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Poor SMC Result - chances gone?
Hi guys,
I was really gunning for Oxbridge (specifically, Trinity College in Cambridge) for a maths degree since I got my GCSE results (all A*s, 'cept english lang, A). I did my GCSEs abroad, and came to the UK only a coupla months ago. When I came here, I learnt about the BMO and SMC, and I was really fancying my chances of getting as far as Round 2 of the BMO, especially since I find maths interesting and have read quite a few books around the subject.
Unfortunately, I did pretty disastrously in the SMC, and got a score of 70. I'm not even sure thats enough for a bronze certificate. I really don't have much of a valid excuse, such as being ill - the reason I feel I did less than my best was because I gravitated towards the harder final questions, which seemed more interesting.
Anyway, in a roundabout way, here's my main question: how badly will my SMC score affect my chances of entry? I'm guessing I probably won't get into a college as pretigious as Trinity now, but how about others?
For info, I've been studying in state schools all my life, but since I came here I've been going to an independent selective school.
Oh yeah, and just in case someone comes up and says '70 is fine' - it seriously feels like a failure for me, and I seriously doubt Oxbridge will see it as fine.
I was really gunning for Oxbridge (specifically, Trinity College in Cambridge) for a maths degree since I got my GCSE results (all A*s, 'cept english lang, A). I did my GCSEs abroad, and came to the UK only a coupla months ago. When I came here, I learnt about the BMO and SMC, and I was really fancying my chances of getting as far as Round 2 of the BMO, especially since I find maths interesting and have read quite a few books around the subject.
Unfortunately, I did pretty disastrously in the SMC, and got a score of 70. I'm not even sure thats enough for a bronze certificate. I really don't have much of a valid excuse, such as being ill - the reason I feel I did less than my best was because I gravitated towards the harder final questions, which seemed more interesting.
Anyway, in a roundabout way, here's my main question: how badly will my SMC score affect my chances of entry? I'm guessing I probably won't get into a college as pretigious as Trinity now, but how about others?
For info, I've been studying in state schools all my life, but since I came here I've been going to an independent selective school.
Oh yeah, and just in case someone comes up and says '70 is fine' - it seriously feels like a failure for me, and I seriously doubt Oxbridge will see it as fine.
Scroll to see replies
it won't make any difference, they're really not interest in SMC results.
Spy_Lord
Hi guys,
I was really gunning for Oxbridge (specifically, Trinity College in Cambridge) for a maths degree since I got my GCSE results (all A*s, 'cept english lang, A). I did my GCSEs abroad, and came to the UK only a coupla months ago. When I came here, I learnt about the BMO and SMC, and I was really fancying my chances of getting as far as Round 2 of the BMO, especially since I find maths interesting and have read quite a few books around the subject.
Unfortunately, I did pretty disastrously in the SMC, and got a score of 70. I'm not even sure thats enough for a bronze certificate. I really don't have much of a valid excuse, such as being ill - the reason I feel I did less than my best was because I gravitated towards the harder final questions, which seemed more interesting.
Anyway, in a roundabout way, here's my main question: how badly will my SMC score affect my chances of entry? I'm guessing I probably won't get into a college as pretigious as Trinity now, but how about others?
For info, I've been studying in state schools all my life, but since I came here I've been going to an independent selective school.
I was really gunning for Oxbridge (specifically, Trinity College in Cambridge) for a maths degree since I got my GCSE results (all A*s, 'cept english lang, A). I did my GCSEs abroad, and came to the UK only a coupla months ago. When I came here, I learnt about the BMO and SMC, and I was really fancying my chances of getting as far as Round 2 of the BMO, especially since I find maths interesting and have read quite a few books around the subject.
Unfortunately, I did pretty disastrously in the SMC, and got a score of 70. I'm not even sure thats enough for a bronze certificate. I really don't have much of a valid excuse, such as being ill - the reason I feel I did less than my best was because I gravitated towards the harder final questions, which seemed more interesting.
Anyway, in a roundabout way, here's my main question: how badly will my SMC score affect my chances of entry? I'm guessing I probably won't get into a college as pretigious as Trinity now, but how about others?
For info, I've been studying in state schools all my life, but since I came here I've been going to an independent selective school.
WTF its only the a maths challenge, as far as my school goes the SMC counts for jack and doesn't even go towards uni applications.
SMC is IMHO fun but not really worth much as the time you are given for it does not show how good you are at maths but rather if you can think quickly. a lot of the questions have very easy ways to do them but it is alot about wether you notice them or not! so i wouldn't worry at all, i dont even see how they would know about them!
P.S. best of luck with trinity...very prestigiuous!
P.S. best of luck with trinity...very prestigiuous!
