Jeremy Corbyn declares Labour Party is ready to take power and rebuild Britain Watch

Poll: Would Jeremy Corbyn be a good PM?
Yes (25)
25%
No (75)
75%
Wired_1800
  • Political Ambassador
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#81
Report 2 weeks ago
#81
(Original post by ColinDent)
Which as we have already established I did not actually say, one of the best though and therefore one reason why we are a very big target for any rogue states wishing to cause havoc.
I think one of the reasons why we are targeted is that we interfere in other people’s local affairs. As a result, they try to retaliate and this causes us so many issues. Another reason is that we align ourselves with the Americans, who are despised for so many atrocities in modern times.
1
reply
ColinDent
Badges: 12
Rep:
?
#82
Report 2 weeks ago
#82
(Original post by Wired_1800)
I think one of the reasons why we are targeted is that we interfere in other people’s local affairs. As a result, they try to retaliate and this causes us so many issues. Another reason is that we align ourselves with the Americans, who are despised for so many atrocities in modern times.
Can't dispute your first point, but then so do most countries.
So far as your second point goes then what I believe you are suggesting does, unfortunately, come with the territory of being the biggest superpower in the world, at the same time you cannot argue that they ( alongside western democracy in general) have not been attacked and that many of these atrocities were retaliatory.
0
reply
Wired_1800
  • Political Ambassador
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#83
Report 2 weeks ago
#83
(Original post by ColinDent)
Can't dispute your first point, but then so do most countries.
So far as your second point goes then what I believe you are suggesting does, unfortunately, come with the territory of being the biggest superpower in the world, at the same time you cannot argue that they ( alongside western democracy in general) have not been attacked and that many of these atrocities were retaliatory.
Fair. I’d agree that some of the responses where in retaliation, but several have been unprovoked. For many years, we went around the world acting like the world’s policeman and putting our military in danger. Those people retaliate for killing their innocent family members, then we act surprised like we did not know what we did wrong.
0
reply
ColinDent
Badges: 12
Rep:
?
#84
Report 2 weeks ago
#84
(Original post by Wired_1800)
Fair. I’d agree that some of the responses where in retaliation, but several have been unprovoked. For many years, we went around the world acting like the world’s policeman and putting our military in danger. Those people retaliate for killing their innocent family members, then we act surprised like we did not know what we did wrong.
Yet again can't really disagree.
0
reply
Mossbourne
Badges: 9
Rep:
?
#85
Report 2 weeks ago
#85
(Original post by Wired_1800)
Unfortunately, people are afraid of Corbyn because they don't want him to raid their pockets with taxes.
Because that would be a bad thing - high taxes mean people move businesses out of the country, meaning less tax.
Attached files
1
reply
Wired_1800
  • Political Ambassador
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#86
Report 2 weeks ago
#86
(Original post by Mossbourne)
Because that would be a bad thing - high taxes mean people move businesses out of the country, meaning less tax.
This is one of the oldest capitalist lies, Trickle-down economics does not work. Trump tried to do it with his reduction of federal corporation taxes, but there are still billions of dollars out of the system.

A healthy tax system generates billions of revenue for the state. The State uses those revenue for education, public services, roads, the NHS, infrastructure, security services etc. This is in turn helps the economy because people will be able to engage in the system.

When you reduce the amount of taxes that can be collected, it does not mean that the rich people will suddenly take over from the State as provider for the people. It does not happen. Instead they will horde their money to ensure that they continue to keep it for their future generations.

Without good taxes, the State will be forced to borrow from the capital markets and banks to plug the gap. This in turn is put on the backs of the same people, who are happy they are paying little to no taxes. It is one of the more insidious tricks that the Tories have played on us all.

Remember when in 2010, Cameron said that he would balance the books by the end of the Parliament? It is 2019 and we still have a budget deficit and exploding state debt.

People always attack Labour for not being fiscally responsible, but it has been the Tory Government that has damned your children and grand-children to debt, while they reduced the taxes to be able to keep more of their money off-shore.

