elite johnson
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what is python?
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I'm God
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It's a programming language (high-level)
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CommanderKeen
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a lizard
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winterscoming
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Have a look here: https://www.codecademy.com/learn/learn-python
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CommanderKeen
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that one is actually really bad. It just teaches you some basic syntax, nothing else.
(Original post by winterscoming)
Have a look here: https://www.codecademy.com/learn/learn-python
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CommanderKeen
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Check for "Derek Banas" - Python course on YouTube, really good. MIT Intro to algorithms, then Git, Scrum, etc... try to build something
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winterscoming
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(Original post by CommanderKeen)
that one is actually really bad. It just teaches you some basic syntax, nothing else.
There's nothing bad about that. Basic syntax, grammar and programming terminology are the first things people need to learn.
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CommanderKeen
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Much better resources available, often free.
(Original post by winterscoming)
There's nothing bad about that. Basic syntax, grammar and programming terminology are the first things people need to learn.
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CommanderKeen
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CodeAcademy is junk, especially if you do not pay for premium. After finishing the course you wont be able to do anything on your own, or have a clue where to go next, no algorithms, data structures, nothing. IF statements and WHILE loops, nothing else. It's way better to learn programming with a specific goal in mind. No point wasting time on sub par resources.

https://www.udemy.com/python-3-deep-dive-part-1/ easy and decent intro into Python's internals, saves lots of headaches in the future.
https://www.learnpythonthehardway.org/ this guy is a legend
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JUN...ayhHWgw7akUWSf difficult as F but helps a lot
www.hackerrank.com coding competition with lots of good algo and data tutorials and may land you a job...

Using dodgy resources leads only to relearning coding over and over again. If you have some money then go with into to AI programming in Python by Udacity. Or Python course on Coursera is a proper full course for like £50..
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winterscoming
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(Original post by CommanderKeen)
Much better resources available, often free.
"Better" is a highly subjective term, and depends a lot on the audience. Codecademy is also free, it is deliberately aimed at people who are completely new to the concept of programming just to find out what it's about and to get their first taste of writing code - it's ideal for those people.

It's not intended to rival university courses or teach programming skills - its purpose is to be a simple, accessible, non-intimidating introduction for people who otherwise find the whole idea of programming to be mysterious or overwhelming, and is very successful at doing so.

(Original post by CommanderKeen)
CodeAcademy is junk, especially if you do not pay for premium. After finishing the course you wont be able to do anything on your own, or have a clue where to go next, no algorithms, data structures, nothing. IF statements and WHILE loops, nothing else.
None of this matters for somebody simply asking what Python is really; the OP is a long way from needing to care anything about algorithms or data structures.

Codecademy is interactive and provides tonnes of hints/help in ways which aim to minimise the kinds of frustrations which beginners normally experience when they're starting out with programming. A lot of people view programming as being something which is too difficult for them to do; when they try it out from a lot of traditional books and courses, they end up finding themselves badly stuck with no help/support after a few weeks or chapters, which just re-inforces their original fears/beliefs, so they just give up.
Last edited by winterscoming; 2 years ago
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CommanderKeen
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I never heard anyone from industry recommending it, schools just use it because it's free or just include it in a long list of whatever is free and available. I don't think that any CS tutor actually went trough the curriculum. I think, that garbage like CodeAcademy does a disservice to kids, it gives them the false feeling that they are learning to code without actually teaching them any of the relevant stuff and then it throws them to an interview where they ask them to convert a binary tree or something like that and that's instant game over. CodeAcademy skips all the important stuff, and it's the same junk for like 5 years.

Learning syntax != learning to code
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CommanderKeen
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No point learning stuff the wrong way, waste of time.
(Original post by winterscoming)
"Better" is a highly subjective term, and depends a lot on the audience. Codecademy is also free, it is deliberately aimed at people who are completely new to the concept of programming just to find out what it's about and to get their first taste of writing code - it's ideal for those people.

It's not intended to rival university courses or teach programming skills - its purpose is to be a simple, accessible, non-intimidating introduction for people who otherwise find the whole idea of programming to be mysterious or overwhelming, and is very successful at doing so.


None of this matters for somebody simply asking what Python is really; the OP is a long way from needing to care anything about algorithms or data structures.

