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Made in the USA
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#241
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#241
(Original post by History Lost in Physics)
There's nothing that wrong with recycling policy - many things have been done before in history which could make a positive contribution if instituted now - though when you are lifting your main catchphrase from a british childrens television program (Yes We Can!!!) then you are probably going too far down that particular road*.

* Admittedly I haven't got a clue if he did lift it or not - I sincerely do hope that he did, massively unlikely as it is.
Obama has stolen the "Yes, we can" line from Deval Patrick:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aP9BWUc788Y

That's not all he has stolen from Patrick:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqOaVbznE5o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBmGxDOxzeQ
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Teofilo
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(Original post by Made in the USA)
Not only are most of Obama's ideas failed, moldy ideas from the Carter administration
I find rubbish like this particularly rich considering how McCain's supporters so adamantly deny any suggestion that there may be similarities between McCain and Bush.

I'm not saying that McCain is 8 more years of Bush, but if you're going to make the Obama-Carter comparison, the McCain-Bush comparison is every bit as warranted.
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Made in the USA
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I don't know if Obama is trying to purposefully show disrespect toward the US or he is just protesting the horrible singing. Whatever the case, he should put his hand over his heart instead of rejecting American tradition. It's a stupid move and it's going to come back to haunt him. I expect this from America's enemies, not from someone running for president.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fwog6E08CFU
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Teofilo
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The real disrespect is the singing. WTF? That's absolutely criminal. Sounds like a piss-take.

But yes, between that and not wearing his American flag pin, Obama has clearly demonstrated he doesn't possess the requisite qualities to be president.
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Made in the USA
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(Original post by Teofilo)
I find rubbish like this particularly rich considering how McCain's supporters so adamantly deny any suggestion that there may be similarities between McCain and Bush.

I'm not saying that McCain is 8 more years of Bush, but if you're going to make the Obama-Carter comparison, the McCain-Bush comparison is every bit as warranted.
Well it's a much more effective attack to tie Obama to Carter than to say McCain is the same as Bush. Bush is unpopular and polarizing, but he was still popular enough to get reelected. Carter lost after one term by one of the biggest landslides in American history: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...1980-Large.png

Carter and Obama have a lot more in common in terms of policy than Bush and McCain. Obama is even hiring former Carter aides and cabinet members to be his policy advisers, including Brezinski, the darling of the anti-Israel, holocaust-denying, Zionist-conspiracy brigade.

Even the mood of the country seems to be in a similar funk. When Carter was running for president, people were unhappy about the vietnam war and talked about hope and change.

Obama and Carter made similar speeches critical of America. Obama thinks we should change our lifestyle and shouldn't enjoy the luxury of setting our thermostat to 72 degrees all year round. Carter was also critical of the American lifestyle.

Both men are favorites of the media, both support endless taxes, regulations and big government programs instead of the free market to solve America's problems.
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Made in the USA
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(Original post by Teofilo)
The real disrespect is the singing. WTF? That's absolutely criminal. Sounds like a piss-take.

But yes, between that and not wearing his American flag pin, Obama has clearly demonstrated he doesn't possess the requisite qualities to be president.
He's already ahead of the game, which shows that democrats have learned from 2004. When Kerry was running, the campaign would wait for the fecal material to hit the fan and then react. If Obama reiterates his patriotism often enough, maybe the flag pin, Wright, Ayres, and the national anthem can stay buried for a while longer. I also believe that the Obama people sent out Wesley Clark to attack McCain's military service to distract people from Obama's patriotism issues. When Hillary surrogate Geraldine Ferraro made controversial remarks she was immediately fired, when Wesley Clark gave his even more inappropriate comments, nothing happened. He is still acting as a surrogate for Barack Obama’s campaign and still making the same allegations several days later. It has to all be part of a strategy to stay on the offensive.
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Captain Crash
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#247
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(Original post by Made in the USA)
Well it's a much more effective attack to tie Obama to Carter than to say McCain is the same as Bush. Bush is unpopular and polarizing, but he was still popular enough to get reelected. Carter lost after one term by one of the biggest landslides in American history: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...1980-Large.png
Bush was re-elected due to the democrats fielding a weak candidate and playing on people's fears of terrorism.

