How do we write a contract for my fiance's aunt?

So it's not like a proper contract or anything. There's no money involved and we probably won't make her sign anything, it's more like rules. Not trolling, she's just crazy.

Context: I've made a post about this before, linked below:
https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?p=83204514

The short version is I'm 7 months pregnant and my fiance's aunt keeps trying to make decisions related to my pregnancy without me and my fiance being involved.

This has ranged from cancelling our order of baby stuff because it was a mix of boy, girl and neutral clothing and our baby is a boy, to rescheduling my afternoon mock exam because I had a checkup that morning despite me telling her not to, to chucking my hot chocolate in the bin because she thought it was coffee. She's even visited nurseries on our behalf and then given us a list of her top 3, without us even seeing them, and got offended when we said we'd like to take a look for ourselves ("are you saying you don't trust my opinion?"). She also has a tendency to show up at our flat unannounced when we ignore her calls/texts. Even the grandparents of this baby aren't as involved as this aunt is trying to be.

Lately, it's gotten worse. Last week we found out she tried (again) to get herself listed as my birthing partner (meaning that fiance wouldn't be allowed in the delivery room), and when we talked to her about it she said it was important that she was in the child's life from the start as she intended to be a "constant", like she, as the great aunt, would be my son's only hope for consistency and not myself and his father.

She is already planning all the days out she'll take him on, talking about seeing his first steps, school plays, the list goes on. She has children of her own, 5 of them. Fiance's cousins are remarkably well adjusted. The oldest is in her late 20s and the youngest is either 17 or 18.

We've talked to and yelled at her, both separately and together, to stay out of it. It's like talking to a brick wall. Everything we say goes in one ear, out the other. She retains nothing. When we confront her about something we've already spoken to her about before she insists she's never heard us mention this. We talked to her husband and he called it "empty nest syndrome" but all 3 of us agree it's no excuse.

Me and my fiance have a mutual friend. When we complained to him about it he suggested we draw up a contract. Some means of establishing boundaries with the aunt and getting her to stick to them without treating her like a child.

The friend said we should set rules, and we have some initial ideas:
she needs to call ahead, not just show up
once the baby is born she needs to go through us to see him
she doesn't get a say in anything baby related - we decide the name, the nursery, we sort out baby stuff, ect
if (god forbid) something does happen to us the baby goes to my fiance's brother
and some sort of clause that says if she keeps ignoring our wishes then we'll restrict or altogether prevent her involvement in our son's life.

We think it's a good idea but we are also aware that this could easily go very bad very fast. We don't want to treat her like a child, especially as she was a very important presence in my fiance's life growing up, but this is absurd and we need to set some boundaries in a way that we know she will stick to them.


TL;DR: Fiance's aunt is weirdly invested in my pregnancy/our baby and we're considering drafting a written set of rules that she has to follow in order to have continued contact with the baby.

Is this a bad idea? If it's not a bad idea then how would we go about it?

You need to put your foot down.

You don’t need to create a contract for this, just lay down the rules your friend has suggested and if she decides to ignore them cut her out of everything. Make sure this is clearly explained to her, that she’s overstepping the line and she needs to rein her behaviour in if she wants any involvement in your child’s life.

Also, make sure your midwife is aware of her meddling, while your partners aunt shouldn’t be able to change things related to your birthing plan (medical confidentiality and all that), it’d be worthwhile just giving her a heads up.

There is something seriously wrong with this aunt.
I think her behaviour has gone too far and got way too creepy for a written list of rules.
She needs to be kept a safe distance away from you while you are pregnant and from the baby while he is young.
I wouldn't feel comfortable leaving her alone with the baby or trusting her with any access to him.
Maybe send her husband a baby photo.
If she is lonely with all her children grown up, someone can get her a cat or a puppy.

Omg I feel like I'm reading a script for a new TV drama.
This is actual madness. No idea what to suggest. It sounds like there's nothing she wouldn't do to be in that baby's life. Stay safe, ok?

