China slaps US goods with new tariffs Watch

Baron of Sealand
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#41
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(Original post by Kangaroo17)
britain, france, etc were all full fledged monsters before their 'rise' to modernity and 'lesser evil'. why not let china have a piece of this pie?
If that's your argument, are you simply ignoring the existence of the Qin Empire? The Han Empire? The Ming Empire? I'm not counting the Manchurian and the Mongol empires as "China" but the three were more than enough. Not to mention ultimately you're simply doing whataboutism.

Does it mean if there's a murderer somewhere, an argument should be made for everyone to murder once?

And none of those former empires is erasing Hong Kong right now.
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Kangaroo17
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(Original post by AperfectBalance)
We (Britain) did more good in Africa than bad by far. the Africans have ruined what we gave them and have proven to be incapable of ruling (not all africans just africa in general)

And China 'uplifting' their people is the equivalent of a mother raising a child so she can abuse it later in life.
And Africa is now Exploiting African people too.
Well then i might as well say Nazi Germany are gods because they improved technology massively, got rid of the handicapped, thus less unemployed, and .. etc
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Napp
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#43
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(Original post by AperfectBalance)
anything to damage china is a good thing
Remind me where all of your belongings are made?
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by z-hog)
This is where the antagonism towards the guy takes off into another dimension, you do point out the challenges posed by China and then go on to accuse Trump of not doing enough about them when he takes them head on like nobody else would. It's one of those where anyone impartial must wonder if he isn't doing the world a favour, China will just rape and pillage their way through the world if unchecked. Not literally, of course.
He's only appearing to do that. It's true that the US has confronted China in the disputed islands (that started before Trump), but his administration never raises the ghastly regime as requiring replacement - why would he, he has shown very clearly that he favours corrupt oligarchs around the world - North Korea, Turkey, Saudi Arabia - I could go on, but this is not someone who dreams of democracy.
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by Kangaroo17)
Well then i might as well say Nazi Germany are gods because they improved technology massively, got rid of the handicapped, thus less unemployed, and .. etc
Hitler regularly told his intimates that he based his policies on the British Empire, ranging from concentration camps (South Africa during the Boer War), via forced deportations and slave labour (millions of workers were despatched using indentured labour, bribes and false claims from India to Africa and elsewhere), slave workers (let's not even get started on Britain's immense slaving industries), gassing of people you don't like (still going on in the 20s when Churchill recommended gas bombing of Iraqi tribes) and expropriation of living resources to sustain life. (numerous examples, the most recent being India in the second world war.)
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Baron of Sealand
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(Original post by Napp)
Remind me where all of your belongings are made?
it's not really the case that China makes everything. My phone was made in Vietnam, wallet India, suit USA, dress shoes Mexico, slippers Brazil, signet ring England, waistcoat Scotland, underwear Portugal, trousers Turkey, t-shirt Bangladesh, paperweight Egypt, dress watch Hong Kong, sports watch Russia, wine Spain, pencil Japan, flip-flops Myanmar, face cream France, body cream Poland, another cream Germany, tea Argentina, shirt Cuba, coat Korea, and so on.

Obviously quite a few things were made in China, but many different countries together can replace and are starting to replace China. China is getting more expensive while its skills are not as good as those in developed countries like Japan.
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Napp
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#47
(Original post by The Champion.m4a)
it's not really the case that China makes everything. My phone was made in Vietnam, wallet India, suit USA, dress shoes Mexico, slippers Brazil, signet ring England, waistcoat Scotland, underwear Portugal, trousers Turkey, t-shirt Bangladesh, paperweight Egypt, dress watch Hong Kong, sports watch Russia, wine Spain, pencil Japan, flip-flops Myanmar, face cream France, body cream Poland, another cream Germany, tea Argentina, shirt Cuba, coat Korea, and so on.

Obviously quite a few things were made in China, but many different countries together can replace and are starting to replace China. China is getting more expensive while its skills are not as good as those in developed countries like Japan.
You'll excuse me for remaining somewhat dubious of your eclectic wardrobe and other belongings.

