Trump Sanctions causing rout of production out of China Watch

AngeryPenguin
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The main beneficiaries are Vietnam, Taiwan (high-tech production) and southern Asia, though countries even closer to home (such as Turkey and Romania) are also seeing a rise likely from the reshoring of manufacturing from China.

Mostly US companies, but also other notable moves from manufacturers such as in the EU and Japanese.

This is something any right-winger should be against. Sanctions go against the principle of the free market and the minimalist state.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapo...-out-of-china/

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-48273550

https://asia.nikkei.com/Economy/Trad...o-more-tariffs
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999tigger
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It would be happening anyway as China is no longer the cheapest place to do business. People think longer term and even the Chinese are moving out. As for free trade you also have to look at the issues of state subsidy, dumping and theft of intellectual property.
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Notoriety
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(Original post by 999tigger)
It would be happening anyway as China is no longer the cheapest place to do business. People think longer term and even the Chinese are moving out. As for free trade you also have to look at the issues of state subsidy, dumping and theft of intellectual property.
Indeed. China has formed a middle class, people expect money to do work. The downside of economic growth and personal development.
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Smack
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(Original post by AngeryPenguin)
This is something any right-winger should be against. Sanctions go against the principle of the free market and the minimalist state.
The new or alternative right aren't "right-wing" in the traditional sense, and, indeed, Trump was effectively voted in on a ticket on market intervention.
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Napp
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To be honest Trumps war on trade has little to do with this. Jobs have been leaving China for some time to the rest of South/South-East Asia due to the aforementioned reasons. Indeed, some would have it that sanctions have rather little to do with it as their currency has been sufficiently devalued to nullify most of them.
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Tempest II
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Quite frankly, I don't see the problem in crippling the PRC's economy when there's a good chance that a skirmish/conflict may occur between them and their neighbours in the next decade. Taiwan, Japan, the Philippines, Vietnam and South Korea are all thorns in the PRC's side. And of course, any military confrontation would almost certainly bring the US in too.
Manufacturing moving to any of these countries which are threatened by the PRC would be a win-win situation.
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Baron of Sealand
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I disagree. China is a socialist state and the continued tolerance of letting it reap the benefits of global capitalism is contrary to the free market principle. You don't uphold a free market by destroying free markets in favour of a controlled market.

This is without bringing in the human rights aspect.
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AngeryPenguin
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(Original post by Tempest II)
Quite frankly, I don't see the problem in crippling the PRC's economy when there's a good chance that a skirmish/conflict may occur between them and their neighbours in the next decade. Taiwan, Japan, the Philippines, Vietnam and South Korea are all thorns in the PRC's side. And of course, any military confrontation would almost certainly bring the US in too.
Manufacturing moving to any of these countries which are threatened by the PRC would be a win-win situation.
It is not only affecting China, however.

There are many countries dependent on exports to China, for instance Venezuala and Russia are dependent on oil exports. The mere declaration of sanctions - and the expectation of reduced Chinese industrial output - has already pushed oil prices down 8%, which will have a knock-on effect on both countries, potentially pushing them to recession.

Analysts at BofA Merrill Lynch said the latest round of US tariffs could reduce global oil demand by 250,000-500,000 barrels per day, adding to worries about a demand slowdown that is challenging the fundamentals for crude.
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/08/05/bren...anian-oil.html
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Tempest II
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(Original post by AngeryPenguin)
It is not only affecting China, however.

There are many countries dependent on exports to China, for instance Venezuala and Russia are dependent on oil exports. The mere declaration of sanctions - and the expectation of reduced Chinese industrial output - has already pushed oil prices down 8%, which will have a knock-on effect on both countries, potentially pushing them to recession.



https://www.cnbc.com/2019/08/05/bren...anian-oil.html
Again, anything that slows down the Russians from modernising their military further and prevents them from invading their neighbours isn't exactly a bad thing. Putin, and by extension of that, Russia, is a threat to the West although primarily Eastern European and Baltic countries.
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Good bloke
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Dio you know nothing about the Venezuelan economy, which entered meltdown through corruption and socialism a long time ago?

As for reduced oil demand, do you want to stop global warming or do you want increased oil use? You can't do both.
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AngeryPenguin
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(Original post by Good bloke)
Dio you know nothing about the Venezuelan economy, which entered meltdown through corruption and socialism a long time ago?

As for reduced oil demand, do you want to stop global warming or do you want increased oil use? You can't do both.
Venezuala's GDP is roughly the same as it was in 2000. That's not impressive growth, but given the decline of the price of oil in that time, it's not as bad as it seems.

Bear in mind that the UK's GDP is roughly the same as it was in 2007. Is the UK a 'corrupt socialist' state?
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Good bloke
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(Original post by AngeryPenguin)
Venezuala's GDP is roughly the same as it was in 2000. That's not impressive growth, but given the decline of the price of oil in that time, it's not as bad as it seems.

Bear in mind that the UK's GDP is roughly the same as it was in 2007. Is the UK a 'corrupt socialist' state?
That must be why economists think its economic collapse since 2010 has been the worst outside war for a very loing time, eh?

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/17/w...a-economy.html

It is the hyperinflation, caused by socialist poilicies, that is the main problem, and, contrary to the impression of relative wealth given by your specious claim, GDP has fallen by 63% since 2013 and is well below what it was in 2007. 87% of families have an income below the national poverty level. This is the nation that is riichest in oil reserves. It should be as wealthy as Saudi Arabia or the other Gulf states.

I don't think there is any doubt that this is a corrupt socialist state, worse even than Zimbabwe (and that takes some doing). To argue otherwise says more about you than it does about Venezuela's goverment.
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