Thanks for the replies so far.
Most people seem to be saying I don't even need to mention it, or I should just say I was ill or something. That's great! I was under the impression that they knew about your score, regardless of what you tell them, and that they'd grill me with admonishing questions. That makes my day, thanks people.
Maybe I'll get a shot at BMO next year . . its pretty cool regardless of uni application.
Most people seem to be saying I don't even need to mention it, or I should just say I was ill or something. That's great! I was under the impression that they knew about your score, regardless of what you tell them, and that they'd grill me with admonishing questions. That makes my day, thanks people.
Maybe I'll get a shot at BMO next year . . its pretty cool regardless of uni application.
I've applied for maths at Trinity this year, also from state schools. I assume you're in year 12 / 5th form? With some luck we might see each other there in a couple of years.
A few people in my maths class including myself were asked to do the intermediate challenge a few years ago and I quite enjoyed it, so I volunteered for the SMC last year, it wasn't advertised to us. To me it seemed like an informal and rather obscure if enjoyable test, and although I mentioned it in my personal statement I didn't (until this thread) expect Oxbridge to even have heard of it. I certainly still don't expect them to put any weight on it, the interview and their own exam will tell them far more about your ability than an exam you could have taken at any time with any level of help.
I hadn't heard of the BMO, but Cambridge makes hundreds of offers to maths students each year (around 40 to Trinity, if memory serves), and apparantly only ~100 people in the country get past the first round of the BMO, so you'll be in the same position as the vast majority of applicants in that respect.
As for the choice of college, if your ambition is Trinity apply there, all the advice I've been given tells me your chances of getting into the university aren't affected by your choice, you'll be pooled if you're rejected by Trinity and are good enough for another college. I wasn't under the impression that the differences in acceptance standards were huge anyway.
Just don't mention the SMC if you're not happy with it, I don't think they'll expect you to have taken it anyway. Privacy laws stop them from knowing anything you don't choose to tell them and the SMC isnt something they ask for (unlike AS results, etc). Your chances certainly aren't gone if they're even affected for any college in my opinion.
If you're looking for something to prove your mathematical worth to them, try the AEA or STEP, they're about as challenging and better known than the SMC.
A few people in my maths class including myself were asked to do the intermediate challenge a few years ago and I quite enjoyed it, so I volunteered for the SMC last year, it wasn't advertised to us. To me it seemed like an informal and rather obscure if enjoyable test, and although I mentioned it in my personal statement I didn't (until this thread) expect Oxbridge to even have heard of it. I certainly still don't expect them to put any weight on it, the interview and their own exam will tell them far more about your ability than an exam you could have taken at any time with any level of help.
I hadn't heard of the BMO, but Cambridge makes hundreds of offers to maths students each year (around 40 to Trinity, if memory serves), and apparantly only ~100 people in the country get past the first round of the BMO, so you'll be in the same position as the vast majority of applicants in that respect.
As for the choice of college, if your ambition is Trinity apply there, all the advice I've been given tells me your chances of getting into the university aren't affected by your choice, you'll be pooled if you're rejected by Trinity and are good enough for another college. I wasn't under the impression that the differences in acceptance standards were huge anyway.
Just don't mention the SMC if you're not happy with it, I don't think they'll expect you to have taken it anyway. Privacy laws stop them from knowing anything you don't choose to tell them and the SMC isnt something they ask for (unlike AS results, etc). Your chances certainly aren't gone if they're even affected for any college in my opinion.
If you're looking for something to prove your mathematical worth to them, try the AEA or STEP, they're about as challenging and better known than the SMC.
Robert602
I've applied for maths at Trinity this year, also from state schools. I assume you're in year 12 / 5th form? With some luck we might see each other there in a couple of years.
A few people in my maths class including myself were asked to do the intermediate challenge a few years ago and I quite enjoyed it, so I volunteered for the SMC last year, it wasn't advertised to us. To me it seemed like an informal and rather obscure if enjoyable test, and although I mentioned it in my personal statement I didn't (until this thread) expect Oxbridge to even have heard of it. I certainly still don't expect them to put any weight on it, the interview and their own exam will tell them far more about your ability than an exam you could have taken at any time with any level of help.
I hadn't heard of the BMO, but Cambridge makes hundreds of offers to maths students each year (around 40 to Trinity, if memory serves), and apparantly only ~100 people in the country get past the first round of the BMO, so you'll be in the same position as the vast majority of applicants in that respect.
As for the choice of college, if your ambition is Trinity apply there, all the advice I've been given tells me your chances of getting into the university aren't affected by your choice, you'll be pooled if you're rejected by Trinity and are good enough for another college. I wasn't under the impression that the differences in acceptance standards were huge anyway.