Good luck xx

Both me and fiance have just finished our studies at this uni. We're pending results but he's been working at a first all year and I'm a high 2:i/low first. He's already had job offers from 4 different places, 2 local and 2 in different parts of the country. I want to teach so I can work anywhere, and I've still not finished applying to postgrad courses (most places I've looked into have an end of June or July deadline) so we are actually seriously considering moving away and not telling her where we're going. One of the places he's had a job offer from is a 20 minute train ride from one of the unis I was considering for postgrad. While we didn't plan on moving away after graduation, the whole situation feels too much like a psychological thriller/horror movie/TV drama. The kind with an advert that has a kid singing a nursery rhyme in a creepy voice. But he does still want his aunt in his life and it would suck to move away from both our families, plus it feels a bit drastic. But then again she is really freaking us out. Maybe this is just my maternal instinct revving it's engine here but I'd be quite happy if she had the same relationship with my son that my aunts had with me and my cousins: seeing each other at a family reunion/wedding/funeral every few years and getting updates from facebook.

Thanks x

dunno, its kind of a catch 22. on one hand it absolutely pisses me off when i hear about overbearing in-laws or grandparents or anyone who gets too overly involved in your life

but then on the other hand i always take my mothers advice when she says that raising children is BLOOMING HARD and that its only after they are born that you appreciate having people in your life willing to help you raise your kids so i say use her to your full advantage and let her babysit on the days you need her to. but of course keep a close eye on her and never fail to remind her that this is your baby and not hers. and she can try and throw whatever crap she wants at you but at the end of the day, no matter how involved she is in your babys life this baby will never legally be hers. so like i said, use her lol. she'll never have any full control over your kid. she is merely a FREE nanny. enjoy it

I think a lot of people in your position would feel the way you are. Personally, I don't think it's too drastic to move away.

Hey, you have to do what feels right in YOUR gut. You're the woman carrying life. A soon to be mother, and if this carries over to when you're holding your child in your arms, can you imagine how much worse it could get? Yes. It could literally become a psychological drama-type plot, with intense and dangerous characters. It might not, but there's that possibility.

Disregard your partner's opinions for a moment, because if he really still wants his aunt in his life to this degree, even when she's blatantly causing so much trouble...well, you have an issue there. Have a really calm, thought out discussion with him that it's not just "bothering" you anymore, it's causing you emotional harm. If he cares for you + your son's wellbeing he will fully support the move. It doesn't have to be a permanent move, and he doesn't have to shut his aunt out completely from his life. You guys could just tell everyone you need some space to become the family you want to be.

Put it this way; imagine you're not pregnant and you're just a woman who's getting harrassment from your boyfriend's aunt, to the ridiculous point it's mentally distressing and severely affecting your studies. Aren't you in your rights to cut her off completely, or maturely discuss it with your boyfriend until he sees the logic?

I know I said I don't know what to suggest...but I suggest one thing and that is

WOMAN LOOK AFTER YOUR SOUL, YOUR HEART, AND DO EVERYTHING YOU CAN TO ENSURE LOVE FOR YOUR CHILD AND FUTURE FAMILY CAN SAFELY BLOOM.

Sending love. The caps lock was for dramatic effect.

So right before I read this I showed fiance where this post is at right now. He helped me write the first post but he hasn't followed the thread. When he read it back, and he read replies from people who are unbiased and outside of the situation, I think it really hit him how she's acted. He actually cried while reading it. He then asked me what I wanted to do, and maybe it's the baby brains but I said "one last chance. That's it." He nodded, told me that was more than fair, said to me he was going to talk to her again, to give her our list verbally, and threaten to cut her out of his life. He also said that if I truly felt unsafe, then he was willing to move away, regardless of chances, and told me that he was willing to do whatever to keep our child safe and help me feel secure.

So, if she does anything at all then that's it, she's gone. He even mentioned a restraining order. If I feel unsafe around her and she continues to do stuff like this, then we're moving. Our preferred city is about 7 hours away driving and she has no clue we were even looking there. It's absurd that this is what we feel we need to do in order for the three of us to feel safe around someone who was so kind to us previously, but we're verging into stalker territory here. I like where we live now, and I'm happy with our lives, but if staying means that I'm always looking over my shoulder then my fiance is willing to do whatever it takes for me to feel safe.

So right before I read this I showed fiance where this post is at right now. He helped me write the first post but he hasn't followed the thread. When he read it back, and he read replies from people who are unbiased and outside of the situation, I think it really hit him how she's acted. He actually cried while reading it. He then asked me what I wanted to do, and maybe it's the baby brains but I said "one last chance. That's it." He nodded, told me that was more than fair, said to me he was going to talk to her again, to give her our list verbally, and threaten to cut her out of his life. He also said that if I truly felt unsafe, then he was willing to move away, regardless of chances, and told me that he was willing to do whatever to keep our child safe and help me feel secure.

