Am I making a mistake with my uni choices?

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aspiringlawyerNW
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#41
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You cited that flawed study, not me. If we account for non-law cohorts, UCL has far more undergraduates than York does now. I would imagine that York had much less six years ago, since a whole new campus has been built since then. And if we're talking about law cohort size, York have typically only accepted approx 200 per year. Which is comparable to UCL and LSE.
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harrysbar
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#42
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(Original post by TripleTommy)
If not Newcastle, what about York? Would that be as stupid to go to as opposed to UCL?

I’m just not keen on London life anymore having looked in more depth and York does appeal.
York is very well regarded for Law and I think it's a great choice for someone who is predicted excellent A levels but doesn't want to go to Oxbridge or London. There will be lots of other students there with top A level grades (more than at Newcastle) and no legal firm will look down on you for going there. Your undergraduate years are supposed to be enjoyable as well as productive, and it sounds like you would be happier in York than London at this stage of your life
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aspiringlawyerNW
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(Original post by J-SP)
But York has a much higher proportion of non law students choosing legal careers than UCL.
Which, yet again, has nothing to do with my original comments, because I can only speak from my experience and for the students on my course. And since the original poster is wanting to study law, it's not really relevant.
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aspiringlawyerNW
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(Original post by J-SP)
If it’s not relevant, why you are engaging with the topic? Seems ok for you to try and put your idea across but not for others....

We can question the reliability of your experience in painting an accurate picture of what happens in York and what expectations are like.

Be also mindful that people get caught up in the MC/US firm bandwagon, especially early on in their course. Typically that wanes by the time they get round to actually experiencing work in law firms or realise it isn’t what it’s cracked up to be (not unique to York though).

Vast majority of people on your course won’t even be aiming for a legal career, let alone a career at a very small subset of firms.
I'm still replying because you lot are still asking me to defend what I've said. I haven't claimed that what I've said is one hundred percent accurate, my "ideas" are based on actual interactions and conversations with the students on my course. I'm not saying that you can't put your ideas across, if anything it's you that's saying that to me...
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harrysbar
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(Original post by AndrewMarkSP)
I'm still replying because you lot are still asking me to defend what I've said. I haven't claimed that what I've said is one hundred percent accurate, my "ideas" are based on actual interactions and conversations with the students on my course. I'm not saying that you can't put your ideas across, if anything it's you that's saying that to me...
I'm sure OP appreciates your input and that's what counts
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aspiringlawyerNW
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#46
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(Original post by J-SP)
What with the uber defensiveness? No one here is saying your can’t add your opinion. I don’t know how you even got that from any of the posts.
My opinion has been challenged as unreliable. Which is fine, if you've got anything other than just assumption to base that on. And yet, me challenging the relevance of the Chambers Student study is blasted as me not allowing anybody else to offer their opinion?
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jonathanjames
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#47
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(Original post by TripleTommy)
Hi,

Just made an account on this as I’m really struggling to choose where to study for my LLB this September.

I got all 5 offers from UCL, KCL, Nottingham, York and Newcastle, which I’m really pleased about and I’m predicted A*A*A.

I was set on going to UCL as obviously it’s a great uni with an amazing rep but looking in more depth, I’ve decided that living in London isn’t something I really want and I’ve been put off the idea of studying there for undergraduate.

York has a really cool looking course but I found the city and campus a bit isolated and dull, which means I’ve ruled them out; Nottingham has a great campus but something about it didn’t really click with me so I’m not thinking of firming them either.

That leaves me with Newcastle, which right now I’m 95% sure I’m going to firm.

The city is amazing and the student life there is meant to be unparalleled; having been there once or twice with friends, I know it’s a place I would love to live in. The law school also seems good, with an interesting course, while I just got the “feel” when I went there.

People have told me it’s not as good as my other choices and I’ll be making a mistake if I firm it which is playing in my mind a little - if I firm Newcastle would you say I’m making a wrong decision?