The reason for Carter's failure to be re-elected is usually attributed to the Iran Hostage crisis and the skyrocketing oil prices due to the Iranian revolution.
(Original post by Made in the USA)
Carter and Obama have a lot more in common in terms of policy than Bush and McCain. Obama is even hiring former Carter aides and cabinet members to be his policy advisers, including Brezinski, the darling of the anti-Israel, holocaust-denying, Zionist-conspiracy brigade.
Carter did more for Israel in terms of making steps towards peace than any other president. I'd hardly call his policy anti-israeli.
(Original post by Made in the USA)
Even the mood of the country seems to be in a similar funk. When Carter was running for president, people were unhappy about the vietnam war and talked about hope and change.
Vietnam had become a non issue by 76. Carter won because Ford was an idiot not for any rhetoric of change.
(Original post by Made in the USA)
Obama and Carter made similar speeches critical of America. Obama thinks we should change our lifestyle and shouldn't enjoy the luxury of setting our thermostat to 72 degrees all year round. Carter was also critical of the American lifestyle.

Both men are favorites of the media, both support endless taxes, regulations and big government programs instead of the free market to solve America's problems.
There are many more differences between Carter and Obama than the similarities you list. For one, Carter didn't even have the support of his party - he was too conservative for one thing. And whilst he did increase taxes, Carter was generally for streamlining regulation and getting rid of pork barrel spending.

But whatever the comparision, an attack on Obama by saying Carter is bad is just ad hon. Carter has similar view to Obama, Carter is bad president therefore Obama must be a bad president because he shares ideologies of Carter? :confused:
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Teofilo
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(Original post by Made in the USA)
He's already ahead of the game, which shows that democrats have learned from 2004. when Wesley Clark gave his even more inappropriate comments, nothing happened. days later.
Wesley Clark stated, in response to a question, that John McCain's military serivce record was not a qualification to be the president of the country. What is so heinous about that?

I totally agree with him. The notion that serving in the military somehow gives you the foreign policy credentials to be president is absolute non-sense. Kerry did the exact same thing and it made me sick to be honest.
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Made in the USA
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(Original post by Teofilo)
Wesley Clark stated, in response to a question, that John McCain's military serivce record was not a qualification to be the president of the country. What is so heinous about that?

I totally agree with him. The notion that serving in the military somehow gives you the foreign policy credentials to be president is absolute non-sense. Kerry did the exact same thing and it made me sick to be honest.
McCain, unlike John Kerry, has not made his Vietnam imprisonment an issue in this election, nor has he used his imprisonment as a reason that he deserves to be elected. John Kerry ran on his military service in 2004. He even saluted the audience during his nomination acceptance speech.

It really does take a lot of cajones to chastise a six year POW, air wing commander and 20-some-odd year member of the Senate Armed Services Committee as someone without any real experience. That's not really the main reason there is so much controversy. It's not what he said that has people confounded, it's WHY he said it. Here is the exchange for those who missed it:

CLARK: Because in the matters of national security policy making, it's a matter of understanding risk, it's a matter of gauging your opponents and it's a matter of being held accountable. John McCain's never done any of that in his official positions. I certainly honor his service as a prisoner of war. He was a hero to me and to hundreds of thousands of millions of others in the armed forces as a prisoner of war. He has been a voice on the Senate Armed Services Committee and he has traveled all over the world. But he hasn't held executive responsibility. That large squadron in the Navy that he commanded wasn't a wartime squadron. He hasn't been there and ordered the bombs to fall. He hasn't seen what it's like when diplomats come in and say, I don't know whether we're going to be able to get this point through or not. Do you want to take the risk? What about your reputation? How do we handle it publicly?

SCHIEFFER: I have to say, Barack Obama has not had any of those experiences either, nor has he ridden in a fighter plane and gotten shot down. I mean……

CLARK: Well, I don't think riding in a fighter plane and getting shot down is a qualification to be president.

SCHIEFFER: Really?

CLARK: But Barack is not — he is not running on the fact that he has made these national security pronouncements. He's running on his other strengths.

Why was Wesley Clark sent out as a political operative to attack the military background of John McCain? It makes no sense because every argument he made can be applied more so to Obama than McCain. Barack Obama hasn't been on the Senate Armed Services Committee, hasn't had any executive experience, hasn't commanded anything in wartime or not. He hasn't dealt with diplomats in any capacity at all.

