Iran Shoots Down RQ-4 BAMS-D $150m Drone near Persian Gulf Watch

Tempest II
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#21
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#21
(Original post by ANM775)
US shouldn't be spying in it's territory [or on it borders] then

imagine you opened your curtains one day and saw a pepping tom by your window with a camera taking photos. say you threw cold water over him ruining his camera.

that's basically what iran has done
Everyone spies on everyone. If the aircraft was in international airspace then it's legal. What do you think the Russians are doing to the UK when they send over their Bears and Blackjacks to probe UK airspace? We haven't shot them down.
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Palmyra
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#22
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Well we already know that you see things through star-spangled-banner tinted glasses!

Why were the transponders turned off when this $150m beast was flying so close to Iranian airspace (even by the US's own admission)?
(Original post by Tempest II)
From what I see
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Palmyra
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(Original post by Tempest II)
Everyone spies on everyone. If the aircraft was in international airspace then it's legal. What do you think the Russians are doing to the UK when they send over their Bears and Blackjacks to probe UK airspace? We haven't shot them down.
Do they turn their transponders off and come within 5 nautical miles of UK airspace (by their own admission, Iran clearly stated the RQ-4 had violated Iranian airspace, which wouldn't be the first time a US drone had done so)?
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mmonk
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Can you please explain what is meant by constant attacks from israel?
and why iran is at risk from israel?
i am really confused by the whole situation to be honest

(Original post by rimstone)
TBH i want IRAN to have Nukes now, the iatola stopped the Nuke program in the 80's ( which was started before the revoltuon but the american backed sha ) as they thought WMD were agaisnt humanity and an abomination to god amougnt other things. Now after consant attacks from isreal and america, i think its time for them to make one ( fyi they are miles off, they need 90% rich UR and have 3% at best ) , otherwise IRAN is clearly at risk from not only isreal, S.A but also america.
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StriderHort
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Meh, flying a US drone ANYWHERE near Iran is basically extreme provocation right now, total lack of surprise it was supposedly blasted.
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BlueIndigoViolet
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(Original post by Palmyra)
Well we already know that you see things through star-spangled-banner tinted glasses!

Why were the transponders turned off when this $150m beast was flying so close to Iranian airspace (even by the US's own admission)?




serious note : European powers will have to reinstate sanctions if they continue production, Iran should not be allowed to develop nuclear weapons under any circumstances
Last edited by BlueIndigoViolet; 4 weeks ago
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Palmyra
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This is not the best thread to ask such questions because you are asking questions that will beget political answers.
(Original post by mmonk)
Can you please explain what is meant by constant attacks from israel?
and why iran is at risk from israel?
i am really confused by the whole situation to be honest
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Tempest II
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(Original post by Palmyra)
Well we already know that you see things through star-spangled-banner tinted glasses!

Why were the transponders turned off when this $150m beast was flying so close to Iranian airspace (even by the US's own admission)?
And it you're a moron who believes anything the Syrian regime and Iran says is gospel. It's actually rather amusing seeing how wrong you are. Keep it up old chap.

Transponders are necessary to deconflict with civilian air traffic and military aircraft can operate without them. If the RQ-4 was flying well above any airliners the then it wouldn't need it on. A transponder broadcasting makes it easier for the aircraft to be targeted. That said, I haven't actually read anywhere that the transponder was off.

From what the BBC report says, the USN are enroute and to pick up the debris from international waters; Iran could be in a pickle if the US gets the debris and they get none as it'll confirm that the aircraft wasn't over their land territory as they're claimed, depending on winds and debris patterns caused by the shoot down anyway.
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Palmyra
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(Original post by StriderHort)
Meh, flying a US drone ANYWHERE near Iran is basically extreme provocation right now, total lack of surprise it was supposedly blasted.
By the US's own admission the $200m drone was <10km from Iran's airspace.

The drone had its transponders turned off, which is very dangerous and breaches norms of flying in international airspace. This suggests it had a covert military function and thus it was perfectly justified for Iran to eliminate the threat.
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Tempest II
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(Original post by Palmyra)
Do they turn their transponders off and come within 5 nautical miles of UK airspace (by their own admission, Iran clearly stated the RQ-4 had violated Iranian airspace, which wouldn't be the first time a US drone had done so)?
Yes.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-31049952
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Palmyra
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(Original post by Tempest II)
Transponders are necessary to deconflict with civilian air traffic and military aircraft can operate without them. If the RQ-4 was flying well above any airliners the then it wouldn't need it on. A transponder broadcasting makes it easier for the aircraft to be targeted. That said, I haven't actually read anywhere that the transponder was off.