Please open your eyes.
0
reply
Mossbourne
Badges: 9
Rep:
?
#87
Report 2 weeks ago
#87
(Original post by Wired_1800)
This is one of the oldest capitalist lies, Trickle-down economics does not work. Trump tried to do it with his reduction of federal corporation taxes, but there are still billions of dollars out of the system.

A healthy tax system generates billions of revenue for the state. The State uses those revenue for education, public services, roads, the NHS, infrastructure, security services etc. This is in turn helps the economy because people will be able to engage in the system.

When you reduce the amount of taxes that can be collected, it does not mean that the rich people will suddenly take over from the State as provider for the people. It does not happen. Instead they will horde their money to ensure that they continue to keep it for their future generations.

Without good taxes, the State will be forced to borrow from the capital markets and banks to plug the gap. This in turn is put on the backs of the same people, who are happy they are paying little to no taxes. It is one of the more insidious tricks that the Tories have played on us all.

Remember when in 2010, Cameron said that he would balance the books by the end of the Parliament? It is 2019 and we still have a budget deficit and exploding state debt.

People always attack Labour for not being fiscally responsible, but it has been the Tory Government that has damned your children and grand-children to debt, while they reduced the taxes to be able to keep more of their money off-shore.

Please open your eyes.
1) Accuses me of "capitalist lies" and is very closed minded to anyone right of Marx.
2) Tells me to "open your eyes".

Pick one.
Oh, by the way, how's socialism going in Venezuela and North Korea?

Edit: Just saw your "Trump's corporation tax" argument. There is a lot of things I don't have in common with him and I disagree with his stance on minorities, but cutting corporation tax is one of the few things he's done right. It will take about 10 years to take effect, however, by which time the Left will have blamed the success on AOC or Sanders or another loon with no understanding of economics.
Last edited by Mossbourne; 2 weeks ago
2
reply
Wired_1800
  • Political Ambassador
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#88
Report 2 weeks ago
#88
(Original post by Mossbourne)
1) Accuses me of "capitalist lies" and is very closed minded to anyone right of Marx.
2) Tells me to "open your eyes".

Pick one.
Oh, by the way, how's socialism going in Venezuela and North Korea?
1. I did not accuse you of capitalist lies. You did not invent the term “trickle-down economics”. I was calling those economists liars for making stuff up. Not you.

2. I said you should open your eyes because I think you may have adopted the nonsense peddled by those wealthy people, who want to keep you poor. You don't seem to understand it, until you see the game for what it really is.

The issue with Venezuela, North korea or Cuba was not socialism but the United States. The US is the world super-power, so when they disconnect your economy from the world financial system that they control, your nation will perish. This is regardless of whether you support capitalism or socialism.

Socialism works, but people want you to believe that it does not. Take for example the Scandinavian model, where you have a healthy tax system with strong government participation, high wellbeing, excellent education and health systems as well as better life outcomes.
Last edited by Wired_1800; 2 weeks ago
0
reply
anonanon69
Badges: 2
Rep:
?
#89
Report 2 weeks ago
#89
(Original post by Wired_1800)
1. I did not accuse you of capitalist lies. You did not invent the term “trickle-down economics”. I was calling those economists liars for making stuff up. Not you.

2. I said you should open your eyes because I think you may have adopted the nonsense peddled by those wealthy people, who want to keep you poor. You don't seem to understand it, until you see the game for what it really is.

The issue with Venezuela, North korea or Cuba was not socialism but the United States. The US is the world super-power, so when they disconnect your economy from the world financial system that they control, your nation will perish. This is regardless of whether you support capitalism or socialism.

Socialism works, but people want you to believe that it does not. Take for example the Scandinavian model, where you have a healthy tax system with strong government participation, high wellbeing, excellent education and health systems as well as better life outcomes.
Blaming the US, for Venezuelas problems is just delusional. Socialism is abhorrent, millions upon millions of people have died due to the long term implementation of Socialist regimes enough is enough we can not go back to that abhorrent system.
2
reply
Mossbourne
Badges: 9
Rep:
?
#90
Report 2 weeks ago
#90
(Original post by Wired_1800)
1. I did not accuse you of capitalist lies. You did not invent the term “trickle-down economics”. I was calling those economists liars for making stuff up. Not you.