I know it’s not as good a law school as UCL or some of my other choices but it just clicked with me and I’d rather be happy with where I’m studying than go somewhere based on reputation.

Any advice would be appreciated.
If your happy with having a harder career with less pay when you start, go for it. It will set you back a bit I your career path by several years, but doesn't mean you can't make your way to the top eventually.
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aspiringlawyerNW
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(Original post by J-SP)
We are challenging you as your opinion is also based on assumptions.

You seem to be taking this a little too personally and seem to be missing where you are getting picked up on points you are making.
How am I making assumptions? Surely real conversation and interactions with students have value in this conversation. Isn't the whole point of this forum to share insights and experiences to perspective students? Whereas assuming that I can't be right because you never really bothered with your course reps seems like a flakey argument (I know that wasn't you, but it's been said twice in this thread).

Anyway I've said my piece, I'm done.
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Notoriety
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#49
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(Original post by AndrewMarkSP)
I'm still replying because you lot are still asking me to defend what I've said. I haven't claimed that what I've said is one hundred percent accurate, my "ideas" are based on actual interactions and conversations with the students on my course. I'm not saying that you can't put your ideas across, if anything it's you that's saying that to me...
This is not personal to anyone else; it's not meant to be personal to you. No one knows who you are or what you've done in your life -- you're not on trial.
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Dylann
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#50
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(Original post by TripleTommy)
Thanks for all the feedback.

I think ultimately Newcastle won’t stretch me as much as my other options would and I don’t want to regret that opportunity in later life.

I’m still not keen on London and Notts doesn’t appeal so much either so I think I’ll go with York.

Is this wise or is everyone going to tell me that going to York over UCL is a bad decision as well?!
Hi, near Durham masters graduate here who applied to both UCL and York, with a year in Industry experience knowing people from a lot of different unis (especially York and Newcastle)

1) When I first read your OP, my initial thought was "They should firm York". I was glad to see you've sort of come to this decision yourself. The first thing I will say is your uni life is often defined by the types of people you spend time with, not the location. You'll probably get on better with people also on the A*AA level (there will be way more of these people at York and UCL than NCL). It's just natural.

2) Not going to uni because other students got lower grades than you is perfectly acceptable. It's why I rejected UCL because they offered me AAB and I was on course for 3A*s. Durham's A*AA was more appealing (and rightly so, I thought I was pretty good at chemistry until I got to Durham and realised I was very very average).

3) London is very unique in its university life, it's very big, very diverse, so although again it will be the people you meet (you'll probably get on equally well with people at UCL vs York), the location and feel of uni is very different and if you don't want London (I didn't, and I'm from London) definitely choose York. Getting a good job after Uni isn't just about what uni you went to. If you want a good law job after uni then start looking for work placements between your uni years. That will be infinitely more useful than going to UCL instead.

4) I would have chosen York or Warwick if I didn't go to Durham. Durham just had higher grade requirements and was more academically prestigious.

5) The people I've met from York are generally smarter than those at NCL, but equally fun to hang around with.

Go with York in my opinion. No future employer will look down upon York, but they might for Newcastle. Get lots of work experience, study hard, make yourself employable and you'll beat anyone from kings or UCL. Good luck
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That'sGreat
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#51
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(Original post by TripleTommy)
Hi,

Just made an account on this as I’m really struggling to choose where to study for my LLB this September.

I got all 5 offers from UCL, KCL, Nottingham, York and Newcastle, which I’m really pleased about and I’m predicted A*A*A.

I was set on going to UCL as obviously it’s a great uni with an amazing rep but looking in more depth, I’ve decided that living in London isn’t something I really want and I’ve been put off the idea of studying there for undergraduate.

York has a really cool looking course but I found the city and campus a bit isolated and dull, which means I’ve ruled them out; Nottingham has a great campus but something about it didn’t really click with me so I’m not thinking of firming them either.

