Texan state legislature considering bill that would make abortion punishable by death Watch

Stiff Little Fingers
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...ing-abortions/

Texas - so pro-life they'll kill you for it, previously just a dark joke about attacks on abortion clinics, now potentially a factual statement.
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Stiff Little Fingers
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Anyone still want to pretend that a pro-life position has anything to do with "the sanctity of life" rather than being just a forced birth position designed to enable systemic misogyny?
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Plantagenet Crown
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So killing an unborn, unformed human is such an awful sin that it’s OK to kill a fully formed, sentient adult who does it.

The irony is too strong, I’ve had to sit down.
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mpaprika
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mmm yes we must protect human life with the- (looks at christian teachings) utmost care!
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Leviathan1611
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hehehe, it won't pass.
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Decahedron
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"The legislation is the brainchild of state Rep. Tony Tinderholt... who has been married five times, argues that the measure is necessary to make women more personally responsible."

:facepalm2:
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SHallowvale
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In come the same old tired arguments about how undeveloped cells are exactly the same thing as fully developed human beings.
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Obolinda
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Wow, mad
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Nasir.
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Where's George Clooney now?
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Sabertooth
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This kind of thing pops up frequently in the South. Georgia recently thought up some 6 week abortion limit.

They'll both get struck down.
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Jebedee
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(Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
So killing an unborn, unformed human is such an awful sin that it’s OK to kill a fully formed, sentient adult who does it.

The irony is too strong, I’ve had to sit down.
Are you against the death penalty for murderers also? The intention is that a murderer can potentially murder an unlimited amount of people in their lifetime and by killing them, the death toll is capped at one.
(Original post by Stiff Little Fingers)
Anyone still want to pretend that a pro-life position has anything to do with "the sanctity of life" rather than being just a forced birth position designed to enable systemic misogyny?
I'm sure people are capable of justifying their own positions. Without your ill informed inference that looks like it's come straight out of a Huffpo headline.
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Just my opinion
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Abortion is always punishable by death.
Isn't that rather the point of it. 🤔
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AJ126
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(Original post by Jebedee)
Are you against the death penalty for murderers also? The intention is that a murderer can potentially murder an unlimited amount of people in their lifetime and by killing them, the death toll is capped at one.

I'm sure people are capable of justifying their own positions. Without your ill informed inference that looks like it's come straight out of a Huffpo headline.
Abortion isn't murder and embryos aren't people.
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Stiff Little Fingers
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(Original post by Jebedee)
Are you against the death penalty for murderers also? The intention is that a murderer can potentially murder an unlimited amount of people in their lifetime and by killing them, the death toll is capped at one.

I'm sure people are capable of justifying their own positions. Without your ill informed inference that looks like it's come straight out of a Huffpo headline.
They can claim to justify their positions, but a "pro-life" position is in reality an anti-choice and forced birth position (you can decide you'll never abort regardless of circumstance without then forcing that on other people and stripping them of their bodily autonomy), and when the pay gap is predominantly the result of a promotion and hiring gap, where women are disadvantaged in career advancement because of the assumption they'll have to take time out for kids, forcing that to be the case does mean enabling that form of systemic misogyny. Not to mention the massive issues around criminalisation of it - for instance treating people who have miscarriages as potential criminals, the inevitable increase in deaths of pregnant people who attempt back alley abortions or who abuse themselves (e.g. taking dangerous, uncontrolled drugs) to try and induce a miscarriage.
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Jebedee
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(Original post by AJ126)
Abortion isn't murder and embryos aren't people.
That's an assertion and I doubt you have any conclusive reasoning to demonstrate otherwise.
(Original post by Stiff Little Fingers)
They can claim to justify their positions, but a "pro-life" position is in reality an anti-choice and forced birth position (you can decide you'll never abort regardless of circumstance without then forcing that on other people and stripping them of their bodily autonomy), and when the pay gap is predominantly the result of a promotion and hiring gap, where women are disadvantaged in career advancement because of the assumption they'll have to take time out for kids, forcing that to be the case does mean enabling that form of systemic misogyny. Not to mention the massive issues around criminalisation of it - for instance treating people who have miscarriages as potential criminals, the inevitable increase in deaths of pregnant people who attempt back alley abortions or who abuse themselves (e.g. taking dangerous, uncontrolled drugs) to try and induce a miscarriage.
I wasn't aware that abortion was criminalised in the UK. If you have evidence as such then turn it into the police as it would clearly fly in the face of UK law.

Not sure how you managed to cram the wave gap myth in there but I'm sure if you looked at the numbers, you'd see that the vast majority of abortion recipients aren't exactly the career woman type.
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AJ126
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(Original post by Jebedee)
That's an assertion and I doubt you have any conclusive reasoning to demonstrate otherwise.


I wasn't aware that abortion was criminalised in the UK. If you have evidence as such then turn it into the police as it would clearly fly in the face of UK law.

Not sure how you managed to cram the wave gap myth in there but I'm sure if you looked at the numbers, you'd see that the vast majority of abortion recipients aren't exactly the career woman type.
How's it an assertion? It's not criminalized in the UK so it's not murder by definition.Murder is unlawful killing of a human being.Its not unlawful and a small collection of cells is not a human being by any definition.So really it's a fact.
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Jebedee
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(Original post by AJ126)
How's it an assertion? It's not criminalized in the UK so it's not murder by definition.Murder is unlawful killing of a human being.Its not unlawful and a small collection of cells is not a human being by any definition.So really it's a fact.
I'm talking from a moral standpoint not legal. No one really knows when a human comes to be, and as we are talking about life, the logical choice is to err on the side of caution and assume that life begins at conception until we know otherwise.
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AJ126
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(Original post by Jebedee)
I'm talking from a moral standpoint not legal. No one really knows when a human comes to be, and as we are talking about life, the logical choice is to err on the side of caution and assume that life begins at conception until we know otherwise.
That's not the logical choice at all.Thats the religious choice.Logic doesn't come into it.Most insects have more brain cells than an embryo which has just being conceived.By that logic swatting an insect is murder.And don't say it's because it will grow to be human.Its not a human yet so it's not murder.We don't do this with any other crime.We don't say oh she'll grow up to be a young woman so it's not child abuse.We don't say oh it's not theft because he was going to give it back.No.What matters is the present.In the present moment the embryo is not yet a human being so it's not murder.
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Jebedee
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(Original post by AJ126)
That's not the logical choice at all.Thats the religious choice.Logic doesn't come into it.Most insects have more brain cells than an embryo which has just being conceived.By that logic swatting an insect is murder.And don't say it's because it will grow to be human.Its not a human yet so it's not murder.We don't do this with any other crime.We don't say oh she'll grow up to be a young woman so it's not child abuse.We don't say oh it's not theft because he was going to give it back.No.What matters is the present.In the present moment the embryo is not yet a human being so it's not murder.
I'm one of the least religious people on this forum. The fact they agree with my viewpoint is irrelevant.

No I'm not saying it is murder because it will be a human. But because it already is. Unless you can pinpoint the exact moment it becomes a human, in lieu of any biological academic accreditations, the logical choice is to assume it starts at the earliest point.
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That'sGreat
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(Original post by Stiff Little Fingers)
Anyone still want to pretend that a pro-life position has anything to do with "the sanctity of life" rather than being just a forced birth position designed to enable systemic misogyny?
I think you are purposefully excluding the idea of an innocent life vs that of a (if the law is passed) would be criminal. If the law was passed, you are legally ending an innocent life, which would be equivalent to murder.
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