2. I said you should open your eyes because I think you may have adopted the nonsense peddled by those wealthy people, who want to keep you poor. You don't seem to understand it, until you see the game for what it really is.

The issue with Venezuela, North korea or Cuba was not socialism but the United States. The US is the world super-power, so when they disconnect your economy from the world financial system that they control, your nation will perish. This is regardless of whether you support capitalism or socialism.

Socialism works, but people want you to believe that it does not. Take for example the Scandinavian model, where you have a healthy tax system with strong government participation, high wellbeing, excellent education and health systems as well as better life outcomes.
1) Scandinavia ≠ socialism, Sweden has no minimum wage, which is a key element of socialism.
2) How funny, then, that other states which the US has problems, for whatever reason, with (cf. France, Germany) prosper. Could it be that they have rejected the rubbish and dogma of socialism?
3) Okay, you're stepping into conspiracy nuttery territory here. In your world, the "elites" (nudge nudge wink wink) want to keep the people poor. That's less of a dog whistle and more of a fog horn.
0
reply
Wired_1800
  • Political Ambassador
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#91
Report 2 weeks ago
#91
(Original post by Mossbourne)
1) Scandinavia ≠ socialism, Sweden has no minimum wage, which is a key element of socialism.
2) How funny, then, that other states which the US has problems, for whatever reason, with (cf. France, Germany) prosper. Could it be that they have rejected the rubbish and dogma of socialism?
3) Okay, you're stepping into conspiracy nuttery territory here. In your world, the "elites" (nudge nudge wink wink) want to keep the people poor. That's less of a dog whistle and more of a fog horn.
1. Minimum wage is not the central element of socialism. Socialism enables a more than “normal” redistribution by the State and this can be done through taxation, when you take significant chunks from the wealthy and redistribute it through public services and welfare.

2. Really? Are you serious? Do you honestly think that France and Germany have issues with the US? If you think so, then I cannot say further.

3. Okay. Do you.
0
reply
Wired_1800
  • Political Ambassador
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#92
Report 2 weeks ago
#92
(Original post by anonanon69)
Blaming the US, for Venezuelas problems is just delusional. Socialism is abhorrent, millions upon millions of people have died due to the long term implementation of Socialist regimes enough is enough we can not go back to that abhorrent system.
You have not been paying attention.
0
reply
Mossbourne
Badges: 9
Rep:
?
#93
Report 2 weeks ago
#93
(Original post by Wired_1800)
2. Really? Are you serious? Do you honestly think that France and Germany have issues with the US? If you think so, then I cannot say further.
Given France and Germany are the two main powers in the EU, and the EU are in a trade war with America, I would say there are issues there.
1
reply
Wired_1800
  • Political Ambassador
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#94
Report 2 weeks ago
#94
(Original post by Mossbourne)
Given France and Germany are the two main powers in the EU, and the EU are in a trade war with America, I would say there are issues there.
What?????? The EU in a trade war with America???? Are you ok? The only trade conflict going on is China versus the US because the trade deficit between both countries has favoured China. Trump wants to balance the books, hence why he is forcing a new trade agreement. I honestly don't know where you get your information from.

I can mention many countries, who have gone against the US and were disconnected. These countries then suffered economically because they did not have access to the global markets. For example, North Korea, Cuba, Venezuela, Argentina, Mozambique, Yemen, Syria etc. Mozambique refused US assistance decades ago and have been one of the poorest nations in the world ever since.
0
reply
username3973192
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#95
Report Thread starter 2 weeks ago
#95
This thread's been brought back to life :elmo:
0
reply
Mossbourne
Badges: 9
Rep:
?
#96
Report 2 weeks ago
#96
(Original post by thestudent33)
This thread's been brought back to life :elmo:
Whooooo, spooky!
0
reply
ColinDent
Badges: 12
Rep:
?
#97
Report 2 weeks ago
#97
(Original post by Mossbourne)
Whooooo, spooky!
Is the red woman around?
0
reply
DarthRoar
Badges: 19
Rep:
?
#98
Report 2 weeks ago
#98
(Original post by Wired_1800)
The issue with Venezuela, North korea or Cuba was not socialism but the United States. The US is the world super-power, so when they disconnect your economy from the world financial system that they control, your nation will perish. This is regardless of whether you support capitalism or socialism.