Codecademy is interactive and provides tonnes of hints/help in ways which aim to minimise the kinds of frustrations which beginners normally experience when they're starting out with programming. A lot of people view programming as being something which is too difficult for them to do; when they try it out from a lot of traditional books and courses, they end up finding themselves badly stuck with no help/support after a few weeks or chapters, which just re-inforces their original fears/beliefs, so they just give up.
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EndMe.xo
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Name:  python-3708447__340.jpg
Views: 31
Size:  13.6 KB hope this helps
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winterscoming
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(Original post by CommanderKeen)
No point learning stuff the wrong way, waste of time.
There is nothing wrong about the way that Codecademy teaches


(Original post by CommanderKeen)
I never heard anyone from industry recommending it, schools just use it because it's free or just include it in a long list of whatever is free and available. I don't think that any CS tutor actually went trough the curriculum. I think, that garbage like CodeAcademy does a disservice to kids, it gives them the false feeling that they are learning to code without actually teaching them any of the relevant stuff and then it throws them to an interview where they ask them to convert a binary tree or something like that and that's instant game over. CodeAcademy skips all the important stuff, and it's the same junk for like 5 years.

Learning syntax != learning to code
Its purpose is not to teach programming skillls - its purpose is to be a very beginner-friendly introduction for people who know absolutely nothing about programming. You are criticising it for something that it's not meant to be.

Furthermore, the basic syntax, structure and terminology is a real barrier for people who know nothing about programming.

It tends to cause a lot of newcomers learning by themselves when they don't have any kind of tutor or mentor to turn to when they get stuck on the basics - most people are far more likely just to give up than to try to figure out by themselves what the problems are when they've made a "newbie error" like mixing upper/lower case, or getting their indentation wrong, or missing the colon at the end of an 'if' statement.

A Ford Fiesta is not an F1 car, but that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with a Ford Fiesta for someone who has never driven a car before.
Last edited by winterscoming; 2 years ago
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CommanderKeen
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CodeAcademy is more like memorising some features of the ford fiesta but never actually touching it, and F1 is C/Asm in unix
(Original post by winterscoming)
There is nothing wrong about the way that Codecademy teaches



Its purpose is not to teach programming skillls - its purpose is to be a very beginner-friendly introduction for people who know absolutely nothing about programming.

A Ford Fiesta is not an F1 car, but that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with a Ford Fiesta for someone who has never driven a car before.
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winterscoming
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(Original post by CommanderKeen)
CodeAcademy is more like memorising some features of the ford fiesta but never actually touching it, and F1 is C/Asm in unix
Codecademy does have people writing code -- that's the whole point. It's interactive. And doesn't even need someone to go through the process of downloading and installing things (which is yet another barrier - some people get stuck before they're even able to write any code if they have a problem installing the Python tools for example)

Syntax, structure and terminology are huge barriers for people who are new to programming. Codecademy exists to break down those barriers.

You seem not to understand the kinds of frustrations which newcomers often have when learning programming; that's where codecademy supplements other learning resources which tend to cover the basics very quickly and leave people lost.
Last edited by winterscoming; 2 years ago
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CommanderKeen
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just an illusion of knowledge
(Original post by winterscoming)
It doesn't change the fact that syntax, structure and terminology are huge barriers for people who are new to programming. Codecademy exists to break down those barriers.
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winterscoming
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(Original post by CommanderKeen)
just an illusion of knowledge
Again, you are completely failing to understand the purpose of codecademy and the problems faced by a lot of beginners.
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CommanderKeen
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the only purpose is to suck in as much funding as possible, the usual borderline scam. they skip so much important stuff... there is no after code academy, you have to redo everything again from scratch no matter which way you endup going.
(Original post by winterscoming)
Again, you are completely failing to understand the purpose of codecademy and the problems faced by a lot of beginners.
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winterscoming
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(Original post by CommanderKeen)
the only purpose is to suck in as much funding as possible, the usual borderline scam. they skip so much important stuff... there is no after code academy, you have to redo everything again from scratch no matter which way you endup going.
The codecademy python lessons themselves are free, there's no need to pay for it.

As I've said before. Its purpose is not to teach people how to program or be a programmer. its purpose is to give people a very beginner-friendly introduction to help them learn a few basics of programming, by removing as many barriers as possible and getting people past the difficult hump of learning basic syntax, structure and terminology.

Someone who actually reaches the end and wants to learn more about programming can go and find more serious in-depth resources and spend a lot more time, writing code into an IDE, maybe going through some other free Python course like University Of Michigan Py4E or something similar.

Going back to the beginning is generally a good thing - it should be encouraged to learn from multiple sources. Having completed codecademy is likely to mean they are far less likely to get stuck with basic concepts like variables, indenting, and they'll be able to solve basic syntax/structural errors by themselves, understand the terminology, etc. That kind of stuff tends to be one of the reasons why people "switch off" most self-teach programming books and courses if they have no tutor or mentor to ask when they're stuck on some simple problem in a simple program. That's the sort of thing that a lot of school/GCSE students tend to get stuck with, which is why so many schools encourage its use.
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