So, if she does anything at all then that's it, she's gone. He even mentioned a restraining order. If I feel unsafe around her and she continues to do stuff like this, then we're moving. Our preferred city is about 7 hours away driving and she has no clue we were even looking there. It's absurd that this is what we feel we need to do in order for the three of us to feel safe around someone who was so kind to us previously, but we're verging into stalker territory here. I like where we live now, and I'm happy with our lives, but if staying means that I'm always looking over my shoulder then my fiance is willing to do whatever it takes for me to feel safe.

I’ve only just seen your reply to me and caught up with the thread now, but this is a sensible approach to take. Her behaviour is beyond “empty nest syndrome” and is very much into stalker territory.

You go, girl! Be safe and look after yourselves <3

So he talked to her. When he got there, he rang me. He said he knows how she can twist words and asked if I wanted to hear this. I said sure.

He went in there, and laid down the law. He said "this is how it's going to be, here are the rules [insert list of rules]. Everyone else in our lives follows these rules. They're also known as boundaries. If you don't follow them then you don't get to be in our lives, it's that simple." The rules involved not just turning up at our flat, returning her spare key , generally staying out of our pregnancy. He made it clear that when it comes to the baby, we are the bosses, we make the decisions, and if we want to cut contact with her, then the baby also cuts contact. He also said that if something does happen to us then the baby goes to my sister. I was really proud of him, I know it's not easy to stand up to his aunt, and I'd have happily gone with him but he said he felt this was something he had to deal with. He said the choice to deal with her by himself was a mix of him knowing that she's his family and therefore his problem, and the fact that I'm 7 months pregnant. Honestly, I'd have loved the chance to tell her off, but I think standing up to her one on one was good for him. And from what I heard he was very firm and really didn't give her the room to talk him out of it.

I thought it was all over.

And then she scoffed and said "don't be ridiculous, we're family, we don't need rules".

He got out of there. He said one final "respect our boundaries or stay out of our lives".



He came home and we are currently researching the location of one of his far away job offers. He actually really liked this job when he interviewed, and they made clear that they wanted to hire him. It had the best pay rate of all four and he got on great with the manager, but he wasn't going to take it before because of the baby and the fact that he'd have to move away, but now we want to move so it's a godsend. It's looking like this is where we're heading.

The aunt doesn't know anything about it. We're going to get everything sorted now - finalise the job, sort out my postgrad, set up somewhere to live - and while we're staying in this current town until the baby is born, me and fiance are going up to our front-runner town soon and organising all of this on that end. We've booked a hotel for all of next week, and for the same amount of time again 3 weeks from now (so a week there, a week here, a week there again). We're going to get everything sorted as soon as humanly possible, as because I'm 7 months along, the window of time in which I can safely travel is getting closer and closer to closing. We'll be driving so it's a lot safer than, say, flying there, but it does still get a bit dicey the further along I am.

Fiance has already rung the job in the front-runner town and explained about having to move up there after graduation and the baby on the way and they were actually really good about it. His start date was meant to be in August and he explained that while he would love to work for them, the baby is due in August and graduation is in July, so it's going to be tricky for him to move up there and start work with the baby and graduation both coming soon. His soon to be manager said that he might have to go in some days between now and September or get brought up to speed online but if he's willing to do that and hit the ground running a bit then they're willing to let him take paternity leave on his August start date to allow us time to move and adjust to the baby, which is more than we hoped for, to be honest. We were expecting them to flat out retract their job offer, or reduce his pay, or tell him that if he didn't start like normal on the August date then he could forget it, but I guess they really liked him.

I'm not going to be able to tour any uni campuses but the two unis nearest to this job both have an online tour which is close enough. I meet the requirements for both (I have a 2:i and one wants a 2:i while the other wants a 2:ii) and if there are interviews the websites for both unis say they can do these interviews online or over the phone.

We've also rung a couple of estate agents and done some preliminary research on rightmove. It looks like we could afford a house. Nothing huge, probably renting a 1 bed, 1 bath or a small bungalow, but we might even get a garden. We've already arranged to look around a couple in person next week, when we go.