Clark didn't hit the talk shows on Sunday morning and just babble out anything that came to mind. Both parties send out people armed with well rehearsed lines to spout. For some reason, Obama's people think it is a smart strategy to go after McCain's military service, instead of debating the issues. It has to be the stupidest tactic ever because all it does is remind people Obama is lacking similar experience.

Clark isn't the first Obama surrogate to attack McCain's service. Jay Rockefeller and Tom Harkin have also taken shots at McCain's service. So much for Obama's promise to Americans that we'd see a new kind of politics this election season. :rolleyes:
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s.e.r.e.n.e
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(Original post by Made in the USA)
Why was Wesley Clark sent out as a political operative to attack the military background of John McCain? It makes no sense because every argument he made can be applied more so to Obama than McCain. Barack Obama hasn't been on the Senate Armed Services Committee, hasn't had any executive experience, hasn't commanded anything in wartime or not. He hasn't dealt with diplomats in any capacity at all.
Because,
But Barack is not — he is not running on the fact that he has made these national security pronouncements. He's running on his other strengths.
And the other strength is
Because in the matters of national security policy making, it's a matter of understanding risk, it's a matter of gauging your opponents
Like being an opponent of the Iraq War from the very start. The Iraq War was wrong then, wrong now, and it looks like John McCain wants to double down on it.
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s.e.r.e.n.e
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An increasing number of hedge fund managers in the US are predicting an Obama victory. The most high profile one recently is by Pimco (the world's largest bond fund). They are already using terms like President Obama.

I looks like Obama's presidency will be incredibly difficult economically.
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Teofilo
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(Original post by Made in the USA)
McCain, unlike John Kerry, has not made his Vietnam imprisonment an issue in this election, nor has he used his imprisonment as a reason that he deserves to be elected. John Kerry ran on his military service in 2004. He even saluted the audience during his nomination acceptance speech.
I resented Kerry for the fact that he made his service an issue (probably cost him the election), but to say McCain isn't running at least partly on his "war hero" status is a joke.

(Original post by Made in the USA)
It really does take a lot of cajones to chastise a six year POW, air wing commander and 20-some-odd year member of the Senate Armed Services Committee as someone without any real experience.
It's rather ironic that, virtually immediately after stating that McCain isn't running on his military service, it is the very first example you refer to when going on about his "real experience." More than a touch hypocritical.

(Original post by Made in the USA)
Why was Wesley Clark sent out as a political operative to attack the military background of John McCain? It makes no sense because every argument he made can be applied more so to Obama than McCain. Barack Obama hasn't been on the Senate Armed Services Committee, hasn't had any executive experience, hasn't commanded anything in wartime or not. He hasn't dealt with diplomats in any capacity at all.

Clark didn't hit the talk shows on Sunday morning and just babble out anything that came to mind. Both parties send out people armed with well rehearsed lines to spout. For some reason, Obama's people think it is a smart strategy to go after McCain's military service, instead of debating the issues. It has to be the stupidest tactic ever because all it does is remind people Obama is lacking similar experience.

Clark isn't the first Obama surrogate to attack McCain's service. Jay Rockefeller and Tom Harkin have also taken shots at McCain's service. So much for Obama's promise to Americans that we'd see a new kind of politics this election season. :rolleyes:
What a load of ********. You seem to have conveniantly omitted the fact that it was not actually Wesley Clark who brought the issue up, but rather he was responding to a question Bob Schieffer had posed. The notion that he was on a political hatchet job is illogical (as you said, does it make sense for Obama to go after McCain's service record?).
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Made in the USA
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(Original post by Teofilo)
What a load of ********. You seem to have conveniantly omitted the fact that it was not actually Wesley Clark who brought the issue up, but rather he was responding to a question Bob Schieffer had posed. The notion that he was on a political hatchet job is illogical (as you said, does it make sense for Obama to go after McCain's service record?).
This has to be a planned and rehearsed hatchet job. Clark even updated his Facebook status to “Wes Clark knows that John McCain is largely untested and untried when it comes to matters of national security.” You know it's planned because Obama didn't fire Clark after the comments. Geraldine Ferraro had to resign her position in the Hillary Clinton campaign after suggesting that the only reason Obama was even a contender is because he's black. That's usually what happens when a surrogate steps out of line and says the wrong thing. Not only is Clark refusing to apologize, but he is still repeating the comments every time he's in front of a camera, with Obama basically winking and nodding.
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s.e.r.e.n.e
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(Original post by Made in the USA)
McCain, unlike John Kerry, has not made his Vietnam imprisonment an issue in this election, nor has he used his imprisonment as a reason that he deserves to be elected. John Kerry ran on his military service in 2004. He even saluted the audience during his nomination acceptance speech.
McCain doesn't know about the economy.

