This discussion is now closed.
Check out other Related discussions
- Is a Coding Ability Gap in my Class Common?
- Mathematics VS. Technology (jobs)
- ALEVEL HISTORY Essay Help!!!
- Pharmacy Foundation Year
- Lang Paper 1 Q2 Nov 2018 (Practice Question)
- Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde Quotations
- why do you like bad girls/bad boys
- facial dysmorphia
- A level politics help
- Masturbating - is it okay?
- Gcse English language paper 1 question 2
- Lupton - Leeds, is it worth it?
- discuss the view that the idea of Purgatory makes more sense than Hell
- talking to people when i feel awful never seems to help
- I slept with someone two days after my break up
- Is Ai going to replace artists
- Cambridge foundation year
- Kallisto's Sunday Question: Time Travel II
- gcse exam styled question
- Am I Muslim if I am choosing not to worship God?
Are Human Beings Fundementally Good or Fundementally Bad?
Poll
Are Human Beings Fundementally Good or Fundementally Bad?
This was inspired by an experience I had a few days ago. I went to the shop, bought some stuff, and I was walking up the street about 1/4 mile away when I heard a man sprint up behind me and hand me my phone. I'd dropped it in the shop. It would have been so easy to just ignore it, hand it in to the shop, or even steal it. Not all people would have done what he did, so it got me thinking:
Are Human Beings Fundementally Good or Fundementally Bad?
I think there are strong arguments for both. Random acts of kindness, charity and philanthropy cause me to think the former. However, some of the horrific things that happen in this World make me think there is a certain element of evil in everyone. Things such as genocide and rape indicate a fundementally flawed personality. The way law and order breaks down comptetely when structure is removed, as in natural disaster scenarios, Lord of the Flies, mass rape in Africa by revolting militia etc etc makes me think the latter.
I personally can't give an answer to this question, but it's something I think about a lot.
To the floor.
Are Human Beings Fundementally Good or Fundementally Bad?
I think there are strong arguments for both. Random acts of kindness, charity and philanthropy cause me to think the former. However, some of the horrific things that happen in this World make me think there is a certain element of evil in everyone. Things such as genocide and rape indicate a fundementally flawed personality. The way law and order breaks down comptetely when structure is removed, as in natural disaster scenarios, Lord of the Flies, mass rape in Africa by revolting militia etc etc makes me think the latter.
I personally can't give an answer to this question, but it's something I think about a lot.
To the floor.
Scroll to see replies
****. I voted for the wrong one by accident. 
Funny because I posted something about this on myspace:
I believe people are naturally malicious. They look out only for themselves and those who mean anything to them. They think only about personal gain and how the outcome can best benefit them. Humans who expel sincerity onto others often have an ulterior motive. Behind these motives, the real them is revealed. An evil self. A self that cares not about humanity but often the rewards for helping humanity. Be aware of those who don't own up to this, for they are the real devious ones who have the capabilities of inflicting profound damage.
My opinion is biased by my religion. I'm Hindu and I see that we take birth only because we have sinned in some way. Humans tend to be more selfish. I mean who else do you look out for more?
Funny because I posted something about this on myspace:
I believe people are naturally malicious. They look out only for themselves and those who mean anything to them. They think only about personal gain and how the outcome can best benefit them. Humans who expel sincerity onto others often have an ulterior motive. Behind these motives, the real them is revealed. An evil self. A self that cares not about humanity but often the rewards for helping humanity. Be aware of those who don't own up to this, for they are the real devious ones who have the capabilities of inflicting profound damage.
My opinion is biased by my religion. I'm Hindu and I see that we take birth only because we have sinned in some way. Humans tend to be more selfish. I mean who else do you look out for more?
same as the above, theres really no black or white when it come to humans and labelling the entire specie as fundamentally "good" or "bad", what matters is what you do, when you do it, people may describe the actions you take as good or bad, but no one can fully make a judgement on your actions, but yourself and that judgement itsself is dependednt on you own personal experiences that shape up to the way that you think and percieve the world.