So the timeline now looks like:
Next two weeks - (majority of the) postgraduate course deadlines
(next week and) July - visiting this town we're moving to, finalising where we'll be living, fiance stopping by his workplace to get anything he needs and meet everyone, me going to my unis if they need me to
Early to mid August - baby due (actual due date is 10th of August but allowing for being early/late)
Late August - moving out of old flat/getting new flat set up. Nursery is going to be the first thing we get sorted, then a second trip for the smaller things eg books and kitchen stuff and then a third and final trip for the larger things eg the bed and sofa. Fiance is going to have to do the bulk of the heavy lifting but we have some friends and relatives who hate this aunt willing to help us out and sworn to secrecy.
September - fiance's work properly starts (by properly I mean he has to go in person to the office from 9-5, 5 days a week rather than working from home/keeping up online)
October - my course starts. Of the courses I'm looking at, the one that wanted a 2:i is probably my favourite. This course offers part or full time and I emailed them late last night asking about transitioning from full to part time, and vice versa, and they responded that lots of parents and carers do that and if I needed to do that, so long as I told them early on in the term (within the first month) they could sort it out for me easily.

It's going to be awful. No way of sugarcoating it. The next few months are going to consist of us deconstructing the life we've begun to build in this town and rebuilding it hours away with a baby in tow. It's absurd that these are the lengths we have to go to in order to feel safe and give our baby the best life possible. Fiance is actually excited about this. He liked this job better, and he's happy he gets to do it, and I'm happy for him, but the way it happened isn't exactly what either of us were hoping for.

I was just wondering if she has a history of this kind of behaviour. Could you not talk to her children and ask them to speak to her. Surely a lot of this problem could be solved by a) changing the locks on your house b) cutting off all contact c) changing your email and blocking her on your phones. She cannot interfere when she knows nothing. This will be a difficult time for you and you need your own family around you.

Fiance says she's always gotten weird around babies - not this level, but she's always the first to offer to look after someone else's kids and her actual kids joke that when she babysits their kids she's reluctant to give them back, she is quick to dismiss the doctor's advice in favour of whatever she thinks is best, and she encourages home births (she did this with me early on and I put my foot down) and always insists on being present when the actual birth happens (sometimes she succeeds and of I think 4 grandkids she witnessed the birth of 3) - the general consensus from fiance's family is that she's always been a bit weird about it, but this is like her normal weird and then some. Tis

Some people who know everyone involved think it's because I'm not her daughter and fiance is her nephew, not her son, so she maybe feels like she needs to be more involved than normal to make up for the fact the baby is a more distant relation, and some people (including her husband) think it's "empty nest syndrome" as when the 4 grandkids were born she had at least 1 of her children still living with her so this is the first baby born into this whole extended family at a time that she does not have children living in her house.

4 out of 5 of her children, throughout this pregnancy, have contacted fiance with some version of "congrats on the kid but you set mum off, please deal with her". We messaged her oldest daughter earlier, who currently has a 9 month old, and gave her the highlights, and she replied about 20 minutes ago that she totally understood where we were coming from, and said that she was glad she lived in a different county to this aunt because when she met her granddaughter she seemed really strangely attached, and said the same thing she did to us about being a "constant" and talked to her about a will leaving the baby to her, too. She said "the best thing you can do for squish is remove all 3 of you from the situation" (squish is what my fiance is calling the baby).

The brother we were initially considering making our child's secondary guardian told us at one point that she'd called him with her side of the story (in which I am an evil witch who tricked fiance into knocking me up and am trying to steal him away from his family) and to my face he said he knew it was fake but when he left later my fiance told me that the brother had made a couple of jokes to him when I was out of the room that implied he believed the aunt's side of things.

We have tried ignoring her calls/emails/texts and blocking her, and then she comes over in person. Plus in my original thread I mentioned that she was my lecturer before all this, which means that I have to at the very least see her when we graduate next month. She was also providing me a reference, but I think I'll be going to someone else for that. She knows where I work in town and has come in during shifts, same with him, and she knows which two local companies offered fiance jobs, and we could see her ringing them and asking for him, which could really screw things up with his job.

Fiance's sister actually lives about an hour away from this other town, I have an aunt, uncle and cousin who are also about an hour away, and we have some friends in the general area, although none of them would be as close as my mother and his aunt are to us right now. So wouldn't be totally alone but there would be considerably fewer family members nearby, although he has always had a complex relationship with basically his whole family, with him being close to this aunt more than anyone else, and this hasn't really helped that. I'm close to a few members of my immediate family but that's about it and they all think we should move. His cousin also said that being away from the aunt has definitely helped.