Socialism works, but people want you to believe that it does not. Take for example the Scandinavian model, where you have a healthy tax system with strong government participation, high wellbeing, excellent education and health systems as well as better life outcomes.
'Social Democracy' isn't socialism. They're a capitalist free-market society with some socialist policies, thus forming a social democracy. The cost is high: the average earner will get less than half of what they earn after all deductions. That's pretty bad, but there's some definite benefits. It's debatable whether they're worth it, but I'd support it.

Proper socialism, involving collective ownership and such communist policies, has been absolutely disastrous throughout the world and history without exception. Socialism was failing before the US could do what you're saying it can, and it continues to fail today when the US cares far less than it used to. It's preposterous to say the US causes socialism to fail by cutting such countries off from the system 'they control'.

Capitalist states with US sanctions survive (see china (basically capitalist really), russia, etc). Socialist sanctioned states do not. Wow!
1
reply
Wired_1800
  • Political Ambassador
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#99
Report 2 weeks ago
#99
(Original post by DarthRoar)
'Social Democracy' isn't socialism. They're a capitalist free-market society with some socialist policies, thus forming a social democracy. The cost is high: the average earner will get less than half of what they earn after all deductions. That's pretty bad, but there's some definite benefits. It's debatable whether they're worth it, but I'd support it.

Proper socialism, involving collective ownership and such communist policies, has been absolutely disastrous throughout the world and history without exception. Socialism was failing before the US could do what you're saying it can, and it continues to fail today when the US cares far less than it used to. It's preposterous to say the US causes socialism to fail by cutting such countries off from the system 'they control'.

Capitalist states with US sanctions survive (see china (basically capitalist really), russia, etc). Socialist sanctioned states do not. Wow!
The undercurrent of social democracy is not a free market but a socialist-oriented form of engagement. This means that the fundamental bedrock is a socially-engaged State. With this method, you take the whole country or majority of the nation with you and outcomes are better.

One of the things that annoy me is when we compare human existence and often imply causation. Just because socialism did not work in 1521 does not necessarily mean that it cannot work in 2021. We live in a system that compares totally different ways of lives and make conclusions that some of those systems wont work today.

Capitalism is dead and the elite know that fact. It is the reason why we are seeing severe political swings to either the far right or far left.

Also, if you don't fully understand how global geopolitics works, then you are probably ignorant. The US is a superpower and controls the world. Any country that does not follow the American doctrine is eliminated.

Socialist states don't survive because they are cut off from the global financial system that the US underpins. Look at Cuba for example, who could not take loans from the global markets or were given loans with severe conditions. When they agreed to brown-nose the US, the money flowed back. This means they are unable to access credit, get government loans, sell their goods on favourable terms, ensure their currency is healthy enough to have sufficient buying power, participating in global progression such as healthcare advancement etc.
Last edited by Wired_1800; 2 weeks ago
0
reply
Digital_King321
Badges: 14
Rep:
?
#100
Report 2 weeks ago
#100
Diane Abbott is the Stupidest MP who has ever sat in the House of Commons Corbyn is a B*llend. Theresa May is a D**k sucking tw*t C**t. Gove is a Crack head.

Boris is our one true saviour
0
reply
X

Quick Reply

Attached files
Write a reply...
Reply
new posts
Latest
My Feed

See more of what you like on
The Student Room

You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

Personalise

How did your AQA A-level Psychology Paper 1 go?

Loved the paper - Feeling positive (136)
22.82%
The paper was reasonable (262)
43.96%
Not feeling great about that exam... (108)
18.12%
It was TERRIBLE (90)
15.1%

Watched Threads

View All