Why do black Jamaican families almost never home educate? Watch

Arran90
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I have been involved in the home education community for many years, and I have noticed that there are almost no black Jamaican families who home educate their children. What is the reason behind this?

I do not believe that it is primarily the result of financial status but some deeper seated cultural issues play a large part in the decision of almost every black Jamaican parent to send their children to state schools.

Black Jamaican children are also uncommon / underrepresented in independent schools (in comparison to south Asian children and even black African children). There also appears to be no public demand for black only schools with black teachers and in some cases a different curriculum from state schools.
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CHANELDIAMONDS
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why do u care
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Joinedup
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(Original post by Arran90)
I have been involved in the home education community for many years,
In what capacity?

I'm quite sceptical about homeschooling, when I was growing up it was only really popular with closed religious sects so it seems to me to be a way of parents hyper controlling their kids and raising them to fit in badly with society.

I hear it's growing in popularity and wonder if it's a form of extreme helicoptering your kids.

Why would there be public demand for black only schools? They've been a feature of societies we don't want to emulate. We've got state schools that afaik anyone can go to and see it as a problem if they start to look racially disproportionate to the areas they're supposed to serve e.g. through 'white flight'
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YaliaV
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Are most people not sceptical of home schooling? It has become more fashionable, but I’m not sure how it would work at secondary level without a lot of organisation/money.

A demand for black only schools?
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TheTroll73
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(Original post by Joinedup)
In what capacity?

I'm quite sceptical about homeschooling, when I was growing up it was only really popular with closed religious sects so it seems to me to be a way of parents hyper controlling their kids and raising them to fit in badly with society.

I hear it's growing in popularity and wonder if it's a form of extreme helicoptering your kids.

Why would there be public demand for black only schools? They've been a feature of societies we don't want to emulate. We've got state schools that afaik anyone can go to and see it as a problem if they start to look racially disproportionate to the areas they're supposed to serve e.g. through 'white flight'
Well the way I see it kids learn more bad than good in schools these days, hence the rise in popularity in homeschooling. there are other factors too, such as special needs children who are unable to attend schools etc.
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Arran90
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Something to take into account is that home educated children rarely follow a curriculum that schooled children follow. They follow a different curriculum that often factors in life skills and personal interests that schools do not cover. They tend to take fewer GCSEs than schooled children as they believe (or actually know) that academics isn't everything.

My own experience of home educated children is that they are better at relating to adults than schooled children are who often only develop the social skills to relate to their peer group of their own age.
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Royal Oak
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(Original post by Joinedup)
In what capacity?

I'm quite sceptical about homeschooling, when I was growing up it was only really popular with closed religious sects so it seems to me to be a way of parents hyper controlling their kids and raising them to fit in badly with society.

I hear it's growing in popularity and wonder if it's a form of extreme helicoptering your kids.

Why would there be public demand for black only schools? They've been a feature of societies we don't want to emulate. We've got state schools that afaik anyone can go to and see it as a problem if they start to look racially disproportionate to the areas they're supposed to serve e.g. through 'white flight'
I think it's rising in popularity because a lot of schools these days are **** holes. You hear so many stories of bullying, for example, happening in schools and schools doing nothing about it. Why leave your child in that environment if you have the capacity to teach them at home? That being said children should still be taught properly.
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hendyrix
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As a black Jamaican 2nd gen immigrant I feel like I can say some stuff here.

Firstly, I half agree/disagree with your point about finance. Home education is not cheap as it essentially requires tutors to teach subjects and my racial community does not appear much in high paying jobs that would finance this.

However, in terms of culture, homeschooling is just not what we do. It's not really thought of as an option as its pretty much the cultural norm to go to state school and there are no significant reasons why we would not go there.

We are not commonly found in independent schools for one general reason being a lack of financial resources. In Jamaica and for Jamaican families in the UK, going to an independent school is quite prestigious within our culture, therefore we obviously would if we were economically able, however more often than not we can't as the majority of our parents work in lower paid primary and secondary-sector occupations.

The idea of Black only schools is a very American idea and I doubt would ever take place in the UK. It essentially just promotes further racial segregation in a subtle way.

I think too many people try and make these sort of discussions about race but really it's more to do with class and income. Sure you won't find many black Jamaican kids being home-schooled or in independent schools but similarly, you won't find many white working class kids doing so either.
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Arran90
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(Original post by hendyrix)
As a black Jamaican 2nd gen immigrant I feel like I can say some stuff here.