China is getting relatively more expensive, that is the key word there. All this means is that the low end manufacturing is starting to move to other countries in Asia, such as Vietnam. China is still one of the world leaders in terms of electronics and such though and isnt about to be replaced in the immediate future. The point being you cant just smash deeply established supply chains and expect things to immediately just move somewhere else. that isnt how the modern economy works and especially so in Asia.
The fact remains only a masochist would would to see China collapse in on itself either socially, politically or economically because the blow back to the rest of the world would be biblical.
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Napp
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
ranging from concentration camps (South Africa during the Boer War),
Originally a Spanish idea, not british
via forced deportations and slave labour (millions of workers were despatched using indentured labour, bribes and false claims from India to Africa and elsewhere),
Didnt everyone do this...?
slave workers (let's not even get started on Britain's immense slaving industries),
Hardly the worst though? Ironically enough it was the Africans themselves who engaged in it by the far.
[quote[gassing of people you don't like (still going on in the 20s when Churchill recommended gas bombing of Iraqi tribes) [/quote]
Again, hardly a British idea.
and expropriation of living resources to sustain life. (numerous examples, the most recent being India in the second world war.)
Ditto above[/quote]
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AperfectBalance
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#49
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(Original post by lorainsj)
A contentious assertion there with regards to Britain doing more good than bad in Africa.

Is this the same good that Britain did in India as their share of the world economy fell from 24% before British colonialism to just 4% afterwards?
That really means very little, as Europe and some other countries became more powerful obviously the share of the world economy is going to drop, there are many other reasons bar 'you ruined it'
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Kangaroo17
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(Original post by AperfectBalance)
That really means very little, as Europe and some other countries became more powerful obviously the share of the world economy is going to drop, there are many other reasons bar 'you ruined it'
true, europe did have the industrial revolution but colonialism and expansion is what got western nations running
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Baron of Sealand
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(Original post by Napp)
You'll excuse me for remaining somewhat dubious of your eclectic wardrobe and other belongings.

China is getting relatively more expensive, that is the key word there. All this means is that the low end manufacturing is starting to move to other countries in Asia, such as Vietnam. China is still one of the world leaders in terms of electronics and such though and isnt about to be replaced in the immediate future. The point being you cant just smash deeply established supply chains and expect things to immediately just move somewhere else. that isnt how the modern economy works and especially so in Asia.
The fact remains only a masochist would would to see China collapse in on itself either socially, politically or economically because the blow back to the rest of the world would be biblical.
(Original post by Napp)
You'll excuse me for remaining somewhat dubious of your eclectic wardrobe and other belongings.

China is getting relatively more expensive, that is the key word there. All this means is that the low end manufacturing is starting to move to other countries in Asia, such as Vietnam. China is still one of the world leaders in terms of electronics and such though and isnt about to be replaced in the immediate future. The point being you cant just smash deeply established supply chains and expect things to immediately just move somewhere else. that isnt how the modern economy works and especially so in Asia.
The fact remains only a masochist would would to see China collapse in on itself either socially, politically or economically because the blow back to the rest of the world would be biblical.
The process has started many years ago. This year isn't going to be a sudden change.

I didn't mention more things because I wanted an example of each country. My laptop was made in China. I have 2 other cell phones. 1 made in Korea, the other free one in China. I don't know what else you would count ae electronics, don't think i have anything else. My silverware were made in Mexico. My silver jewelry were made in Mexico, Laos, Egypt, India. My gold made in England, Italy, Mexico. Not sure where they mined the gems. My pillow cases and sheets either made in India or Mexico. A bath towel was made in India, I think all the other ones Mexico. A pair of trousers and 3 shirts made in Hong Kong. The Arabic rope made in Egypt. The keffiah made in Jordan. The wine cup made in Israel, wine glass in Mexico, so is the shot cup.

