less than on a surface pro laptop.
Downsides
- It's clunky (although not particularly heavy)
- The hard drive is incredibly slow (you will need to upgrade to an SSD)
- Battery life is mediocre.
- Most models only support 4GB of RAM as a maximum
- This isn't a gaming computer. Any program requiring a lot of use from a GPU will flop. The GPU is an original intel HD integrated graphics chip.
- Some models only come with the trackpoint and no trackpad
- Rotating the screen to go into tablet mode is a bit over complicated.
From my personal experience I recently sold my surface pro and bought one of these x200 models making back about £350. It only has a pentium intel processor but the main bottleneck was the hard drive so I swapped it out for an SSD and 4GB of ram and i've been happy with it since.
p.s. if there are any questions please feel free to contact me. Thanks.
Right, because every student wants to carry around a heavy Windows XP machine that will have a knackered battery, and isn't compatible with a lot of the latest software.
Original post by jameswhughes
Right, because every student wants to carry around a heavy Windows XP machine that will have a knackered battery, and isn't compatible with a lot of the latest software.
Drivers are still updated for it for windows 10. I'm running it now alongside ubuntu. It actually originally shipped with vista not xp as well and it will work with pretty much any current program working on windows 10. People update everything for these machines simply because they never die.
The battery life is about 5 to 6 hours in reality for a used battery but lenovo claims it can last 10 hours for a new battery which too be honest is on par with a surface pro which can make about 12 hours. Not to mention a new battery costs around £20. Oh and you can actually replace the battery easily.
It's actually not as heavy as you would think as well. It's technically lighter than a lot of modern laptops. Obviously it's a bit fat but the screen isn't bad either for the time.
p.s. Please keep chucking problems at me. I don't want to be deceiving people about this. I do genuinely still think it's worth it for the price though.
(edited 5 years ago)
I have heard the same opinion so many times from so many different threads and online posts but I guess I wanted to make a counter option for everyone who is sick of those kind of recommendations.
After all I have given a very good comparison of everything to do with this system and I think for a lot of people (alongside a computer) it would work incredibly well and I would still recommend it.
I disagree written notes are better for all students. Especially those who take course such as computer science, electronics and other engineering/science courses who have a lot of contact hours with very little time to sort out notes. You can also write on pdfs and retrieve notes easily which is a game changer.
I also completely disagree with your opinions on what is considered reasonable for a budget laptop in 2018 and it's interesting because I sent a message to you before you made the post which shows we both have a different perspective on this.
I do still think 4gb is more than enough for your 'average' user even in 2018 and the idea of having extra RAM handy seems kind of pointless if your never exceeding this, especially with the addition of SWAP partitions.
Buying a used laptop isn't as risky for this model as you might think if you know what your doing or are willing to learn how to repair a laptop. Just like learning how to cook or iron I think learning how to repair a computer is so vital if your on a tight budget. I would be more wary or newer computers that are often more fragile and who's components can't be easily replaced. For example I owned a Thinkpad S1 befor e my surface pro which was built to break, the screws became cross threaded at the back making it nearly impossible to switch out the system for a new hard drive and a clean out which it desperately needed. I ended up breaking the laptop trying to get into the back.
I do get the screen issues and I guess the audio isn't going to be great either but if your paying £110 for a laptop what do you expect.
I should probably also recommend that you use this alongside something else. Because I own a pc as well I am slightly bias and the ability to not play basic video games would annoy me so I do get that. I'll make a few edits on my post but I still stand by what I say.
After all I have given a very good comparison of everything to do with this system and I think for a lot of people (alongside a computer) it would work incredibly well and I would still recommend it.
I disagree written notes are better for all students. Especially those who take course such as computer science, electronics and other engineering/science courses who have a lot of contact hours with very little time to sort out notes. You can also write on pdfs and retrieve notes easily which is a game changer.
I also completely disagree with your opinions on what is considered reasonable for a budget laptop in 2018 and it's interesting because I sent a message to you before you made the post which shows we both have a different perspective on this.
I do still think 4gb is more than enough for your 'average' user even in 2018 and the idea of having extra RAM handy seems kind of pointless if your never exceeding this, especially with the addition of SWAP partitions.
Buying a used laptop isn't as risky for this model as you might think if you know what your doing or are willing to learn how to repair a laptop. Just like learning how to cook or iron I think learning how to repair a computer is so vital if your on a tight budget. I would be more wary or newer computers that are often more fragile and who's components can't be easily replaced. For example I owned a Thinkpad S1 befor e my surface pro which was built to break, the screws became cross threaded at the back making it nearly impossible to switch out the system for a new hard drive and a clean out which it desperately needed. I ended up breaking the laptop trying to get into the back.
I do get the screen issues and I guess the audio isn't going to be great either but if your paying £110 for a laptop what do you expect.