Firstly, I half agree/disagree with your point about finance. Home education is not cheap as it essentially requires tutors to teach subjects and my racial community does not appear much in high paying jobs that would finance this.
What you say about tutors is untrue. Home educating parents generally only use tutors for the following purposes:

1. If children are significantly lagging behind academically in particular subjects - usually only English language and mathematics.

2. If children are taking GCSE exams as a private candidate - more often than not the tutors spend more time explaining the exam system and teaching exam technique rather than teaching the subject content because that can be learned from many readily available books.

3. For children who are home educated as a result of matters like bullying or exclusion and the parents just wish to replicate school at home.

The market for tutors are children who attend state schools as their parents obsess over getting top grades in exams (including SATS which home educated children don't take) and because of poor quality of teaching.

However, in terms of culture, homeschooling is just not what we do. It's not really thought of as an option as its pretty much the cultural norm to go to state school and there are no significant reasons why we would not go there.
You might have homed in that it's overwhelmingly a cultural rather than a financial matter but what underlies the cultural norm?

It's notable that black Jamaican children, especially boys, underperform academically in state schools - both in terms of raw GCSE grades and in comparison to white indigenous British and south Asian children. The situation is more acute in STEM subjects.

South Asian children who attend state schools statistically perform better academically than black Jamaican children from a similar socioeconomic background.

It raises questions whether Jamaican parents view the academic side of school as secondary importance to other aspects of attending state schools.

The idea of Black only schools is a very American idea and I doubt would ever take place in the UK. It essentially just promotes further racial segregation in a subtle way.
The BNP back in the late 1990s stated that they wished to establish black schools in order to improve educational standards of black children as such schools would have black teachers (believed to be better role models than white teachers) and a style of teaching and learning more in tune with the black (Jamaican?) culture.

The strange thing is that the BNP never mentioned Muslim schools back in the late 1990s but over the past 20 or so years society has revealed a significant and increasing demand for Muslim schools but absolutely no demand for black schools. The BNP had got it wrong.

I think too many people try and make these sort of discussions about race but really it's more to do with class and income.
It's not about race as I'm focusing on a specific ethnic group rather than black people collectively.

Black African parents are known to home educate (and often do a good job of it) and there are certainly plenty of poorer (mostly south Asian) Muslim families who home educate.

At the same time, it's rare to find non-Muslim south Asian families who home educate their children even if they are affluent or comfortably well off, but that's a subject for another discussion.

Sure you won't find many black Jamaican kids being home-schooled or in independent schools but similarly, you won't find many white working class kids doing so either.
That's because a large swathe of the white working class view schools primarily as an institution for social purposes over academic purposes and as a state run childminder service for 36 weeks of the year.
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Arran90
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My local home education group has a theory why black Jamaican families who home educate are extremely rare, but I'm not confident that it is completely true and there may be some conflation between factors applicable to black Jamaicans in Britain and black Americans in the US.

(Original post by hendyrix)
We are not commonly found in independent schools for one general reason being a lack of financial resources. In Jamaica and for Jamaican families in the UK, going to an independent school is quite prestigious within our culture, therefore we obviously would if we were economically able, however more often than not we can't as the majority of our parents work in lower paid primary and secondary-sector occupations.
There are questions of whether black Jamaican families in Britain would choose to send their children to independent schools if they could afford to or whether there are other prohibitive factors - such as children not fitting in culturally or reluctant to put in the effort to maintain the required academic standards?

The situation where some poorer Muslim south Asian families choose to home educate their children whilst it's very rare for well-off non-Muslim south Asian families to home educate their children, shines some light on the issue of whether financial status really is a prominent factor or not.

Although non-Muslim south Asian families very rarely home educate, they are very keen on sending their children to secular or mildly Christian independent schools if they can afford it. They value academics. In more recent years Sikh and Hindu schools have appeared although time will tell how popular they are.

Muslim parents are also keen on sending their children to Islamic independent schools although it's often more for religious reasons rather than academic reasons.
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Happybird90
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Does it matter?
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Arran90
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(Original post by Happybird90)
Does it matter?
I'm intrigued to know.

