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Original post by Fuego1
Smoking fair enough - although no where in the quran/sunnah does is say that smoking is forbidden.

drinking in EXCESSIVE amounts is harmful. however, minimal quantities of alcohol is relatively harmless and some studies suggest that minimal quantities of red wine can have health benefits. So if this is proven outright, does it mean science has trumped religion?

also, what's wrong with wearing clothing that reveals 's lot of skin' or an individuals figure. Do u look down on women who don't cover their hair Or wear a Burka?


My point is that there's nothing wrong with wearing modest clothing. I understand that it's a women's choice on what they want to wear and I definitely do not look down on people who don't cover their hair. I have manynon Muslim friends.
Drinking habits tend to build and become unhealthy.
How much of the Quran have you read?
Original post by Fuego1
you couldnt make this up! so based on a few cases, you've drawn the final conclusion that EVERY person who leaves islam does so coz they find unislamic cultures appealing. what about the people who find islam and the quran contradictory, backward and outdated?


I wasn't using these cases as a sample for everyone. Some people could feel pressured by their family and religion. If people find it contradictory, that's their opinion but I don't like it when they just say that the religion is wrong, it offends me as a Muslim.
Reply 62
Original post by JustStudy
My point is that there's nothing wrong with wearing modest clothing. I understand that it's a women's choice on what they want to wear and I definitely do not look down on people who don't cover their hair. I have manynon Muslim friends.
Drinking habits tend to build and become unhealthy.
How much of the Quran have you read?


once again, many people do know how to handle their drink, despite what the media says. one drink every month, heck, every two weeks won't harm you. minimal quantities of red wine can have health benefits. Why forbid something if it has potential health benefits?

why does the quran not explicitly say that smoking is haram yet alcohol is haram?
Original post by Plantagenet Crown
Yes, your point?

It sounded quite rude
Do you have a religion? Or a belief important to you? If I called it unpleasant without emphasising that it is my opinion, you or someone else may also object
Reply 64
Original post by JustStudy
I wasn't using these cases as a sample for everyone. Some people could feel pressured by their family and religion. If people find it contradictory, that's their opinion but I don't like it when they just say that the religion is wrong, it offends me as a Muslim.


You do not have a right to stop people from suggesting your religion is wrong and proving an opposing opinion, just because it upsets you. offence is subjective and you being offended is irrelevant.

being offended isn't an excuse to Shut down free speech and discussion
Original post by JustStudy
It sounded quite rude


And? We are not obliged to automatically respect beliefs.

Do you have a religion?


Nope.

Or a belief important to you? If I called it unpleasant without emphasising that it is my opinion, you or someone else may also object

No belief I hold is above criticism.
Reply 66
Original post by Fuego1
once again, many people do know how to handle their drink, despite what the media says. one drink every month, heck, every two weeks won't harm you. minimal quantities of red wine can have health benefits. Why forbid something if it has potential health benefits?

why does the quran not explicitly say that smoking is haram yet alcohol is haram?

Islam acknowledges there are some benefits to drinking alcohol in small amounts, but the reason why it's not allowed is because too much alcohol will blind your senses and may lead you to do irrational things. Yes, the majority don't have drinking issues, but 40% of people in A&E in hospital are there because of alcohol related issues, and there's plenty more in other wards, such as general surgery, where they have liver problems, psychiatry due to addiction. So alcohol does have very damaging effects if you look at the bigger picture.

There was a story of a man who was offered the opportunity to commit three deadly sins. He refused. Then he was offered alcohol and he accepted. In his drunken state, he went on to commit the 3 deadly sins he initially refused to do.

And you wouldn't expect the Quran to explicitly say smoking is haram, as cigarettes weren't invented back then.
(edited 4 years ago)
Original post by Fuego1
once again, many people do know how to handle their drink, despite what the media says. one drink every month, heck, every two weeks won't harm you. minimal quantities of red wine can have health benefits. Why forbid something if it has potential health benefits?

why does the quran not explicitly say that smoking is haram yet alcohol is haram?


I didn't know that it doesn't
radical idea: leave
Original post by Fuego1
You do not have a right to stop people from suggesting your religion is wrong and proving an opposing opinion, just because it upsets you. offence is subjective and you being offended is irrelevant.

being offended isn't an excuse to Shut down free speech and discussion


I'm debating not shutting you down I'm honestly interested in your opinion
Original post by Plantagenet Crown
No belief I hold is above criticism.


It's ok to criticize, but please be respectful of other people's beliefs
Reply 71
Original post by HGS345
Islam acknowledges there are some benefits to drinking alcohol in small amounts, but the reason why it's not allowed is because too much alcohol will blind your senses and may lead you to do irrational things. Yes, the majority don't have drinking issues, but 40% of people in A&E in hospital are there because of alcohol related issues, and there's plenty more in other wards, such as general surgery, where they have liver problems, psychiatry due to addiction. So alcohol does have very damaging effects if you look at the bigger picture.

There was a story of a man who was offered the opportunity to commit three deadly sins. He refused. Then he was offered alcohol and he accepted. In his drunken state, he went on to commit the 3 deadly sins he initially refused to do.


anecdotal experiences aren't a way to back up an entire religious ruling of making alcohol haram. Right, so islam does acknowledge that there's benefits to small quantities of alcohol (that's news to me)? So why make something outright haram and try and ban something if it has benefits - even it's smallest of quantities.

Too much salt can affect the liver but very small quantities of salt is important for your health - so why isn't salt haraam if too much of it can harm your health. Likewise, too much fast food can harm your health and cause other damaging effects such as obesity and a strain on the NHS. why isn't fast food haraam then?
Reply 72
Original post by JustStudy
I didn't know that it doesn't


does the quran/hadiths outright state that smoking is forbidden and haraam. yes or no?
Reply 73
Original post by JustStudy
It's ok to criticize, but please be respectful of other people's beliefs


respect is earnt, not demanded.
Reply 74
Original post by JustStudy
I'm debating not shutting you down I'm honestly interested in your opinion


I'm an ex muslim. Does that make my opinions on Islam any less valid and easy to dismiss?
Original post by Fuego1
I'm an ex muslim. Does that make my opinions on Islam any less valid and easy to dismiss?


no it makes it even more interesting.its nice hearing about your opinions. are you male or female? not that it matters
Original post by Fuego1
does the quran/hadiths outright state that smoking is forbidden and haraam. yes or no?


It may not say it outright but I know it's haram.
Reply 77
Original post by JustStudy
no it makes it even more interesting.its nice hearing about your opinions. are you male or female? not that it matters


male and I'm a young adult
Reply 78
I also want to say that please don’t interpret any religion from people who think themselves as perfect believers but people are not flawless and they might make you sometimes alienate even from your religion:’)

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