I should probably also recommend that you use this alongside something else. Because I own a pc as well I am slightly bias and the ability to not play basic video games would annoy me so I do get that. I'll make a few edits on my post but I still stand by what I say.
(edited 5 years ago)
Original post by profjb
Drivers are still updated for it for windows 10. I'm running it now alongside ubuntu. It actually originally shipped with vista not xp as well and it will work with pretty much any current program working on windows 10. People update everything for these machines simply because they never die.
The battery life is about 5 to 6 hours in reality for a used battery but lenovo claims it can last 10 hours for a new battery which too be honest is on par with a surface pro which can make about 12 hours. Not to mention a new battery costs around £20. Oh and you can actually replace the battery easily.
It's actually not as heavy as you would think as well. It's technically lighter than a lot of modern laptops. Obviously it's a bit fat but the screen isn't bad either for the time.
p.s. Please keep chucking problems at me. I don't want to be deceiving people about this. I do genuinely still think it's worth it for the price though.
The battery life is about 5 to 6 hours in reality for a used battery but lenovo claims it can last 10 hours for a new battery which too be honest is on par with a surface pro which can make about 12 hours. Not to mention a new battery costs around £20. Oh and you can actually replace the battery easily.
It's actually not as heavy as you would think as well. It's technically lighter than a lot of modern laptops. Obviously it's a bit fat but the screen isn't bad either for the time.
p.s. Please keep chucking problems at me. I don't want to be deceiving people about this. I do genuinely still think it's worth it for the price though.
It's still a poor investment. If you can get it to work, then great, but most people want something that does everything straight out the box without spending the day installing drivers or whatever. I'd strongly recommend against spending £300 on a 10+ year old laptop when you can get a reasonable brand new one for £500.
What if you want to use a webcam or connect to an external display/television over HDMI? These features are standard on laptops these days, and it's annoying not to have them.
Original post by jameswhughes
It's still a poor investment. If you can get it to work, then great, but most people want something that does everything straight out the box without spending the day installing drivers or whatever. I'd strongly recommend against spending £300 on a 10+ year old laptop when you can get a reasonable brand new one for £500.
What if you want to use a webcam or connect to an external display/television over HDMI? These features are standard on laptops these days, and it's annoying not to have them.
What if you want to use a webcam or connect to an external display/television over HDMI? These features are standard on laptops these days, and it's annoying not to have them.
You wont be spending anywhere near £300 pounds. That's kind of the point of this entire thread really. If you want to spend that much buy a new laptop. It took me 5 minutes to get all the drivers needed for windows 10 and ubuntu works straight out of the box.
Not having a HDMI port is an issue. The x230 models I think do actually include a HDMI port though and a vga to hdmi adapter works. Too be honest I just use an old DELL VGA monitor and you can still get a VGA to HMDI adapter.
Original post by swelshie
Also screens are going to be pretty yellow by now
I'm confused. Yellow? The colour from the screen shouldn't deteriorate.
Original post by swelshie
How are those processors matching current gen i3s? I'm seeing similar benches to AMD A10 i.e. very outdated would struggle with some basic tasks nowadays.
I'm a bit confused really. If your seeing similar benches to an AMD A10 then that's pretty acceptable for the price. I installed an equivalent AMD A series in an old motherboard for a SATA2 gaming pc and it runs smooth as silk. I'm able to play modern games such as farcry 4 and battlefield 1 on 60fps. The bottleneck is normally the GPU in this case and it's able to run intensive applications such as MATLAB faster than the school pcs
Original post by profjb
You wont be spending anywhere near £300 pounds. That's kind of the point of this entire thread really. If you want to spend that much buy a new laptop. It took me 5 minutes to get all the drivers needed for windows 10 and ubuntu works straight out of the box.
Not having a HDMI port is an issue. The x230 models I think do actually include a HDMI port though and a vga to hdmi adapter works. Too be honest I just use an old DELL VGA monitor and you can still get a VGA to HMDI adapter.
Not having a HDMI port is an issue. The x230 models I think do actually include a HDMI port though and a vga to hdmi adapter works. Too be honest I just use an old DELL VGA monitor and you can still get a VGA to HMDI adapter.
You get what you pay for. Sure, I can find laptops on eBay for £20 or in electrical waste sites for free, some will work, some won't. It's a bit of a false economy to spend so little on a laptop then have a high chance of encountering major problems which will cost time and money to deal with.
Most students just want something that's lightweight, fast, with decent battery life and that works straight out of the box so they can get on with things. If I've got coursework to do, I don't want to be looking around on eBay trying to track down a suitable battery or power adaptor for a laptop that went out of production 10 years ago.
It is kind of a shame that there are so many negatives being thrown at this although I do fully understand most of the concerns. I think it kind of takes a bit of experience owning one to understand why people even buy these in the first place but then that's kind of the purpose of a review. To stop people buying something before it's too late.
