Woman wearing a niqab gets angry at gay pride Watch

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RogerOxon
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(Original post by AngryRedhead)
Atheists can be homophobic too; I've had the misfortune of encountering homophobic atheists
(Original post by Wired_1800)
How does the definition of atheism affect whether one is homophobic?
No Atheist is homophobic BECAUSE OF ATHEISM.
Many religious people are homophobic BECAUSE OF THEIR RELIGION.

You can be a homophobic Atheist, but your homophobia would have NOTHING to do with Atheism. You may as well attribute it to your hair colour.

Atheism is a single position on a single claim - it is not a belief system. It makes no comment on any other issue.
Last edited by RogerOxon; 1 month ago
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AngryRedhead
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I agree; but when you’re in the receiving end of homophobia regardless of where it came from it doesn’t make a difference
(Original post by RogerOxon)
No Atheisist is homophobic BECAUSE OF ATHEISM.
Many religious people are homophobic BECAUSE OF THEIR RELIGION.

You can be a homophobic Atheist, but your homophobia would have NOTHING to do with Atheism. You may as well attribute it to your hair colour.

Atheism is a single position on a single claim - it is not a belief system. It makes no comment on any other issue.
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Wired_1800
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(Original post by RogerOxon)
No Atheisist is homophobic BECAUSE OF ATHEISM.
Many religious people are homophobic BECAUSE OF THEIR RELIGION.

You can be a homophobic Atheist, but your homophobia would have NOTHING to do with Atheism. You may as well attribute it to your hair colour.

Atheism is a single position on a single claim - it is not a belief system. It makes no comment on any other issue.
You are making a claim that homophobia from religious people comes from their religion. I don't think this is completely true. We don't know all religious people neither do we know the source or motivation for the prejudice.
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username4263278
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People like this give immigrants a bad name if they assimilated and tried to stop this oppression I'm sure the public wouldn't have such a poor view of them.
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RogerOxon
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(Original post by schoolsboring)
People like this give immigrants a bad name if they assimilated and tried to stop this oppression I'm sure the public wouldn't have such a poor view of them.
How do you know that they're an immigrant?
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RogerOxon
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(Original post by Wired_1800)
You are making a claim that homophobia from religious people comes from their religion. I don't think this is completely true. We don't know all religious people neither do we know the source or motivation for the prejudice.
For many, yes. Their holy books state that it is a sin, and they parrot this view without questioning why.

Are you claiming that what the Quran says on this has no impact on what Muslims believe?
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username4263278
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(Original post by RogerOxon)
How do you know that they're an immigrant?
I didn't say she was but her actions will reflect on immigrants, seeing as Islam is a foreign religion.
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Napp
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(Original post by RogerOxon)
Agreed. However, the indoctrinated opinion that their religion is right makes it more likely for them to hold seventh century views. Nothing feeds hatred quite like indoctrinated religion

The Adam and Eve claim is proven wrong. Did Eve wear a niqab?
Need I point out that every single one of the Abrahamic faiths takes an extremely dim view on buggery and gays in general?
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Napp
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(Original post by schoolsboring)
People like this give immigrants a bad name if they assimilated and tried to stop this oppression I'm sure the public wouldn't have such a poor view of them.
Going by the accent she sounds like she was born here and is likely a second generation migrant. An interesting phenomenon has been observed in that first generation migrants generally try to assimilate as much as they can whilst its the second and 3rd generation ones that are reverting to type.
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username4750714
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(Original post by Napp)
Need I point out that every single one of the Abrahamic faiths takes an extremely dim view on buggery and gays in general?
Irrelevant.Just because other religions do it too doesn't make it ok for Islam to do it.
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Napp
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(Original post by James2312)
Irrelevant.Just because other religions do it too doesn't make it ok for Islam to do it.
I don’t recall saying that? I merely point out there’s nothing unique about Island stance on the matter, something you’d do well to remember.
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RogerOxon
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(Original post by Napp)
I don’t recall saying that? I merely point out there’s nothing unique about Island stance on the matter, something you’d do well to remember.
Unfortunately, it's not unique. However, Muslims seem to practice homophobia much more than, say, Christians.
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Napp
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(Original post by RogerOxon)
Unfortunately, it's not unique. However, Muslims seem to accept this point much more than, say, Christians.
Indeed.
Really? Since when?
I mean the catholic stance on it is crystal clear and the doctrinal teachings of said good book haven’t changed.
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RogerOxon
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(Original post by Napp)
Indeed.
Really? Since when?
I mean the catholic stance on it is crystal clear and the doctrinal teachings of said good book haven’t changed.
But the views of Catholics have.
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FakeNewsEditor
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(Original post by naem071)
It's unreasonable to expect every single person in British society to accept homosexuality. However, we can expect everyone to show tolerance. She clearly doesn't agree with homosexuality, indeed many Muslims and religious folk may not, but that doesn't change the fact that the LGBT community have the right to exist in our society just as she does. Forced acceptance doesn't bode well (just look at the daily reaction of right-wingers), but every single person should be taught the principles of equality in law and tolerance. Only from tolerance can we see greater dialogue and greater social acceptance.
There are problems with distinguishing between agreeing with something and tolerating it. That is because it depends on how severe you believe that thing that is tolerated/agreed with to be. For example, if a very religious person thinks homosexuals are perverts, they'll neither agree with what they do, obviously, but they will also not wanna tolerate them. If they regard homosexuality on the same level as pederasty or some other crime, they will turn the question on you. Would you tolerate a pederast? you will say no, I hope. To which their response is that they regard homosexuals just as ''evil'' and therefore they can't tolerate them.