I tend to subscribe to Rousseau's way of thinking on this, at least as I understand it: that we're fundamentally good, but simply by virtue of being immersed in civilization we become malicious creatures. In the state of nature, you don't have to care for anyone else, and because of that essentially everything you do is by its nature good--that is, you're self-sufficient, and whatever course of action you take will ultimately only affect yourself. But when you're put in a situation where there are people to consider and you still abide by these instincts, to survive and to benefit yourself, you then become malicious. Your actions now have repercussions where they once did not, and often this is detrimental to one's goodness--for how can you constantly benefit yourself without, on a rather consistent basis, negatively affecting those around you? Basically, it's all very relative, and it depends on where you are, what your circumstances happen to be, etc.
But I'm just blathering now, so I'll stop.
But I'm just blathering now, so I'll stop.
Both.
Without humans there would be no opinion of 'good' and 'bad' so neither would exist. The fact that humans exist brings into existence the ideas of 'good' and 'bad' - humans must therefore must be fundamentally both.
Without humans there would be no opinion of 'good' and 'bad' so neither would exist. The fact that humans exist brings into existence the ideas of 'good' and 'bad' - humans must therefore must be fundamentally both.
Fundamentally neither.
neither.. we are what we chose to be. I know good people, and bad people.. the former often takes more conscious effort, but that's because the latter is the product of modern society.
I tend to take the view that most people, without mental disorders or other decision impairing effects (Those two variables wouldnt stop you from having a good or bad soul, only make it far harder to understand if you were acting out of mania or making a conscious choice) are largely influenced by their environment and act accordingly. I like to think that, at the beginning, you come into this world pure, neutral - no grasp of good or evil.
As time goes on, and you mature, what you look like, who you are, who you know, where your born - a thousand thousand variables - all shape your conscious and unconscious mind. Every little thing thats ever happened to you, every tiny coincidence - that time you missed the bus, when you came second in the school 100 metre race, when you bullied someone weaker than you out of frustration...I couldnt even begin to cover the magnitude of things that influence you in a mere forum post.
People are largely going to become what they are pushed into being by the circumstance of life. I say largely, as I have long believed that you do NOT have to be a victim of negative circumstance. People sometimes do have very little chance to escape a negative, downward spiral - its heartbreaking to watch. I had many disadvantages growing up, and this has left its mark on my soul - but not so many as the child with no food in some barren country. I counted my blessings, a loving family who all gave me so much (sometimes unrequited) love and help. I always liked to believe I was a self made man - that I rescued myself from my background and pushed myself onward, but the truth is that my success is mostly circumstance. The help of my family? circumstance. My will to make the best of my life? again circumstance - based on the events of my life. I could so easily have been sucked in. I still slip occasionally.
My simple answer? I tend to believe that most of humanity doesnt stray far from neutral - they live their lives and do a variety of both good and bad deeds.
Others choose what could be (and this is never black and white) More extreme paths. There are those messianic people who take the pain of others and reduce it. There are those who choose to be a negative force in the world. This is not a simple area, and raises so many questions. Are we simply victims of our past evolution? do good and evil matter in terms of species survival and evolution, or are these just self-deluding ideals that some of us lean on? The sheer scope of this question is making me somewhat dizzy as I type this.
I have my suspicions however, that people are fundamentally people. Theres a heartbreaking amount of apathy, hatred and evil. But at the same time, there is so much warmth, love and goodness in us. I think fundamental, pure good or pure evil exist so rarely as to be almost unseen. Most people are, as I said, simply people - we have equally capacity as both saint and sinner.
I think the most sensible, considered answer is, as always to simply say that it is "All a matter of perspective" And at the risk of sounding somewhat pretentious, I will leave you with a quote that comes to mind -
"If we could read the secret history of our enemies, we should find in each man's life sorrow and suffering enough to disarm all hostility."
Its this that reminds me that a murderer in the news isnt the product of himself. And that a saintly girl who seems to be the best of us, might not have been, once.
As time goes on, and you mature, what you look like, who you are, who you know, where your born - a thousand thousand variables - all shape your conscious and unconscious mind. Every little thing thats ever happened to you, every tiny coincidence - that time you missed the bus, when you came second in the school 100 metre race, when you bullied someone weaker than you out of frustration...I couldnt even begin to cover the magnitude of things that influence you in a mere forum post.