From my perspective a lot of people have the same opinion as yourself but rarely do I see a person using a laptop and a set of notes. This might just be a phenomenon for my course but in most of the lectures I've typically found people prefer a tablet or written notes alone in lectures at least. Outside it's a different ball game. I'd say about 12 out of 40 use a surface pro or ipad pro from a rough estimate mainly from memory which makes sense as I think most people prefer paper however there is still a market for this kind of laptop and if more people realized the benefits they would buy one and saying that buying a pc alongside it is a fail isn't really a decent statement either. This arrangement is so cheap that buying a second computer or laptop becomes a viable option and in this new laptop you could save well a lot instead of buying a touchscreen behemoth with the i5 processor you stated is almost apparently a baseline. Alongside this is your really struggling to afford a decent laptop then this or an equivalent non-touchscreen model is a really, really good option for a lot of people.
Finally. The opinion that comp science students would prefer pen and paper over this is valid for the sake that they want to get away from a screen but as I stated above I can't really see applying to most lecture halls and don't forget this is still a laptop. If you want to take written notes, go for it. The equivalent non-touchscreen model is almost the same price and does exactly the same.
I have updated my post to include alot of what your mentioning and it's really helpful actually, it's helping me make the post more rounded.
From my perspective a lot of people have the same opinion as yourself but rarely do I see a person using a laptop and a set of notes. This might just be a phenomenon for my course but in most of the lectures I've typically found people prefer a tablet or written notes alone in lectures at least. Outside it's a different ball game. I'd say about 12 out of 40 use a surface pro or ipad pro from a rough estimate mainly from memory which makes sense as I think most people prefer paper however there is still a market for this kind of laptop and if more people realized the benefits they would buy one and saying that buying a pc alongside it is a fail isn't really a decent statement either. This arrangement is so cheap that buying a second computer or laptop becomes a viable option and in this new laptop you could save well a lot instead of buying a touchscreen behemoth with the i5 processor you stated is almost apparently a baseline. Alongside this is your really struggling to afford a decent laptop then this or an equivalent non-touchscreen model is a really, really good option for a lot of people.
Finally. The opinion that comp science students would prefer pen and paper over this is valid for the sake that they want to get away from a screen but as I stated above I can't really see applying to most lecture halls and don't forget this is still a laptop. If you want to take written notes, go for it. The equivalent non-touchscreen model is almost the same price and does exactly the same.
I have updated my post to include alot of what your mentioning and it's really helpful actually, it's helping me make the post more rounded.
(edited 5 years ago)
Original post by jameswhughes
You get what you pay for. Sure, I can find laptops on eBay for £20 or in electrical waste sites for free, some will work, some won't. It's a bit of a false economy to spend so little on a laptop then have a high chance of encountering major problems which will cost time and money to deal with.
Most students just want something that's lightweight, fast, with decent battery life and that works straight out of the box so they can get on with things. If I've got coursework to do, I don't want to be looking around on eBay trying to track down a suitable battery or power adaptor for a laptop that went out of production 10 years ago.
Most students just want something that's lightweight, fast, with decent battery life and that works straight out of the box so they can get on with things. If I've got coursework to do, I don't want to be looking around on eBay trying to track down a suitable battery or power adaptor for a laptop that went out of production 10 years ago.
I think honestly it's worse buying a new laptop that you can't swap out components for but this is just my opinion. I understand we are considered the use and throw away generation but unlike a phone where you know that if it breaks you will need a professional to fix it you can save yourself a lot of money by just fixing the system yourself and this particular model is probably the easiest and most versatile laptop of that era. Although this is a Lenovo and not an IBM model they used to use these on the space station and it shows. They run brilliantly. I have been through so many laptops that would be considered great, DELL laptops, Fujitsus and I got sick of not being able to clean out the dust filter or swap a hard drive, replace RAM which eventually led to hardware failures for all of them except the surface pro. Thinkpads as I said are indestructible. Especially the older models.
(edited 5 years ago)
Original post by profjb
I'm confused. Yellow? The colour from the screen shouldn't deteriorate.
After years of continuous use most phone/laptop/tv screens will be burnt out and whites will be distinctly yellow. (laptops are usually thrown in the bin long before then!) on right is a 10+ year old laptop vs couple years old. I'm surprised it still runs tbh. Wouldn't want to risk important work being lost on a decade old machine.
Original post by profjb
I'm a bit confused really. If your seeing similar benches to an AMD A10 then that's pretty acceptable for the price. I installed an equivalent AMD A series in an old motherboard for a SATA2 gaming pc and it runs smooth as silk. I'm able to play modern games such as farcry 4 and battlefield 1 on 60fps. The bottleneck is normally the GPU in this case and it's able to run intensive applications such as MATLAB faster than the school pcs
??? I'm starting to think you are trolling. What kind of educational establishment do you go to that has worse desktops than that- matlab is an example of an application you would NOT want to be running on this sort of hardware.