I don't have a survey of the place of origin of all my things to see which country comes out on top, but from what I can see, even though China has made many things, they are most likely not making the majority, let alone making all my things.
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Last edited by Baron of Sealand; 1 week ago
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z-hog
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No matter what they say about the Chinese commies, their decision to replace Marxism with Capitalism was a stroke of genius.
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z-hog
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You heard it, it was very wise of the Communist party to realise by the late 70s that Marxism was only holding the country back and that experimenting with Capitalism was the only way to eventually prevent the hungry masses from turning on the party and getting rid of the Communist experiment altogether. So all these academics and assorted intellectual riff-raff talking shite about Capitalism can take it home with them because nobody cares, reality and factual evidence supersede their inconsequential waffle in the comfort provided by... capitalism. People who say 'Capitalism doesn't work' don't live in the real world and the Chinese example would be enough for them to realise it if only they cared about goes on in it. They don't, it's all up in the clouds.
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by z-hog)
No matter what they say about the Chinese commies, their decision to replace Marxism with Capitalism was a stroke of genius.
And then to carry on calling it Communism - or Maoism - or whatever. Genius.
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z-hog
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
And then to carry on calling it Communism - or Maoism - or whatever. Genius.
It's a hybrid, a Communist political system coupled with a Capitalist economic one.
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Napp
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(Original post by Fullofsurprises)
And then to carry on calling it Communism - or Maoism - or whatever. Genius.
'Capitalism with Chinese characteristics' :lol:
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by Napp)
'Capitalism with Chinese characteristics' :lol:
Maoist Consumerism in One Country.
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mnot
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(Original post by Napp)
Whilst one can sympathize with the US, to a point, in this situation Trumps handling of it has been hilariously moronic - although my dropping portfolio value simply calls him a ****. He also seems to be blissfully unaware that the US has for centuries been stealing other countries trade secrets, specifically it looted Britains like it was nobodies business and it continues to conduct industrial espionage against countries (although it claims no longer to use stolen secrets to better itself but only in trade negotiations).

Thoughts on this continuing bust up?

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-48253002
what are you on about, US corporation are free to file IP protection in the UK and vise versa, Europe and US have very similar IP protections and enforce fairly. China is known to have a 2 tier system depending on if you are a chinese company and frequently steal trade marks, technical & design patents.

Also China has a structure to economically dominate the world, by making it very easy to flood money in but much harder to pull it out of China, and require large companies to do joint ventures with Chinese companies or face huge tariffs. Trump is the only one trying to pull back on the regulations of US companies in China quite frankly the rest of the world should take notice and join the tit for tat tariffs on China, yes its painful short term but its the best way to balance the trade deficit all countries have with China
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Napp
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(Original post by mnot)
what are you on about, US corporation are free to file IP protection in the UK and vise versa, Europe and US have very similar IP protections and enforce fairly. China is known to have a 2 tier system depending on if you are a chinese company and frequently steal trade marks, technical & design patents.
Err what is your point sorry?
Also China has a structure to economically dominate the world, by making it very easy to flood money in but much harder to pull it out of China, and require large companies to do joint ventures with Chinese companies or face huge tariffs. Trump is the only one trying to pull back on the regulations of US companies in China quite frankly the rest of the world should take notice and join the tit for tat tariffs on China, yes its painful short term but its the best way to balance the trade deficit all countries have with China
I think you seem to be fundamentally misunderstanding what a trade deficit is.
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Napp
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(Original post by mnot)
You were on about the US stealing trade secrets, well there are laws to protect against this. If a person/company/entity had used IP protection it would be impossible for the US to steal it without further legal action, and an unprotected trade secret is nothing, you have no legal right to stop other people doing the same thing in that case... I thought you were getting at Trumps statement about China's biased IP regulations...
I said the US used to steal trade secrets for economic gain. It now steals them for leverage in trade negotiations and no there arent really any protections against this. The larger you are the harder they kick your ass in this case.
Nope, merely saying Trump was going about this in a typically ham fisted way and i take serious exception to that bloated troglodyte damaging my portfolio.
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