And honestly this town isn't a great place to raise a kid. The uni is fine, and the college, but the primary and secondary schools aren't great, and the other place we're looking into has some really great schools at all levels. Plus all we can really afford here is a flat in a tower block, but if we moved further north, where house prices tend to be lower, we could look into bungalows or small houses.

Having said all this, we do like our life here, and we agree that moving cross country when I'm 7 months along is probably a bad idea. The last thing we want to be doing is setting up a living space when I'm either due any day or we already have a newborn. As always, we need better timing. If I'd already had the baby, or if he didn't have the job offer, or if I wasn't applying to postgrad at this time, then we'd hold off and see what happens. We still have a couple of weeks to decide what we're doing, I haven't even finished my application yet, and his jobs have all said he can take time to think it over. Right now we're not dead set on moving, but we do need to figure out how we could go about it if we decide we should.

Fiance says she's always gotten weird around babies - not this level, but she's always the first to offer to look after someone else's kids and her actual kids joke that when she babysits their kids she's reluctant to give them back, she is quick to dismiss the doctor's advice in favour of whatever she thinks is best, and she encourages home births (she did this with me early on and I put my foot down) and always insists on being present when the actual birth happens (sometimes she succeeds and of I think 4 grandkids she witnessed the birth of 3) - the general consensus from fiance's family is that she's always been a bit weird about it, but this is like her normal weird and then some.

Some people who know everyone involved think it's because I'm not her daughter and fiance is her nephew, not her son, so she maybe feels like she needs to be more involved than normal to make up for the fact the baby is a more distant relation, and some people (including her husband) think it's "empty nest syndrome" as when the 4 grandkids were born she had at least 1 of her children still living with her so this is the first baby born into this whole extended family at a time that she does not have children living in her house.

4 out of 5 of her children, throughout this pregnancy, have contacted fiance with some version of "congrats on the kid but you set mum off, please deal with her". We messaged her oldest daughter earlier, who currently has a 9 month old, and gave her the highlights, and she replied about 20 minutes ago that she totally understood where we were coming from, and said that she was glad she lived in a different county to this aunt because when she met her granddaughter she seemed really strangely attached, and said the same thing she did to us about being a "constant" and talked to her about a will leaving the baby to her, too. She said "the best thing you can do for squish is remove all 3 of you from the situation" (squish is what my fiance is calling the baby).

The brother we were initially considering making our child's secondary guardian told us at one point that she'd called him with her side of the story (in which I am an evil witch who tricked fiance into knocking me up and am trying to steal him away from his family) and to my face he said he knew it was fake but when he left later my fiance told me that the brother had made a couple of jokes to him when I was out of the room that implied he believed the aunt's side of things.

We have tried ignoring her calls/emails/texts and blocking her, and then she comes over in person. Plus in my original thread I mentioned that she was my lecturer before all this, which means that I have to at the very least see her when we graduate next month. She was also providing me a reference, but I think I'll be going to someone else for that. She knows where I work in town and has come in during shifts, same with him, and she knows which two local companies offered fiance jobs, and we could see her ringing them and asking for him, which could really screw things up with his job.

Fiance's sister actually lives about an hour away from this other town, I have an aunt, uncle and cousin who are also about an hour away, and we have some friends in the general area, although none of them would be as close as my mother and his aunt are to us right now. So wouldn't be totally alone but there would be considerably fewer family members nearby, although he has always had a complex relationship with basically his whole family, with him being close to this aunt more than anyone else, and this hasn't really helped that. I'm close to a few members of my immediate family but that's about it and they all think we should move. His cousin also said that being away from the aunt has definitely helped.

And honestly this town isn't a great place to raise a kid. The uni is fine, and the college, but the primary and secondary schools aren't great, and the other place we're looking into has some really great schools at all levels. Plus all we can really afford here is a flat in a tower block, but if we moved further north, where house prices tend to be lower, we could look into bungalows or small houses.

Having said all this, we do like our life here, and we agree that moving cross country when I'm 7 months along is probably a bad idea. The last thing we want to be doing is setting up a living space when I'm either due any day or we already have a newborn. As always, we need better timing. If I'd already had the baby, or if he didn't have the job offer, or if I wasn't applying to postgrad at this time, then we'd hold off and see what happens. We still have a couple of weeks to decide what we're doing, I haven't even finished my application yet, and his jobs have all said he can take time to think it over. Right now we're not dead set on moving, but we do need to figure out how we could go about it if we decide we should.