People are largely going to become what they are pushed into being by the circumstance of life. I say largely, as I have long believed that you do NOT have to be a victim of negative circumstance. People sometimes do have very little chance to escape a negative, downward spiral - its heartbreaking to watch. I had many disadvantages growing up, and this has left its mark on my soul - but not so many as the child with no food in some barren country. I counted my blessings, a loving family who all gave me so much (sometimes unrequited) love and help. I always liked to believe I was a self made man - that I rescued myself from my background and pushed myself onward, but the truth is that my success is mostly circumstance. The help of my family? circumstance. My will to make the best of my life? again circumstance - based on the events of my life. I could so easily have been sucked in. I still slip occasionally.
My simple answer? I tend to believe that most of humanity doesnt stray far from neutral - they live their lives and do a variety of both good and bad deeds.
Others choose what could be (and this is never black and white) More extreme paths. There are those messianic people who take the pain of others and reduce it. There are those who choose to be a negative force in the world. This is not a simple area, and raises so many questions. Are we simply victims of our past evolution? do good and evil matter in terms of species survival and evolution, or are these just self-deluding ideals that some of us lean on? The sheer scope of this question is making me somewhat dizzy as I type this.
I have my suspicions however, that people are fundamentally people. Theres a heartbreaking amount of apathy, hatred and evil. But at the same time, there is so much warmth, love and goodness in us. I think fundamental, pure good or pure evil exist so rarely as to be almost unseen. Most people are, as I said, simply people - we have equally capacity as both saint and sinner.
I think the most sensible, considered answer is, as always to simply say that it is "All a matter of perspective" And at the risk of sounding somewhat pretentious, I will leave you with a quote that comes to mind -
"If we could read the secret history of our enemies, we should find in each man's life sorrow and suffering enough to disarm all hostility."
Its this that reminds me that a murderer in the news isnt the product of himself. And that a saintly girl who seems to be the best of us, might not have been, once.
SoundDevastation
neither.. we are what we chose to be. I know good people, and bad people.. the former often takes more conscious effort, but that's because the latter is the product of modern society.
Society has a huge impact on our lives, although I think it might be unfair out of hand to say it produces bad people. It also depends on your perception of "bad". For some, the average person is seen as bad because they commit good and bad deeds with roughly the same frequency, however most remember the bad more readily :P Hence those in the "middle" are placed in the same camp as the "bad" - which is such a shame to see.
I would love to agree with you - that we are who we choose to be. We have varying degrees of choice, some have a large amount, some have practically none. It is perfectly possible to be a victim of circumstance in this world.
Desperate Prayer
I would love to agree with you - that we are who we choose to be. We have varying degrees of choice, some have a large amount, some have practically none. It is perfectly possible to be a victim of circumstance in this world.
I would love to agree with you - that we are who we choose to be. We have varying degrees of choice, some have a large amount, some have practically none. It is perfectly possible to be a victim of circumstance in this world.
I agree that there is certainly alot of middle ground.. but apathy is something i would class as 'bad' and i think that is often the cause for neutrality. Tackling climate change for example.. i would consider the good thing to take an active role.. the bad thing would be to purposefully make it worse, which is obviously rare. The middle ground however, of doing absolutely nothing, does more bad than good...
It entirely possible to be a victim of circumstance though its not all about choice i dont think.. even if we dont have the power to execute our principles, our principles can make us a good or bad person.
obviously its never as black and white as good/bad and we're all complex etc.. im just using them for the same of discussion really.
We are fundamentally both. Of course we are.
I like to think that all human beings are born new, fresh, clean. Neither good nor bad. (That is, if they are psychologically biologically correct. For example, a psychopath is born as a psychopath, so their actions may be percieved as 'bad' but to them, it is normality.) Our experiences as we grow up do define who we are in a way, but yes, there's also the inherent personality that we each have.
So, a person may be born short-tempered by nature, but the way they are brought up affects whether this short-tempered nature develops into a man who harms his wife (bad) or someone who's efficient at their job and gets others motivated (good).