From what the BBC report says, the USN are enroute and to pick up the debris from international waters; Iran could be in a pickle if the US gets the debris and they get none as it'll confirm that the aircraft wasn't over their land territory as they're claimed, depending on winds and debris patterns caused by the shoot down anyway.
If it was actually operating at such high altitudes then that's even more embarrassing for the US that it was shot down by Iran! Iran stated the transponders were not activated and the US did not refute it - so no reason to believe otherwise.

Wouldn't prove anything if the wreckage landed in international waters because of winds and other factors that commonly spread debris far from the impact location, but Iran beat the US to the unexploded mine a few days ago so let's see if Iran can win this race too.
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Drewski
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#32
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(Original post by Palmyra)
The drone had its transponders turned off, which is very dangerous
No it isn't
and breaches norms of flying in international airspace
No it doesn't
This suggests it had a covert military function and thus it was perfectly justified for Iran to eliminate the threat.
No it wasn't
Bold

Source: I'm ex-RAF.
Last edited by Drewski; 4 weeks ago
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Palmyra
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#33
You want to be safe to fly in 'international airspace' then act like you are flying in international airspace. If not, risk getting your $250m drone shot out of the sky. US made decision, hopefully it learns from this mistake (not likely given the continuous pattern of US aggression and violation of airspace via drones from the ScanEagle to the RQ-170 to now the RQ-4).
(Original post by Drewski)
Bold
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mmonk
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i dont mind political answers
(Original post by Palmyra)
This is not the best thread to ask such questions because you are asking questions that will beget political answers.
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Palmyra
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I do - this thread is not to discuss such political issues which only lead to a flame war and de-railing. You can PM me if you have any questions or start your own thread with those questions for more range of opinions. Thanks.
(Original post by mmonk)
i dont mind political answers
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mmonk
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OK, Sure was just hoping someone would be able to provide some factual evidence supporting the claims made in that post,
i guess this is too big of a request for some tsr members?

(Original post by Palmyra)
I do - this thread is not to discuss such political issues which only lead to a flame war and de-railing. You can PM me if you have any questions or start your own thread with those questions for more range of opinions. Thanks.
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Prussianxo
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The US trying to provoke another country into conflict. They would never do such a thing.

*thinks back to all the wars America has had since 1945*
ah
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Palmyra
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#38
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That says 25 miles. If it's talking about nautical miles that's almost 50km. If not, that's 40km. Not quite the same as 5km (which, again, is what the US claimed, Iran disputes this). Unfortunately, it's almost impossible to verify how close exactly the drone got to Iranian airspace so all we have to rely on are US and Iranian sources.

The US, which famously said it didn't lose a RQ-170 drone... Until Iran showed it to the world then the US begged for Iran to return it. Even when this incident was first reported by Iranian news the US refuted it for 7 hours until they finally admitted that Iran had shot down a US RQ-4 BAMS-D. Healthy dose of scepticism seems warranted.
Last edited by Palmyra; 4 weeks ago
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Drewski
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#39
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(Original post by Palmyra)
That says 25 miles. If it's talking about nautical miles that's almost 50km. If not, that's 40km. Not quite the same as 5km (which, again, is what the US claimed, Iran disputes this). Unfortunately, it's almost impossible to verify how close exactly the drone got to Iranian airspace so all we have to rely on are US and Iranian sources.

The US, which famously said it didn't lose a RQ-170 drone... Until Iran showed it to the world then the US begged for Iran to return it. Even when this incident was first reported by Iranian news the US refuted it for 7 hours until they finally admitted that Iran had shot down a US RQ-4 BAMS-D. Healthy dose of scepticism seems warranted.
Given that modern commercial GPS can get a fix accurate to less than a metre, 5km is still at ****ing long way.

Neither side in this can be trusted fully. Stop acting like one is gospel.
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Palmyra
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(Original post by Drewski)
Given that modern commercial GPS can get a fix accurate to less than a metre, 5km is still at ****ing long way.

Neither side in this can be trusted fully. Stop acting like one is gospel.
GPS can also be spoofed, as the US discovered with the RQ-170. Iran also revealed it had hacked into the US's drone command centre in Iraq a few years ago and (possibly) took control of some US drones:



But I agree that we should be sceptical of the claims of both sides.
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