In a sense, to ask people who disagree with you on such issues to tolerate homosexuality is to beg the question. The reason why YOU tolerate them is because you regard homosexuality as just another kind of sexuality that is non-problematic. To their minds tho, that is to beg the question. You've assumed your view is the right one.

And this is why I don't think liberalism is compatible with many forms of old fashioned religion. Like fundamentalist, evangelical Christianity. Or traditional Catholicism (previous popes have condemned liberalism for good reason - I mean, ''good'' as in it's inconsistent with traditional Catholicism). Or indeed some forms of Islam.
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Napp
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(Original post by RogerOxon)
But the views of Catholics have.
An extremely dubious assertion. The views of some might have, some being the operative word here.
And of course we havent even gotten on to the views of evangelicals who most would seem to highly approve of stringing them all up from a lamp post.
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Wired_1800
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(Original post by RogerOxon)
For many, yes. Their holy books state that it is a sin, and they parrot this view without questioning why.

Are you claiming that what the Quran says on this has no impact on what Muslims believe?
To some, yes. I don't think it is to everyone. There are apparently 1.1 billion muslims, we should not just generalise.

If some non-religious people hold such views or even worse, then the source can be attribute to other elements including background.
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naem071
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(Original post by FakeNewsEditor)
There are problems with distinguishing between agreeing with something and tolerating it. That is because it depends on how severe you believe that thing that is tolerated/agreed with to be. For example, if a very religious person thinks homosexuals are perverts, they'll neither agree with what they do, obviously, but they will also not wanna tolerate them. If they regard homosexuality on the same level as pederasty or some other crime, they will turn the question on you. Would you tolerate a pederast? you will say no, I hope. To which their response is that they regard homosexuals just as ''evil'' and therefore they can't tolerate them.

In a sense, to ask people who disagree with you on such issues to tolerate homosexuality is to beg the question. The reason why YOU tolerate them is because you regard homosexuality as just another kind of sexuality that is non-problematic. To their minds tho, that is to beg the question. You've assumed your view is the right one.

And this is why I don't think liberalism is compatible with many forms of old fashioned religion. Like fundamentalist, evangelical Christianity. Or traditional Catholicism (previous popes have condemned liberalism for good reason - I mean, ''good'' as in it's inconsistent with traditional Catholicism). Or indeed some forms of Islam.
I can see the point you're making but I'd argue that there's a few distinctions to be made.

Firstly, I don't believe this was a typical reaction of even the most religious muslims. In Islam and certain strands of Christianity, pre-marital sex is looked at with intense disdain, under the Sharia it warrants the death penalty just as homosexuality does. Yet I don't think I've ever seen a religious fundamentalist attacking the average Joe Bloggs for this, and if it does happen it must be incredibly rare. British muslims are perceptive enough to know that pre-marital sex is incredibly common and whilst many will have very strong opinions against it, they aren't going to bash other people in society for doing so. I believe she represents a miniscule number of British muslims in that whilst many will hold views firmly against homosexuality, only a small number will seek to actively spit vitriol at gay people just living their lives - much like the Westboro Baptists.

Secondly, I'd say there's also a distinction to be made in law. Whilst many Muslim countries have hostile laws to the LGBT community, the majority of the West does not. If legal protections have been made to provide equality and freedom from prejudice in law, then it is an obligation on all citizens to act upon it. My view, whilst I do believe is right, just also happens to be the law. To actively spew hatred and show intolerance to the LGBT is illegal. British muslims also aren't above the law, committing hate crimes is an offence.
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EliteWhovian
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The way she voiced her opinions were by far not the best
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Studentnewcastle
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Not all Muslims will act this way even if they dont agree with gay pride they would never voice their opening its weird what this woman did i lived with hundreds of Muslims non of them or me would do that its better to keep such thoughts in the mind in this day and age
(Original post by RogerOxon)
Agreed. However, the indoctrinated opinion that their religion is right makes it more likely for them to hold seventh century views. Nothing feeds hatred quite like indoctrinated religion

The Adam and Eve claim is proven wrong. Did Eve wear a niqab?
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