That leaves me with Newcastle, which right now I’m 95% sure I’m going to firm.

The city is amazing and the student life there is meant to be unparalleled; having been there once or twice with friends, I know it’s a place I would love to live in. The law school also seems good, with an interesting course, while I just got the “feel” when I went there.

People have told me it’s not as good as my other choices and I’ll be making a mistake if I firm it which is playing in my mind a little - if I firm Newcastle would you say I’m making a wrong decision?

I know it’s not as good a law school as UCL or some of my other choices but it just clicked with me and I’d rather be happy with where I’m studying than go somewhere based on reputation.

Any advice would be appreciated.
I'd just say, top law firms will be targeting the top schools. I don't know whether Newcastle has a speciality in law, but overall, Newcastle is not up there with the likes of UCL. Judging from uni overall it would be (in terms of targeted by competitive employers):
- UCL
- Nottingham
- KCL
- York
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-
-
-
- Newcastle
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mayg98
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#52
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Hey, I currently study Engineering at UCL. I have a very close friend who did Law at UCL (graduated last year) and is going to be starting soon at a silver circle law firm. So my insights about the law degree programme are purely second hand but hope they help anyway.

To dispel some myths and confirm some truths:
1) Yes, UCL has a certain competitive vibe. High-performing environments always have a certain competitive vibe because everyone is trying to pursue big ambitions. You can choose to channel the competitiveness into negativity or you can use it to motivate you. This is not to say that having less/no ambition is a bad thing. It is purely a choice, and one is not better than the other. You have to be honest with yourself about what you want.

2) UCL students have a very good social life. Compared to LSE and Imperial, UCL students are a lot more chill. Law is a tough course, but it is your time management ability that matters. My friend has a very, very extensive CV which is filled with part-time work experience at startups, internships at big-name firms, vacation schemes/open days at top law firms, leadership committee positions at some of the largest societies on campus. On top of that, she was able to maintain a good social life without sacrificing sleep. With that said, she worked like a possessed person during the Easter break before exams. AND she managed to get a first class in her degree..

3) The law degree programme at UCL is well recognised. Last I checked, UCL was ranked 11th for law globally. For recruitment, the uni you go to matters. A LOT. Corporate law firms are suckers for big brand names. Having a 2:1+ at a top 5 university is going to give you a disproportionate advantage over your peers at other Russell group universities. It's sad, really, but this is how recruitment works.

If your ambition is to get into one of the top law firms, I would pick UCL in a heartbeat. I may be biased, but this is my two cents. Hope this helps.
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That'sGreat
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(Original post by J-SP)
I went to Newcastle for all the MC firms I worked for. So it was still targeted by those which are seen as competitive.

Been a target university for most organisations I have worked for. For those if wasn’t a target, neither was Nottingham or York.
It was in general, not specifically for law
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That'sGreat
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(Original post by J-SP)
Well I’d say the same for my experiences in the public sector, consultancy, accountancy firms, FMCG sector, and Telecoms... that “general” enough for you?
MBB and a few of those below do not target Newcastle, public sector don't tend to focus on targeting schools, accountancy (including Big4) no real target universities (top 40 or so) and the competitiveness is debatable (though, it does have a semi-target list which does not include Newcastle, by a long stretch), FMCG sector is varied (there are so many different roles in the company, some more competitive than others, and those that are most competitive do not list Newcastle as a target), telecoms is pretty vague (what roles, what companies).

So, actually, you've been so general in your haste of disproving me, that you've forgotten the whole idea is about competitive course.

I'm not sure what's up with the passive aggressiveness in your comment. And nobody said York or Nottingham (or even KCL) were targeted, they are just much more likely to be targeted by the top jobs.

On another note, why are you on a student forum when, judging from the amount of companies you have worked for, are likely mid to late 30s? Unless these were simply your clients during your time in the MC, in which case I wouldn't expect you to actually have the much insight into their target universities. And if you have spent your career working directly for these organisations, what roles were you in? A very varied list, I don't expect you've been in-house counsel for all of these companies considering how diverse they are.

