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Why are so many young Muslims still so religous?

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Original post by mariachi
well... Muslims copy-paste Islamic dawah, Christians link to Apologetics

so, what ?

You are right but for me it is more.

We all know looking at the source is important because it can help in identifying bias. But in what world does "a Christian wrote that" qualify as refuting anything? If I were a Christian I wouldn't discount Algebra because of the involvement of Muslims in its development. I wouldn't justify beating my pets simply because Hitler was known for caring about animal welfare. Not to say these examples are equal but the article I linked wasn't simply an opinion piece; it was clearly well researched with references clearly stated.

There is a portal which shows the frequency of such changes in manuscripts: https://help.qurangateway.org/article/30-about-scribal-changes along with explanations which may account for some of them. I don't think it completely accounts for *everything* argued at https://carm.org/have-there-been-changes-in-the-quran and it definitely doesn't explain shifting interpretations due to changing dialects (or the various cultures in which Islam lives) but surely certain Islamic scholars have something to say and I respect that. The challenge has certainly helped Christianity and all religions justify themselves on the modern stage. As children and neophytes in our chosen beliefs or ideologies we typically adopt something because of how it appeals to our nature or because of the indoctrination of our family or societies but all that does is arm one for a fight. How can one hope to have a conversation, let alone convert another rational person to their cause?

At this point I could chase my tail forever... but to pull my head out of my @$$ because hussamhussam obviously does not care to discuss the infallibility of his beliefs... all I will say is that denigrating the source of information rather than addressing the argument is a worthless contribution to a conversation.
Reply 61
You see that’s the point tho, you said it yourself, Muslims are religious, they follow rituals and routines, whereas Christianity doesn’t require that anymore, all it requires is a close relationship with God and that can’t always be seen from the outside
Original post by wants.philosophy
You are right but for me it is more.

We all know looking at the source is important because it can help in identifying bias. But in what world does "a Christian wrote that" qualify as refuting anything? If I were a Christian I wouldn't discount Algebra because of the involvement of Muslims in its development. I wouldn't justify beating my pets simply because Hitler was known for caring about animal welfare. Not to say these examples are equal but the article I linked wasn't simply an opinion piece; it was clearly well researched with references clearly stated.

There is a portal which shows the frequency of such changes in manuscripts: https://help.qurangateway.org/article/30-about-scribal-changes along with explanations which may account for some of them. I don't think it completely accounts for *everything* argued at https://carm.org/have-there-been-changes-in-the-quran and it definitely doesn't explain shifting interpretations due to changing dialects (or the various cultures in which Islam lives) but surely certain Islamic scholars have something to say and I respect that. The challenge has certainly helped Christianity and all religions justify themselves on the modern stage. As children and neophytes in our chosen beliefs or ideologies we typically adopt something because of how it appeals to our nature or because of the indoctrination of our family or societies but all that does is arm one for a fight. How can one hope to have a conversation, let alone convert another rational person to their cause?

At this point I could chase my tail forever... but to pull my head out of my @$$ because hussamhussam obviously does not care to discuss the infallibility of his beliefs... all I will say is that denigrating the source of information rather than addressing the argument is a worthless contribution to a conversation.

Hello wantsphilosophy, sorry for the late reply

of course that the Quran has a textual history, as any ancient text has : while Christians have accepted practically from the start, that the Bible is a text inspired by God, but still human, Muslims consider the Quran as the literal word of God , and claim that "all Qurans are identical"

and yet, this is blatantly not true. What is true is that the differences between the various Quranic texts are minor, and most of them do not have really much importance. In practice, early on (probably during the Caliphate of Uthman) the basic consonantical, undotted text was established (the "rasm"). Short vowels and diacritical points (differentiating some consonants) were established later : according to how these were added, you have seven (or ten) main recitations (the qira'at) each established in two different transmissions (riwayat).

However, you have some ancient manuscripts (especially palimpsests) which contain non-Uthmanic variants (we know, by the way, from some authors, that these variants continued to circulate for some time even after Uthman had all "variant Qurans" he could find destroyed)

End of the story, most Muslims by now use the "King's Quran", established in Cairo in 1925 on the basis of the "Hafs from Aasim" transmission, but other transmissions (Warsh, Qaalun, ad-Duri etc) are still in circulation

as indicated, most differences have little relevance (a singular for a plural, a masculine for a feminine, active verb instead of passive, first person instead of second person etc etc) but they do exist

on the entire question of the establishment of the Uthmanic rasm, the recitations, transmissions etc etc there is an excellent book by Muhammad Azami which illustrates the Muslim point of view very well https://www.amazon.co.uk/History-Quranic-Text-Compilation-Comparative/dp/1872531652
it's very expensive, but I'm sure that you will find it easily in your university's library

thanks also for drawing my attention to the Quran Gateway : it's excellent https://info.qurangateway.org/latest-thoughts/new-frontiers-in-qur%ca%beanic-studies-qur%ca%bean-gateways-simple-yet-sophisticated-approach-to-the-field/

best

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