Just don't mention the SMC if you're not happy with it, I don't think they'll expect you to have taken it anyway. Privacy laws stop them from knowing anything you don't choose to tell them and the SMC isnt something they ask for (unlike AS results, etc). Your chances certainly aren't gone if they're even affected for any college in my opinion.
If you're looking for something to prove your mathematical worth to them, try the AEA or STEP, they're about as challenging and better known than the SMC.
A few people in my maths class including myself were asked to do the intermediate challenge a few years ago and I quite enjoyed it, so I volunteered for the SMC last year, it wasn't advertised to us. To me it seemed like an informal and rather obscure if enjoyable test, and although I mentioned it in my personal statement I didn't (until this thread) expect Oxbridge to even have heard of it. I certainly still don't expect them to put any weight on it, the interview and their own exam will tell them far more about your ability than an exam you could have taken at any time with any level of help.
I hadn't heard of the BMO, but Cambridge makes hundreds of offers to maths students each year (around 40 to Trinity, if memory serves), and apparantly only ~100 people in the country get past the first round of the BMO, so you'll be in the same position as the vast majority of applicants in that respect.
As for the choice of college, if your ambition is Trinity apply there, all the advice I've been given tells me your chances of getting into the university aren't affected by your choice, you'll be pooled if you're rejected by Trinity and are good enough for another college. I wasn't under the impression that the differences in acceptance standards were huge anyway.
Just don't mention the SMC if you're not happy with it, I don't think they'll expect you to have taken it anyway. Privacy laws stop them from knowing anything you don't choose to tell them and the SMC isnt something they ask for (unlike AS results, etc). Your chances certainly aren't gone if they're even affected for any college in my opinion.
If you're looking for something to prove your mathematical worth to them, try the AEA or STEP, they're about as challenging and better known than the SMC.
As a side-note, Trinity is famous for attracting all those students who actually pass the various rounds of the Maths Challenges and the BMO, and I think it boasts the entire IMO team for the UK, or as near as...
~Raphael~
As a side-note, Trinity is famous for attracting all those students who actually pass the various rounds of the Maths Challenges and the BMO, and I think it boasts the entire IMO team for the UK, or as near as...
As a side-note, Trinity is famous for attracting all those students who actually pass the various rounds of the Maths Challenges and the BMO, and I think it boasts the entire IMO team for the UK, or as near as...
There's always the pool.
Good Lord, I thought I'd heard every possible needless worry already, but this one takes the biscuit 
The Maths Challenge is not a qualification, or indeed official in any way. It is a bit of fun. There is no space for it on the UCAS form - save for on the personal statement - which should tell you something. It is completely and utterly, 100% irrelevant. 100%. I mean that. Forget about it.
The Maths Challenge is not a qualification, or indeed official in any way. It is a bit of fun. There is no space for it on the UCAS form - save for on the personal statement - which should tell you something. It is completely and utterly, 100% irrelevant. 100%. I mean that. Forget about it.Just shut up and if anyone even mentions it, say,
"Maths challenge? What Maths challenge?"
"Maths challenge? What Maths challenge?"
They are irrelevant because they're not proper tests of ability. Basically, they're far far too easy, and their format is just too different to the sort of stuff you'll be doing at Cambridge to be indicative of potential. At my school people who did relatively badly on SMC often did much better on STEP papers and the like; Cambridge cares about the latter, not the former.
Having said that, if you can't do SMC, I'd suggest Trinity is not for you. I could get golds on those things with my eyes shut and there'd've simply been no point in me applying for Trinity as I could never get the requisite STEP grades. If you had an off day which led you to doing badly that's not a problem, no one cares about them because they're just a bit of fun. But if 70 on the SMC really is indicative of your ability, you better hopes things improve real fast, and that means a lot of hard work on your part. If I'm being frank here, you have a lot of work on your hands either way. 70 is pretty low even for an off day...
Not trying to put you down. If you're keen on Oxbridge, it's worth trying for it, and your GCSE's certainly suggest you have ability. Just that you don't seem that experienced in Mathematics (SMC is a lot to do with experience - I had loads, which is why I found them easy), so you'll need to do as much extra-curricular work as possible to get that vital experience.
Having said that, if you can't do SMC, I'd suggest Trinity is not for you. I could get golds on those things with my eyes shut and there'd've simply been no point in me applying for Trinity as I could never get the requisite STEP grades. If you had an off day which led you to doing badly that's not a problem, no one cares about them because they're just a bit of fun. But if 70 on the SMC really is indicative of your ability, you better hopes things improve real fast, and that means a lot of hard work on your part. If I'm being frank here, you have a lot of work on your hands either way. 70 is pretty low even for an off day...
