Firm and insurance offer query Watch

waveyd
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#1
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Have searched the forums and can't find quite the same issue.

My son has an Oxford offer of A*AA and AAA from Manchester. But Manchester have dropped the offer to ABB if he makes them his firm choice.

The query is should/can he pick Manchester as firm and Oxford as insurance, and if he gets the grades, go with Oxford?
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学生の父
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(Original post by waveyd)
Have searched the forums and can't find quite the same issue.

My son has an Oxford offer of A*AA and AAA from Manchester. But Manchester have dropped the offer to ABB if he makes them his firm choice.

The query is should/can he pick Manchester as firm and Oxford as insurance, and if he gets the grades, go with Oxford?
No, if he gets the grades for his Firm, his Insurance will fall away. In other words, if he Firms Manchester and gets ABB, then he will go to Manchester; Oxford will no longer be an option for him.

If Oxford has made him an A*AA offer, their tutors consider him a good fit for there. Unless he really wants to go to Manchester, it would be best to Firm Oxford, and Insure Manchester at AAA.

I suspect that even if your son misses the Insurance by a grade or two that it would still be possible for him to get a place at a good university.

Cross fingers for A*AA, though!
Last edited by 学生の父; 5 days ago
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Afterlife?
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(Original post by 学生の父)
No, if he gets the grades for his Firm, his Insurance will fall away. In other words, if he Firms Manchester and gets ABB, then he will go to Manchester; Oxford will no longer be an option for him.

If Oxford has made him an A*AA offer, their tutors consider him a good fit for there. Unless he really wants to go to Manchester, it would be best to Firm Oxford, and Insure Manchester at AAA.

I suspect that even if your son misses the Insurance by a grade or two that it would still be possible for him to get a place at a good university.

Cross fingers for A*AA, though!
I thought on results day, If he got the conditional firm grades then he is into his firm however he can call up his insurance and ask them if they would still take him and then if they agree they can save him a space and then he contacts his firm asking to be released. Then the Insurance choice can update themselves on ucas.
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harrysbar
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(Original post by waveyd)
Have searched the forums and can't find quite the same issue.

My son has an Oxford offer of A*AA and AAA from Manchester. But Manchester have dropped the offer to ABB if he makes them his firm choice.

The query is should/can he pick Manchester as firm and Oxford as insurance, and if he gets the grades, go with Oxford?
No, he can't do this. If he picks Manchester as Firm, he will be expected to go to Manchester if he gets the entry requirements. It would make a lot more sense for him to Firm Oxford and Insure Manchester. Yes, his offer will stick at AAA but it is quite possible that Mancs would accept him with a bit lower on results day even if he Insures them, and if the worst came to the worst...there's always Clearing. I know it's not an attractive prospect but it is likely that there will be lots of good unis with vacancies in August for people achieving good grades like ABB.
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waveyd
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Appreciate the quick responses.

So Manchester have said that if he puts them as insurance the AAA will hold, and if he gets lower grades then he's unlikely to get a place.

Their reasoning is that order of priority for offering places will be:
1. Firm offers making their grades
2. Firm offers just falling short
3. Insurance offers making their grades
4. Insurance offers just falling short

I've read mixed opinions on whether a firm offer can be declined if you get the grades. Guess I was hoping someone out there had actually gone through this scenario.
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学生の父
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(Original post by Afterlife?)
I thought on results day, If he got the conditional firm grades then he is into his firm however he can call up his insurance and ask them if they would still take him and then if they agree they can save him a space and then he contacts his firm asking to be released. Then the Insurance choice can update themselves on ucas.
Page 28 of the UCAS Advisors Guide reads:
If a university or college confirms a ‘firmly accepted’ offer, the applicant is committed to taking up that place. The insurance choice, if any, becomes redundant.
If a university or college does not confirm a ‘firmly accepted’ offer, the applicant may meet the conditions of their insurance choice, in which case they are committed to take up that place.
If an applicant chooses an insurance choice, they must be willing to take up the place. If they end up committed to their insurance place
and do not want it, they will have to withdraw their application altogether, or negotiate with the university or college to be entered into Clearing. The university is not obliged to agree to release the applicant from their commitment with them; and, if they do agree they may not action this very quickly.

In other words, it is only if the Insurance choice has accepted you (having missed your Firm) that you are able to ask to be released from your committment to them in order to enter Clearing. Even that is not guaranteed, however, and you may just have to withdraw entirely.

So, a Firm means just that. There is one exception: if you exceed the conditions of a Conditional Firm, you may try your luck in Adjustment. This wouldn't enable your son to get his Oxford place back, however. Oxford do not accept candidates in Adjustment.
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waveyd
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Thanks again 学生の父 - that seems pretty clear.

Frustrating that Manchester have played it that way, but I guess it's their way of competing for those lucrative bums on seats.
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RogerOxon
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(Original post by waveyd)
Have searched the forums and can't find quite the same issue.

My son has an Oxford offer of A*AA and AAA from Manchester. But Manchester have dropped the offer to ABB if he makes them his firm choice.

The query is should/can he pick Manchester as firm and Oxford as insurance, and if he gets the grades, go with Oxford?
Firm Oxford. He has a chance of getting in even if he misses the offer. Manchester will almost certainly take him if not, IMO (it's theirs that matters though).

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harrysbar
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(Original post by waveyd)
I've read mixed opinions on whether a firm offer can be declined if you get the grades. Guess I was hoping someone out there had actually gone through this scenario.
I think the reason for your confusion is that sometimes people do ask their Firm Uni to "release" them on results day if they have changed their mind about going there. Once the uni agrees (which can easily take a couple of days) the applicant is then free to apply to other Unis via Clearing - including their original Insurance Uni if they now prefer it. However, this scenario would not play out well when the Insurance is Oxford!
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waveyd
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Thanks all for taking the time to respond.

It seems the only option is Oxford firm and Manchester insurance. If things don't quite go to plan, there may be some wiggle room.
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