DiamondArtist
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I've got an offer for both KPMG and Grant Thornton for an audit apprenticeship and I don't know which one to choose.

KPMG: better status, 5 years, rumoured to treat employees badly (investigating this), (apparently) more travel opportunities, bigger clients

Grant Thornton: I've met the people and they're really nice, slightly better pay, 5 years, good status, some travel opportunities

Can someone help me decide which is better or what things I should do to help me choose?

Also, does anyone know how easy it is to back out of the contracts on results day?
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Realitysreflexx
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Grant Thornton... Its Audit...your career will be built on merit...not on prestige. (since you've met people and realised they are kind, which can be difficult for interns!)

If this were strategy consulting...or investmentbanking...

But Audit?

Can't imagine following tax rules is done differently at anyone firm in particular and the experience will translate.
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ajj2000
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(Original post by DiamondArtist)
I've got an offer for both KPMG and Grant Thornton for an audit apprenticeship and I don't know which one to choose.

KPMG: better status, 5 years, rumoured to treat employees badly (investigating this), (apparently) more travel opportunities, bigger clients

Grant Thornton: I've met the people and they're really nice, slightly better pay, 4 years, good status, some travel opportunities

Can someone help me decide which is better or what things I should do to help me choose?
Hey, congratulations! Thats a great position to be in. Are both schemes mainline audit/ assurance?

How do the schemes compare? For example is the KPMG scheme 2 years for AAT then 3 to complete ACA?
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DiamondArtist
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Yeah, they're both audit. Both also spend the first 2 years doing AAT and then 3 years ACA. Although at the end of my GT one there is a definite job while there isn't a definite job at KPMG.
(Original post by ajj2000)
Hey, congratulations! Thats a great position to be in. Are both schemes mainline audit/ assurance?

How do the schemes compare? For example is the KPMG scheme 2 years for AAT then 3 to complete ACA?
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ajj2000
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(Original post by DiamondArtist)
Yeah, they're both audit. Both also spend the first 2 years doing AAT and then 3 years ACA. Although at the end of my GT one there is a definite job while there isn't a definite job at KPMG.
So where does the 4 years with GT come from? They both seem to be 5 years based on what you have noted?
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underestimated6
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I would choose KPMG for reasons, well, maybe not ethically correct but how society is.

Often employees of the big 4 move to industry after 4-6 years and it is very likely you will be doing the same.

It's like a degree from Oxford/Cambridge, students from Warwick will be just as capable in a work setting but many many employers will simply give preference to Oxbridge graduates which is why they will get more opportunities than other unis simply will not.

In a similar way when employers see big 4 credentials in someone's cv, they are overly impressed. But they have reason to also, it's not just blind favoritism. Audit in a big 4 is so demanding that it will set you up wherever you go, whether that's in the big 4 or in industry.

KPMG is probably a worse a place to work than Grant Thornton but it is about your career progression, salaries and job opportunities. Both are amazing, but KPMG will unlock more for you so that is the choice I would firmly take in your position as the pros far outweigh the cons.
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DiamondArtist
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Thanks so much for the reply that's actually really helpful and helps me put things into perspective
(Original post by underestimated6)
I would choose KPMG for reasons, well, maybe not ethically correct but how society is.

Often employees of the big 4 move to industry after 4-6 years and it is very likely you will be doing the same.

It's like a degree from Oxford/Cambridge, students from Warwick will be just as capable in a work setting but many many employers will simply give preference to Oxbridge graduates which is why they will get more opportunities than other unis simply will not.

In a similar way when employers see big 4 credentials in someone's cv, they are overly impressed. But they have reason to also, it's not just blind favoritism. Audit in a big 4 is so demanding that it will set you up wherever you go, whether that's in the big 4 or in industry.

KPMG is probably a worse a place to work than Grant Thornton but it is about your career progression, salaries and job opportunities. Both are amazing, but KPMG will unlock more for you so that is the choice I would firmly take in your position as the pros far outweigh the cons.
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DiamondArtist
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yeah they're both 5 years sorry I mistyped in the original question
(Original post by ajj2000)
So where does the 4 years with GT come from? They both seem to be 5 years based on what you have noted?
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ajj2000
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(Original post by DiamondArtist)
yeah they're both 5 years sorry I mistyped in the original question
Cool - so effectively the same deal whichever you take.
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ajj2000
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(Original post by DiamondArtist)
I've got an offer for both KPMG and Grant Thornton for an audit apprenticeship and I don't know which one to choose.