Not trying to put you down. If you're keen on Oxbridge, it's worth trying for it, and your GCSE's certainly suggest you have ability. Just that you don't seem that experienced in Mathematics (SMC is a lot to do with experience - I had loads, which is why I found them easy), so you'll need to do as much extra-curricular work as possible to get that vital experience.
Invisible
How can you say that when people who did well in it mention it on their PS?
Because not everyone gets to do it at all, so admissions tutors are quite used to excellent candidates not mentioning it. I suppose if you do well it's evidence in your favour, so I'll amend my earlier statement: 99% irrelevant.
ThePants999
Good Lord, I thought I'd heard every possible needless worry already, but this one takes the biscuit The Maths Challenge is not a qualification, or indeed official in any way. It is a bit of fun. There is no space for it on the UCAS form - save for on the personal statement - which should tell you something. It is completely and utterly, 100% irrelevant. 100%. I mean that. Forget about it.
The Maths Challenge is not a qualification, or indeed official in any way. It is a bit of fun. There is no space for it on the UCAS form - save for on the personal statement - which should tell you something. It is completely and utterly, 100% irrelevant. 100%. I mean that. Forget about it.Apart from for that bloke in the UK IMO team who didn't have to do STEP or anything
Basically, as other posts indicate, it doesn't count for anything except: if you do well, certainly put it on your UCAS form somewhere; if you do badly, you might want to re-think applying to the college (Trinity) most famously associated with maths...
~Raphael~
As a side-note, Trinity is famous for attracting all those students who actually pass the various rounds of the Maths Challenges and the BMO, and I think it boasts the entire IMO team for the UK, or as near as...
Okay. Do you think that has anything to do with the fact that they invite the top 20 mathematicians in the country too Trinity for a few days in the Easter holidays? Hmmmm... let me think.
BazTheMoney
Okay. Do you think that has anything to do with the fact that they invite the top 20 mathematicians in the country too Trinity for a few days in the Easter holidays? Hmmmm... let me think.
Absolutely
I just think that the fact that they are all at Trinity is rather intimidating when considering it for maths! What are you getting at 
well, say if said event was held at St John's, do you think the majority of the IMO team would go their instead?
BazTheMoney
well, say if said event was held at St John's, do you think the majority of the IMO team would go their instead?
Ahhh ok sorry; yup they probably would be attracted, but I thought Trinity had this 'rep' 'cause it has loads of maths places and lots of tutors as well and they get the best maths results as well?
Good Lord, I thought I'd heard every possible needless worry already, but this one takes the biscuit
Yeah ok ok, I was hopelessly confused and paranoid, I admit it.
I can see why it would appear hilarious to you guys, but I thought SMC scores were public knowledge . .70 is pretty low even for an off day...
Not trying to put you down. If you're keen on Oxbridge, it's worth trying for it, and your GCSE's certainly suggest you have ability. Just that you don't seem that experienced in Mathematics (SMC is a lot to do with experience - I had loads, which is why I found them easy), so you'll need to do as much extra-curricular work as possible to get that vital experience.
Not trying to put you down. If you're keen on Oxbridge, it's worth trying for it, and your GCSE's certainly suggest you have ability. Just that you don't seem that experienced in Mathematics (SMC is a lot to do with experience - I had loads, which is why I found them easy), so you'll need to do as much extra-curricular work as possible to get that vital experience.
I totally agree with you. I though I was pretty good at maths, since I not only did my GCSE in one year in Year 10, but also in Year 11 did an Additional Maths IGCSE course, which is (I think) most of P1, P2, and P3 (now C1, C2, C3, C4), a little S1 and a little M2 (real weird mix of stuff). I was the only one in my school who actually got the top grade in that exam as well. Only 3 lessons a week, too, so I was pretty happy.
Then again, the result may cause me to do a little soul-searching. I mean, I was doing some practice BMOs (my school actually offered a voluntary half-break a week where they give out past papers, and give answers sometimes), and I did fairly OK, I could get about 2-3 answers per paper pretty much totally right without aid. I never even bothered looking at an SMC paper, and as you say, experience counts for a lot. People in my school who did better (a lot better) have done like the intermediate challenge, etc. So mweh . . a little confused and disappointed, but not the end of the world
.As for the choice of college, if your ambition is Trinity apply there, all the advice I've been given tells me your chances of getting into the university aren't affected by your choice, you'll be pooled if you're rejected by Trinity and are good enough for another college. I wasn't under the impression that the differences in acceptance standards were huge anyway.
Yeah, I'll see how I do this year, still plenty of time to go. If its all good, I think I'll apply anyway because of the pooling. Good luck with your own application!
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