When asked in April about reversing his support for a federal home-mortgage bailout, he [McCain] reached for a sheet of talking points. :rofl: By contrast, Romney has a master's of business administration from Harvard University, ran the 2002 Salt Lake City Olympics, and made a vast fortune as co-founder of the Boston-based private-equity firm Bain Capital LLC.

McCain, 71, said in December that he doesn't understand economics "as well as I should'' :rofl: and his lack of comfort is apparent on the stump.

source: Bloomberg
--------------
At that debate, McCain said:

“I don’t believe we’re headed into a recession,” :rofl: he said, “I believe the fundamentals of this economy are strong and I believe they will remain strong.” :rofl:

In the course of seven days, McCain appears to have reversed course, offering his own stimulus package:

“The fact is we have some tough times ahead,” McCain told supporters in Columbia. But he said the U.S. economy will rebound. “We will get through this rough patch,” he said.
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PeeWeeDan
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#255
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#255
I honestly cannot, given you are a crazy Obama supporter, really be arguing the experience card.
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Teofilo
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PeeWeeDan, your transformation wouldn't be complete without one of those obnxiously large "OBAMA '08" banners as your sig..
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PeeWeeDan
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#257
Oh god. I have limits you know! :p:
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ssk2
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When asked in April about reversing his support for a federal home-mortgage bailout, he [McCain] reached for a sheet of talking points.

Wow... using notes! Shocking...

don’t believe we’re headed into a recession
Define 'recession'. There are many levels of it and I too do not believe that we're heading for a MAJOR recession.
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Made in the USA
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(Original post by s.e.r.e.n.e)
McCain doesn't know about the economy.

When asked in April about reversing his support for a federal home-mortgage bailout, he [McCain] reached for a sheet of talking points. :rofl: By contrast, Romney has a master's of business administration from Harvard University, ran the 2002 Salt Lake City Olympics, and made a vast fortune as co-founder of the Boston-based private-equity firm Bain Capital LLC.

McCain, 71, said in December that he doesn't understand economics "as well as I should'' :rofl: and his lack of comfort is apparent on the stump.

source: Bloomberg
--------------
At that debate, McCain said:

“I don’t believe we’re headed into a recession,” :rofl: he said, “I believe the fundamentals of this economy are strong and I believe they will remain strong.” :rofl:

In the course of seven days, McCain appears to have reversed course, offering his own stimulus package:

“The fact is we have some tough times ahead,” McCain told supporters in Columbia. But he said the U.S. economy will rebound. “We will get through this rough patch,” he said.
And Obama knows about the economy? He has some of the most idiotic proposals I've ever heard. He plans on legislating a 60 percent tax bracket for upper-income Americans, which would kill all initiative and innovation. He wants to double the dividend tax, which would destroy the lives of retired people trying to make it on a fixed income.
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Made in the USA
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(Original post by s.e.r.e.n.e)
“I don’t believe we’re headed into a recession,” :rofl: he said, “I believe the fundamentals of this economy are strong and I believe they will remain strong.” :rofl:
Serene, McCain isn't a fool for saying we aren't headed for a recession, unless you think some of the world's most famous and widely-respected economists are fools for saying the same thing. Do you know what a recession is? To save you the trouble of looking it up, a recession is defined to be a period of two quarters of negative GDP growth. This hasn't happened yet, and I don't see why you think it's stupid to suggest it may not happen. Many economists think it may not happen.

Edward Leamer received a B.A. degree in mathematics from Princeton University and a Ph.D. degree in economics and an M.A. degree in mathematics from the University of Michigan. He is a Research Associate of the National Bureau of Economic Research and a visiting scholar at the International Monetary Fund and the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System. I think I'll take his word over yours about what's going on with the US economy
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