That is interesting actually. I wasn't aware that happens. I mean the model I bought might be an exception but i'd assume you would ask for how long the laptop has been used before buying. A lot of the time these laptops are shelved or refurbished. It just depends on the model.
and no i'm not trolling, I don't really know why you would think I would be. Obviously the computers we use in labs run the latest hardware but computers in the library or in other rooms that haven't been updated as much (which I use for most of the time) run on equivalent specs and I never really ran into issues with MATLAB on that processor but it depends on what task your running. Ultimately though I have to agree that you probably want to spend more on a gaming PC. That's just what I spent.
and no i'm not trolling, I don't really know why you would think I would be. Obviously the computers we use in labs run the latest hardware but computers in the library or in other rooms that haven't been updated as much (which I use for most of the time) run on equivalent specs and I never really ran into issues with MATLAB on that processor but it depends on what task your running. Ultimately though I have to agree that you probably want to spend more on a gaming PC. That's just what I spent.
Original post by swelshie
After years of continuous use most phone/laptop/tv screens will be burnt out and whites will be distinctly yellow. (laptops are usually thrown in the bin long before then!) on right is a 10+ year old laptop vs couple years old. I'm surprised it still runs tbh. Wouldn't want to risk important work being lost on a decade old machine.
??? I'm starting to think you are trolling. What kind of educational establishment do you go to that has worse desktops than that- matlab is an example of an application you would NOT want to be running on this sort of hardware.
After years of continuous use most phone/laptop/tv screens will be burnt out and whites will be distinctly yellow. (laptops are usually thrown in the bin long before then!) on right is a 10+ year old laptop vs couple years old. I'm surprised it still runs tbh. Wouldn't want to risk important work being lost on a decade old machine.
??? I'm starting to think you are trolling. What kind of educational establishment do you go to that has worse desktops than that- matlab is an example of an application you would NOT want to be running on this sort of hardware.
If a fault isn't declared in the ebay post you can return or request a refund from ebay which almost always goes in favor of the buyer. I wouldn't recommend buying from anywhere else except ebay for this reason actually. Except possibly amazon as i know for sure they have a similar system.
I just looked up the price for a new surface pro. I definitely didn't spend that much. In some ways that kind of makes this thread even more relevant
Also I hate to say it but it can perform the same tasks as a surface pro if what you need it for is productivity. A surface It runs all the same programs I usually run, at relatively the same speed, as I said the hard drive is the bottleneck. Palm rejection has become less of an issue (obviously). Maybe I should put up a big banner saying 'PRODUCTIVITY ONLY' which would make things more clear :P.
I think the main point of this is even when your new laptop breaks this will still be around. It's like an old bike, if something breaks you have a backup and this will probably never break until software becomes too outdated for it and even then windows 10 will be probably be supported for quite a long time after any new release. It is dependable and for some people (the minority) it actually still does offer a solution for a very cheap laptop that can take notes. It is definitely not a rubbish system and as long as you are using it for it's correct purpose then it's fine.
I also think my idea of what people can afford is obviously a lot lower than I originally thought and this should be taken into account but the fact that it is just that cheap and it is still probably the cheapest laptop for note taking on the market. Heck the cheapest tablet with a pen I could find was about £160 on amazon. This is an absolute steal for this kind of functionality.
I will however add a big, this is not a replacement for a surface in (insert scenarios)! Indication though. Although it's getting late now.
I just looked up the price for a new surface pro. I definitely didn't spend that much. In some ways that kind of makes this thread even more relevant
Also I hate to say it but it can perform the same tasks as a surface pro if what you need it for is productivity. A surface It runs all the same programs I usually run, at relatively the same speed, as I said the hard drive is the bottleneck. Palm rejection has become less of an issue (obviously). Maybe I should put up a big banner saying 'PRODUCTIVITY ONLY' which would make things more clear :P.
I think the main point of this is even when your new laptop breaks this will still be around. It's like an old bike, if something breaks you have a backup and this will probably never break until software becomes too outdated for it and even then windows 10 will be probably be supported for quite a long time after any new release. It is dependable and for some people (the minority) it actually still does offer a solution for a very cheap laptop that can take notes. It is definitely not a rubbish system and as long as you are using it for it's correct purpose then it's fine.
I also think my idea of what people can afford is obviously a lot lower than I originally thought and this should be taken into account but the fact that it is just that cheap and it is still probably the cheapest laptop for note taking on the market. Heck the cheapest tablet with a pen I could find was about £160 on amazon. This is an absolute steal for this kind of functionality.
I will however add a big, this is not a replacement for a surface in (insert scenarios)! Indication though. Although it's getting late now.
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