UK tax system Watch

Quady
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#61
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#61
(Original post by gamey21)
How is it fair that my friend on a 14.4k salary hardly gets taxed. Im on a 21k salary and i get taxed much more.

He earns 14.4k before tax, after tax goes home annually with 13.3k. Work hours 35 per week. Mon-Fri 8.30am-3.30pm

I earn 21k before tax, after tax I get 17.5k per year. Work hours 40 per week.
9.30am-5.30pm. Mon- Fri

I put in more hours, earn more but i’d rather have less hours earn less due to this tax system. In hindsight this 3-4k extra doesn’t seem like much at all. He gets to save more because he lives with his family. Most my money goes towards rent, bill, food expenses, helping my family out. All of which are not his circumstances. Last year he managed to save 9k from his salary, I could just about save 6.5k I know i’m complaining but It’s unfair, the tax system needs to be re-evaluated and people should be taxed due to their circumstance not their salary.
I take it that since you earn significantly less than the average salary you advocate paying more tax?

Then folk like me on £68k taking home £41k can pay much less tax.....

I reckon you'd end up on £12k take home and I'd be on £59k. Much fairer. Good idea.
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Quady
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#62
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(Original post by Bang Outta Order)
Lol what part do you not get?

If someone made 100 quid, you take 10%, they're left with 90. Even less.

But if someone makes 10000, they still have 9000 left after 10% off. How is that right? It's not so much that you're paying MORE, it's that they're paying LESS. if you think of it that way, how can anyone with a brain and a heart still be angry? :nah:
Tbh, I think a majority of people would vote for a 10% flat tax.
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RogerOxon
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#63
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(Original post by Bang Outta Order)
Lol what part do you not get?

If someone made 100 quid, you take 10%, they're left with 90. Even less.

But if someone makes 10000, they still have 9000 left after 10% off. How is that right? It's not so much that you're paying MORE, it's that they're paying LESS. if you think of it that way, how can anyone with a brain and a heart still be angry? :nah:
If you put in the effort to earn more, should a larger proportion be taken from you? There needs to be an incentive to work harder.
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winterscoming
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#64
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#64
(Original post by Quady)
Tbh, I think a majority of people would vote for a 10% flat tax.
Why would people who are on low wages and pay little or no tax (due to the personal allowance) suddenly vote for paying 10% tax instead? A change like that would only really have a noticable benefit for people on higher salaries; seems very unlikely that many people would vote for it.
Last edited by winterscoming; 1 week ago
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RogerOxon
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#65
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(Original post by winterscoming)
Why would people who are on low wages and pay little or no tax (due to the personal allowance) suddenly vote for paying 10% tax instead? A change like that would only really have a noticable benefit for people on higher salaries; seems very unlikely that many people would vote for it.
They wouldn't. There would need to be a personal allowance still, and it'd be much more than 10%. Lower tax rates have been known to raise tax revenue.
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Last edited by RogerOxon; 1 week ago
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Mike172
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#66
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#66
(Original post by Burton Bridge)
Well I think you might wish to visit a few private schools, and mix with some wealthy people, belive me not are all as bright as their incomes would have you believe, and it is absolutely not uncommon for middle of the road private educated children to wish and be successful to become doctors, I can tell assure you this first hand.

Fasism well you have me there, the problem with the 'isms' is they are based on opinions.

Questions

Therefore why should you not pay proportionately more than those that is struggling to makes ends meat?

why should those who did not share your fortune but make huge contributions to society be left in poverty just to give those with an abundance of money in more to stash anyway in off shore bank accounts?

Why should we allow those unable to work suffer?

Why should those more able not support their fellow country men?

By the way plenty of people in a worked in a factory a cigarette factory close to me were on very very high salaries also train drivers are two low skilled workers on high salaries off the top of my head.

Anyway I'm off out now. Speak later
1. Because it’s not my job to. Even if we had a flat rate tax system, as I would like, I’d still be paying much more than a lower earner. That’s how percentages work...

2. Because they, apparently, took on lower paid work on their own free will. No one is forced to undertake poorly paid positions.

3. We shouldn’t. I’ve never suggested we should. For me this whole argument is about how I have to pay 40% tax on some of my earning whilst others pay half that on theirs.

4. No idea why you’re talking about “fellow countrymen”. I work to pay myself through life, no one else. Would you exclude foreigners who live, work and pay tax in the UK based on your question?

Train drivers are paid well because it is a job that carries a high level of responsibility. They may have hundreds of lives in their hands. Granted, I’m sure it’s not the toughest work out there but a mistake could, potentially, lead to dire consequences.
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winterscoming
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#67
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(Original post by Mike172)
2. Because they, apparently, took on lower paid work on their own free will. No one is forced to undertake poorly paid positions.
People generally take low-paid jobs because those are the only options available to them. So, yes, they usually are forced to take those jobs.
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Mike172
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#68
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(Original post by winterscoming)
People generally take low-paid jobs because those are the only options available to them. So, yes, they usually are forced to take those jobs.
And how is that my problem, exactly?
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Bang Outta Order
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#69
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(Original post by RogerOxon)
If you put in the effort to earn more, should a larger proportion be taken from you? There needs to be an incentive to work harder.
"Incentive to work harder"? This isn't school. It's not the government's responsibility to teach people work ethic particularly through suffering. That's for your teachers and parents to do. The government is here to protect and provide end of.
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Quady
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#70
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(Original post by Mike172)
2. Because they, apparently, took on lower paid work on their own free will. No one is forced to undertake poorly paid positions.