So, a person may be born short-tempered by nature, but the way they are brought up affects whether this short-tempered nature develops into a man who harms his wife (bad) or someone who's efficient at their job and gets others motivated (good).
SoundDevastation
I agree that there is certainly alot of middle ground.. but apathy is something i would class as 'bad' and i think that is often the cause for neutrality. Tackling climate change for example.. i would consider the good thing to take an active role.. the bad thing would be to purposefully make it worse, which is obviously rare. The middle ground however, of doing absolutely nothing, does more bad than good...
It entirely possible to be a victim of circumstance though its not all about choice i dont think.. even if we dont have the power to execute our principles, our principles can make us a good or bad person.
obviously its never as black and white as good/bad and we're all complex etc.. im just using them for the same of discussion really.
It entirely possible to be a victim of circumstance though its not all about choice i dont think.. even if we dont have the power to execute our principles, our principles can make us a good or bad person.
obviously its never as black and white as good/bad and we're all complex etc.. im just using them for the same of discussion really.
I think apathy is part of the human condition, at least until something triggers your empathy
The middle ground is rarely taken through conscious choice - It would be interesting to see where most would place the overworked father with several children who buys an economical car but does nothing further in your example 
Your quite right about the principles thing, in some respect. But I personally believe that if you dont, cant or wont stand by your principles, they were never that important to you.
But yes, it - we, are a very complex subject indeed :P
neither, both lol. I beleive a variety of both innate and enviromental factors effect a persons moral outlook. Some people are NATURALLY evil, some are made evil, some are made good, and some have sunlight shining out their bum crack from birth...
Desperate Prayer
If you dont, cant or wont stand by your principles, they were never that important to you.
If you dont, cant or wont stand by your principles, they were never that important to you.
That is indeed a very good point and a good quote. I have alot of principles and I stand by them. I guess the one thing that really really bugs me about mankind (and has biased my viewpoint on this thread
) Is people who dont have principles to stand by.. people who blindly follow the system.but thats going a little off-topic i think
My belief is that everyone is, fundamentally, good. Even the people that we see as doing unspeakable evil, I would be willing to be thought that what they were doing was a good thing (do the ends justify the means? different arguement, different thread). The problem that we have is that our good nature is tempered by a combination of laziness and caution.
Related discussions
- Is a Coding Ability Gap in my Class Common?
- Mathematics VS. Technology (jobs)
- ALEVEL HISTORY Essay Help!!!
- Pharmacy Foundation Year
- Lang Paper 1 Q2 Nov 2018 (Practice Question)
- Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde Quotations
- why do you like bad girls/bad boys
- facial dysmorphia
- A level politics help
- Masturbating - is it okay?
- Gcse English language paper 1 question 2
- Lupton - Leeds, is it worth it?
- discuss the view that the idea of Purgatory makes more sense than Hell
- talking to people when i feel awful never seems to help
- I slept with someone two days after my break up
- Is Ai going to replace artists
- Cambridge foundation year
- Kallisto's Sunday Question: Time Travel II
- gcse exam styled question
- Am I Muslim if I am choosing not to worship God?
Latest
Trending
Last reply 2 days ago
Why is the political left now censorious and authoritarian??Last reply 2 days ago
Is it true that British unis are prejudiced towards degrees from Scottish unis?Last reply 2 days ago
If the Russell Group was now a fair representation of what it still claims to beLast reply 2 weeks ago
TSR Goes Green: How important will the environment be in this year's election?Last reply 2 weeks ago
Research Rankings of universities if you add Research Quality & Intensity percentagesLast reply 1 month ago
Is University of Birmingham prestigious and respected well enough in UK ?Trending
Last reply 2 days ago
Why is the political left now censorious and authoritarian??Last reply 2 days ago
Is it true that British unis are prejudiced towards degrees from Scottish unis?Last reply 2 days ago
If the Russell Group was now a fair representation of what it still claims to beLast reply 2 weeks ago
TSR Goes Green: How important will the environment be in this year's election?Last reply 2 weeks ago
Research Rankings of universities if you add Research Quality & Intensity percentagesLast reply 1 month ago
Is University of Birmingham prestigious and respected well enough in UK ?