The black Jamaican community (superficially) appears to be one that doesn't have much interest in and enthusiasm for chasing lots of A* or 9 grades.
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Arran90
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Last year I wrote:

Also, why do black Jamaican boys overwhelmingly gravitate towards sports and music at school but dislike STEM subjects?

https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/sho...php?p=80077548

There is that old chestnut that the history curriculum is biased and covers too much 'white' history and not enough 'black' history, but that isn't a reason for so many black Jamaican children underperforming in STEM subjects whilst Asian children generally do better than black Jamaicans and in many cases surpass white British children at the same school.

https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/sho...php?p=80078076

There is definitely some evidence that south Asian children have a tendency to drop history when it comes to taking GCSE options, and the situation could be more acute amongst Muslims than non-Muslims. The reasons behind this are unknown and poorly researched. Is because of the content of the history course does not appeal to south Asian children? Is it because history is considered a weak / useless / irrelevant GCSE subject for future careers? Is it because history is an essay based subject and a large proportion of south Asian children struggle with essay based subjects or find them to be more difficult than non-essay based subjects?

I'm not aware of any home educated south Asian children (mostly Muslim) who have taken a history GCSE although there is definitely more interest in and demand for the subject amongst white indigenous British home educated children.

South Asian children definitely study south Asian and Islamic history in their own time outside of school. Do black Jamaican children study 'black' history in their own time outside of school or do they instead demand that it's implemented in school classrooms via Black History Month etc.?
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Trotsky's Iceaxe
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Only 0.5% of children are homeschooled in the UK. Therefore, Regardless of ethnicity, parents almost never home educate. I believe the only exception are Roma/travellers.
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Arran90
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(Original post by Trotsky's Iceaxe)
Only 0.5% of children are homeschooled in the UK. Therefore, Regardless of ethnicity, parents almost never home educate. I believe the only exception are Roma/travellers.
The exact figures are unknown as parents do not have to register home educated children. Any 'official' figures are the numbers known by local authorities.

I'm convinced that you are ideologically opposed to home education unless you convince me otherwise.
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username2923348
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(Original post by Arran90)
I have been involved in the home education community for many years, and I have noticed that there are almost no black Jamaican families who home educate their children. What is the reason behind this?

I do not believe that it is primarily the result of financial status but some deeper seated cultural issues play a large part in the decision of almost every black Jamaican parent to send their children to state schools.

Black Jamaican children are also uncommon / underrepresented in independent schools (in comparison to south Asian children and even black African children). There also appears to be no public demand for black only schools with black teachers and in some cases a different curriculum from state schools.
I went to a school that had 56% Carribbean/Jamaican, 34% African. 8% Asian and 2% White. What areas are you looking at?
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Arran90
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(Original post by TheRealSquiddy)
I went to a school that had 56% Carribbean/Jamaican, 34% African. 8% Asian and 2% White. What areas are you looking at?
Was that an independent school or a state school?
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Trotsky's Iceaxe
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(Original post by Arran90)
The exact figures are unknown as parents do not have to register home educated children. Any 'official' figures are the numbers known by local authorities.
If the numbers are not known, how can you possibly claim that black Jamaican families almost never home educate? You seem to be making this assumption based on your anecdotal experience.

As anyone who has a certain level of education knows, anecdotal evidence is pretty much worthless. Yet You are using your own anecdotes to make sweeping conclusions.

I'm convinced that you are ideologically opposed to home education unless you convince me otherwise.
I have not offered an opinion on the merits of home schooling. Can you explain how you have concluded I’m ideologically opposed to home education?
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Arran90
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(Original post by Trotsky's Iceaxe)
If the numbers are not known, how can you possibly claim that black Jamaican families almost never home educate? You seem to be making this assumption based on your anecdotal experience.
It's called long term experience of involvement in the home education movement combined with enquiries with other home educating parents and activists.

Black Jamaican and non-Muslim Asian home educating families are as rare as hen's teeth as they rarely turn up and hardly any other home educating parents and activists seem to know any. Even the few black Jamaican and non-Muslim Asian home educating families which have been encountered over the years say exactly the same things.

Chinese home educating families are also rare but it is a much smaller ethnic group to start with and more spread out than most other ethnic groups. There is some evidence that a high proportion of home educated Chinese children are child prodigies.
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username2923348
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(Original post by Arran90)
Was that an independent school or a state school?
Independent
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