Newcastle is not considered a competitive uni.
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Dr J
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(Original post by J-SP)
Competitive course does not equate to competitive career. Considering my experience is with what’s deemed competitive organisations (top employer brands) though, I still don’t agree with your stance. My experience is very different.

I work in graduate recruitment and my business advises companies on how to recruit students. It’s my job to know universities and employers...

And I’m on here to dispel terrible myths perpetuated by people who don’t know what they are talking about.
Hi, are you familiar with Investment banking and fiance recruitment?
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That'sGreat
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(Original post by J-SP)
Competitive course does not equate to competitive career. Considering my experience is with what’s deemed competitive organisations (top employer brands) though, I still don’t agree with your stance. My experience is very different.

I work in graduate recruitment and my business advises companies on how to recruit students. It’s my job to know universities and employers...

And I’m on here to dispel terrible myths perpetuated by people who don’t know what they are talking about.
I'm not surprised you advise businesses, because you certainly don't listen. I never said competitive courses equate to a competitive career, I was talking about target universities. I'm surprised you, as a graduate recruiter, clearly have no idea what that term means.

'dispel terrible myths', you have done no dispelling here, you simply got triggered at me saying, and rightly so, that Newcastle was not a competitive uni in terms of being actively targeted by competitive jobs. You still haven't talked about the roles you were actually recruiting, for example, how many new Greenwich Uni graduates did you place into a MBB consulting position? Or how about Newcastle uni into Financial Analyst at Google?

On a side note, why did you decide to quit being a solicitor at the Magic Circle to work for a graduate recruitment agency?
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Dr J
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(Original post by J-SP)
Never worked in an IB. Done plenty of Finance recruitment elsewhere in FS industries though. One of my competitive FS clients has always tended to do well from Newcastle.
What do you think about KCL's graduates's employability in finance e.g. with course of economics.
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Dr J
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(Original post by J-SP)
Anyone’s employability won’t be defined by their university.

I say this every time, I rejected more Oxbridge applicants each year than any other two universities combined when I worked in a MC firm. If your uni had that big an influence, my entire intake would have been Oxbridge year in year out.
What do you think the Oxbridge graduates lacked and how could they improve?
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That'sGreat
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(Original post by J-SP)
You seem to have contradicted yourself.

Considering I haven’t recruited for Google I can’t talk about their recruitment processes. And considering we weren’t talking about Greenwich, I don’t see the relevance there either.

I was never a solicitor in any of the MC firms I worked for.

I’m not a graduate recruitment agency.
Pinpoint the exact point where I've contradicted myself. Go on.

Please, use your brain for a second. You stated a competitive uni does not mean competitive career, ignoring any sort of correlation at all it seems, so when I raised a uncompetitive uni (Greenwich) and a competitive careers (competitive role in Google), and indicated you won't find the student in a competitive career, it showed your point to be utter crap. That. Is the relevance. I'm sure they taught you what examples were at uni?

Theres the point, what were you doing at these Magic Circle firms? Not all companies that are deemed competitive see all of their jobs being considered as competitive. MCs are known for law, they are considered competitive for law, going to Newcastle Uni and becoming an HR rep at the MC does not mean it is a competitive job, no offence.

In-house graduate recruitment is not exactly competitive. None of your examples have disproved that a) Newcastle is not a target for competitive careers and b) competitive universities aide you significantly in having a competitive career
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That'sGreat
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(Original post by JackFu)
What do you think the Oxbridge graduates lacked and how could they improve?
FYI Solicitors at Magic Circles are competitive, this will be down to their interview technique and possible assessment days. If you have Person A and Person B, who perform the same at interviews, but Person A went to Oxbridge and B went to Newcastle, Oxbridge would be picked everyday.
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