3. We shouldn’t. I’ve never suggested we should. For me this whole argument is about how I have to pay 40% tax on some of my earning whilst others pay half that on theirs.
You weren't forced to take a lowly paid position yet nobody forced you (you seem to admit you don't pay anything at the 45% rate). Why did you?

You also pay half of 40% on some of your earnings.
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Quady
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#71
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#71
(Original post by winterscoming)
Why would people who are on low wages and pay little or no tax (due to the personal allowance) suddenly vote for paying 10% tax instead? A change like that would only really have a noticable benefit for people on higher salaries; seems very unlikely that many people would vote for it.
Unless you're on seriously low pay you have national insurance.

Someone on £14k would see their marginal rate drop from 32% to 10% and would pay basically the same (£1,400/year).

Most folk earn more than that.......
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RogerOxon
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#72
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(Original post by Bang Outta Order)
"Incentive to work harder"? This isn't school. It's not the government's responsibility to teach people work ethic particularly through suffering. That's for your teachers and parents to do. The government is here to protect and provide end of.
It is the government's responsibility to keep the economy competitive - jobs go if they don't. Low taxation is a carrot approach.
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gamey21
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#73
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#73
(Original post by Tawny007)
People get taxed on anything over an above £12,500... that's why you pay more tax. If the system took into account everyone's personal circumstances there would be a lot more fraud than there already is. It's expected that people who earn more pay more tax. You earn £21k but you wouldn't expect someone who earns £100k to be paying the same amount of tax as you, you'd expect them to pay more.
No I wouldn’t expect more. They have worked hard to earn a £100k salary it isn’t fair to tax them so much.
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Quady
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#74
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(Original post by gamey21)
No I wouldn’t expect more. They have worked hard to earn a £100k salary it isn’t fair to tax them so much.
Gamey, you've not answered how it's fair you pay so little tax.

Care to explain?
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winterscoming
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#75
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(Original post by Mike172)
And how is that my problem, exactly?
You made the claim that people take low-paid work out of their own free will and that they aren't forced, when in fact the opposite is true. I was pointing out the fact that your argument is false.
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winterscoming
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#76
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#76
(Original post by Quady)
Unless you're on seriously low pay you have national insurance.

Someone on £14k would see their marginal rate drop from 32% to 10% and would pay basically the same (£1,400/year).

Most folk earn more than that.......
National Insurance pays for the state pension and other benefits for people who are unable to work, so if there are going to be millions of people who are effectively no longer paying NI then that's a huge shortfall from the treasury which needs to be made up from other taxes elsewhere, or to start scrapping or privatising public services.
Last edited by winterscoming; 1 week ago
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Royalist Blue
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#77
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#77
(Original post by gamey21)
How is it fair that my friend on a 14.4k salary hardly gets taxed. Im on a 21k salary and i get taxed much more.

He earns 14.4k before tax, after tax goes home annually with 13.3k. Work hours 35 per week. Mon-Fri 8.30am-3.30pm

I earn 21k before tax, after tax I get 17.5k per year. Work hours 40 per week.
9.30am-5.30pm. Mon- Fri

I put in more hours, earn more but i’d rather have less hours earn less due to this tax system. In hindsight this 3-4k extra doesn’t seem like much at all. He gets to save more because he lives with his family. Most my money goes towards rent, bill, food expenses, helping my family out. All of which are not his circumstances. Last year he managed to save 9k from his salary, I could just about save 6.5k I know i’m complaining but It’s unfair, the tax system needs to be re-evaluated and people should be taxed due to their circumstance not their salary.
It because of the thresholds

The threshold is 12500

Someone earning 14,000 will be paying income tax on £1500 as well as NICS

Where as someone on exactly 21k will be paying tax on 8500

The only way to get around it is to abolish the tax free allowance and go on to a flat tax rate otherwise there will always be winers and losers- under this system your friend would pay more but you too would pay more.

Under the current system (I'm assuming you dont have a pension)

21000
12500
------------
8500 @ 20% =1700

21000
8632
----------------
12368 @ 12% =1484

Total taxation 3184

Now your mate woud have

[email protected] 20% = 300
5368 12% = 644
Total 944

Now the only way of making it so everyone pays the same % relative to the earnings is to combine income tax and NICS and have a flat rate of 32 %you would be paying more so would your friend

You woud then be paying around 7k in taxes your mate woukd be paying around 4500.

I'm not a fan of that idea the state piss your money up the wall on vanity projects such as HS2 and the millenium dome which have bost cost many billions in the last 20 years before you even look at our over inflated foreign aid contribution
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Quady
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#78
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#78
(Original post by winterscoming)
National Insurance pays for the state pension and other benefits for people who are unable to work, so if there are going to be millions of people who are effectively no longer paying NI then that's a huge shortfall from the treasury which needs to be made up from other taxes elsewhere, or to start scrapping or privatising public services.
Yes?
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winterscoming
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#79
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#79
(Original post by Quady)
Yes?
So which of those options do you think the majority of people are going to be voting for?
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Quady
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#80
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#80
(Original post by winterscoming)
So which of those options do you think the majority of people are going to be voting for?
Just the tax cut.
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