KPMG: better status, 5 years, rumoured to treat employees badly (investigating this), (apparently) more travel opportunities, bigger clients

Grant Thornton: I've met the people and they're really nice, slightly better pay, 5 years, good status, some travel opportunities

Can someone help me decide which is better or what things I should do to help me choose?
Things to consider. Well, I dont know much up to date about GT (only one of the top 10 I've not had some interaction with in recent years). From reputation its a nicer place to work than many - not such long hours as the big 4 (in general - things can vary a lot) and a decent range of clients. KPMG has lots of nice people by the way - at least the ones I know! It is intense and very focused - challenging, long hours , lots of ambitious young people.

Things I would consider:

- Range and types of clients and the work you would do. KPMG would have more multinationals and household name clients than GT. More specialist areas such as financial services. On the other hand you probably see more of the end to end process in GT at an earlier stage
- Pay levels. Not sure how you find this - people on this forum may know
- Size of office. Being in an office with enough people at your level is good as you get a group of friends
- Working life/ work life balance. Not great at big 4. Probably better at GT.
- Future opportunities. Big 4 looks very good on you CV and opens doors. Employers like the name and the fact you have worked very hard.
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mnot
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(Original post by DiamondArtist)
I've got an offer for both KPMG and Grant Thornton for an audit apprenticeship and I don't know which one to choose.

KPMG: better status, 5 years, rumoured to treat employees badly (investigating this), (apparently) more travel opportunities, bigger clients

Grant Thornton: I've met the people and they're really nice, slightly better pay, 5 years, good status, some travel opportunities

Can someone help me decide which is better or what things I should do to help me choose?
KPMG offers great opportunities,

i spoke to a partner there last year, when he had been going up the ranks he took 7 (Yes SEVEN) international secondments around the world ie New York, Singapore, HK, San Francisco, Geneva (can't remember the rest).

I think the exit opportunities & clients at KPMG will also be better.

If your only desire is audit it's probably just got to be a judgment call, but i personally would pick KPMG, and if you want to try consulting, tax, or go into corporate finance later KPMG can give you these chances (that being said, i have no desire to apply to any audit grad jobs and i don't know much about Grant Thornton)
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DiamondArtist
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(Original post by mnot)
KPMG offers great opportunities,

i spoke to a partner there last year, when he had been going up the ranks he took 7 (Yes SEVEN) international secondments around the world ie New York, Singapore, HK, San Francisco, Geneva (can't remember the rest).

I think the exit opportunities & clients at KPMG will also be better.

If your only desire is audit it's probably just got to be a judgment call, but i personally would pick KPMG, and if you want to try consulting, tax, or go into corporate finance later KPMG can give you these chances (that being said, i have no desire to apply to any audit grad jobs and i don't know much about Grant Thornton)
Thanks I'm really interested in secondments in other countries and in other areas so I do think KPMG would be better for that.
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ajj2000
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natninja - can you comment?
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DiamondArtist
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Thanks so much for the reply, what you've said is really useful and gives me a lot to think about but might actually lead me to an answer
(Original post by ajj2000)
Things to consider. Well, I dont know much up to date about GT (only one of the top 10 I've not had some interaction with in recent years). From reputation its a nicer place to work than many - not such long hours as the big 4 (in general - things can vary a lot) and a decent range of clients. KPMG has lots of nice people by the way - at least the ones I know! It is intense and very focused - challenging, long hours , lots of ambitious young people.

Things I would consider:

- Range and types of clients and the work you would do. KPMG would have more multinationals and household name clients than GT. More specialist areas such as financial services. On the other hand you probably see more of the end to end process in GT at an earlier stage
- Pay levels. Not sure how you find this - people on this forum may know
- Size of office. Being in an office with enough people at your level is good as you get a group of friends
- Working life/ work life balance. Not great at big 4. Probably better at GT.
- Future opportunities. Big 4 looks very good on you CV and opens doors. Employers like the name and the fact you have worked very hard.
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